Tjiani
Tjiani
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@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352391#Comment_3352391
I wouldn't try to explain it burt0r I think responded to Op at least once with the explanation of what "Holding Hostage" was and was ignored....OP will just call Camping and Tunneling what they want to.
Lmao.. I know that the "official" understanding of the phrase "taking the game hostage" means to prevent the game from progressing. Facecamping IS actually the "real" definition of a hostage. You have no options, no counterplay and therefore I think counterplay should be added if this is a "legit" strategy. I don't understand why you guys are so butthurt about it. If the Survivors could "Stun" the killer all game and they could do absolutely nothing, not even move until the match was over imagine the crying and drama on here. It's only "Acceptable" because 80% of people on here are entitled killer mains who consider survivors nothing but bots with no actual right to having fun in the game.
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@burt0r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352350#Comment_3352350
You still Got options don’t you? In the lobby you see what items the survivors bring in and Can make a plan accordingly. Lots or flashlights -lightborn. Lots of toolboxes - gen perks. You have the option to make a plan before you even go into the game.
You decide which survivors you want to chase, for How Long. Are you going to put pressure on gens, are you going to make a 3-gen strategy… even in the shittiest games, you still get a decent amount of BP for chases, kicking gens, slugging ect.. even with no kills
I love how you downplay or straight up ignore all the frustration/stress of playing killer playing like "being the fat kid in tag" getting denied at every pallet, window or due to perks when playing casual.
I don't deny that killer can be hard at times. I am saying you can't compare the "having no options at all" to actually being able to do stuff and change playstyle throughout the game? You guys are compairing being facecamped all match, to sweating against SWFs and no I don't think it's comparable.. It's nowhere near the same. You can still choose to give up a chase, go for someone else, do something else. If you are facecamped, farmed by your teammates, sandbagged ect you got no options at all..
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@itwaslagiswear said:
I find it hilarious how angry survivors get at killers who camp and tunnel. When I first started playing the game it made the most sense strategically to target survs with more hooks on them. If I got a quick down before the first gen popped I would camp that hook to get them to a second hook stage since I had time to spare (depending on killer). The end game I got grief for camping when its literally our only option with 3-4 alive when the gate is opened. Its survs like this that have led to un-fun changes like base kit BT that ruined the game.
This is a typical killer main response. Completely overlooking their own level of toxicity in the game and blaming the survivors for every bad thing that ever happened to this game. Killers sit in here and cry about Eruption, genrush, flashlight saves, DH, SWF swat teams and what not, but when they people that actually still fight to keep Solo in the game try to adress an issue, they just get attacked and belitttled for their opinion. People start to hardcore tunnel and camp already at 5 gens in most games, so it's not about being pressured or being the "only"" option. It's because it's the easiest and most convinient option for killers. They get to do the bare minimum, earn good BP for it and then too bad for the first survivor being caught I guess..
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@Emeal said:
The Killer is supposed to be a threat and through gameplay mistakes the Killer can absolutely destroy you alone.
You are playing the game when you get tunneled and destroyed, You are experiencing what happens in a Horror movie.
Losing in a Video Game is not, Not playing it.
The game is supposed to be pretty balanced. It’s not a killer should win almost every match kind of game. There should still be a 40-50 % chance of you at least making it to the end-game, but Solo is nowhere near that balance. If survivors should just accept not doing ######### the entire match and be eliminated within minutes, you might as well play against bots and remove the survivor option.
Survivors also play to have fun and earn BP, but as it is right Now, solo doesn’t provide options to make it worth it compared to what SWF can do. You can only stay alive for so long If you get farmed off the hook, sandbagged or if your team throws the game after a minute.
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@sulaiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3351904#Comment_3351904
Well, i feel the same, because i just played several killer games full of flashlights and sabo-squads, where i could down people, but never hook them. Do you consider that to be toxic and being prevented from playing the game, too? Because i do.
You still Got options don’t you? In the lobby you see what items the survivors bring in and Can make a plan accordingly. Lots or flashlights -lightborn. Lots of toolboxes - gen perks. You have the option to make a plan before you even go into the game.
You decide which survivors you want to chase, for How Long. Are you going to put pressure on gens, are you going to make a 3-gen strategy… even in the shittiest games, you still get a decent amount of BP for chases, kicking gens, slugging ect.. even with no kills
If you are facecamped you have absolutely zero actual options. You are wasting an entire match doing nothing, because the killer chose this “strategy” and you Can either DC and get zero points, try to kobe (most likely die) and get zero points or stay on the hook and buy your teammates time (still die) and get a ridiculous amount of BP for your trouble. Same with tunneling. If your teammates are sandbagging you, unhooking you in front of the killer ect you don’t have any perks to actually counter it. Killers have the option of countering everything the survivors bring into the game, and even have perks to stalling the end-game. Survivors doesn’t have ######### to counter tunneling or facecamping… absolutely nothing after DS Got nerfed to the Ground
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@SunsetSherbet said:
Just out of curiosity do survivors feel that playing video games like fighting games or Batlle royales also are "not playing the game"? Bad players in fighting games can get basically killed in two hits by a great player, and never get an offensive attack off. Battle royales, well...SOMEONE has to be the first guy killed. He didn't get to play. Clearly fortnite needs protection so I cannot die early on! Also, you did play. If you got hooked then you played, because a chase started. If you went down so fast you feel you "didn't get to play" then that is genuinely just you not being good and wanting training wheels to ensure you continue playing regardless of skill. Otherwise, you looped the killer and ran from them, which is gameplay. It's no one elses fault if you went down in 2 seconds because you tried to hide against Doc or something
You Cannot compare the two things. Because in games like that you are equally strong. You are both armed, you both have the same chance of being the first person to shoot. In DBD SWF and killers are more or less equally strong, and then you have solo which is a whole different league. You never know what kind of teammates you get. If you have a teammate unhooking you with the killer right next to you, what Can you do? Can you refuse to be unhooked? No… Can you get anywhere if the killer chooses to tunnel and there are no loops nearby? No.. you don’t even have the option to bring in perks to prevent any of the above from happening. If you buy a shooting game, you know the gameplay is just to nuke the other People as fast as possible. There are no objectives other than that. Survivors actually need to do quite a lot to get a decent amount of BP and solo is just nowhere near worth playing compared to killer or SWF.
If you go play SWF, you get to do gens, loop, unhook, heal, set boons ect. You Can have a Long match cause you know your teammates are gonna be somewhat decent and help you out when needed. What does solo have to offer in compare? Honestly? Why would anyone group up with a team of randoms who Will most likely be dead within minutes, or try to get you killed to save their own arse. Can you honestly mention just one decent antitunneling or anticamping perk that would be useful for a person to protect themselves in solo?
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@Nazzzak said:
My first killer today was camping and tunnelling, so I get it. You sit down in the evening to play a game and that first one kind of sets your mood. My second game though was a 2 hook Nurse (basically a killer confident enough not to tunnel or camp, who will 2 hook everyone before the sacrificing starts) so you kind of just take the good with the bad. One of the players was even afk for the first part of the game, and the nurse left them alone when she realised, only going after them once they came back. As with any online game, it's a mixed bag of who you get matched with. You'll definitely have better outcomes in a swf.
The problem is that the state the game is in right now, it’s more bad than good games and it has been for a while now. Like I Said in my original post, I don’t know how bad it is on the American servers, but the EU servers are really bad with almost every other game being a tunneler or a camper. Solo is just not strong enough to counter it, as survivors playing alone don’t have strong enough perks to protect themselves. If you find yourself with unexperienced or farming/sandbagging teammates, you lack options to keep yourself safe and alive longer. Solo lack options of Security that every SWF team has.
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@Tostapane said:
play killer then so you won't have those troubles
I do. But my entire post was an attempt to save solo survivor. If we all just play killer or go SWF it won’t fix the issue, just make it worse
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@burt0r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352114#Comment_3352114
NO ONE said FACECAMPING isn't preventing you from playing, they said TUNNELING isn't.
Don't twist the truth for your agenda.
A lot of Them say that neither are preventing me from playing the game? I am not twisting anything, read the comments, lmao.
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@CECIO said:
Try perks such as decisive, Off the record and Adrenaline.
If it doesnt work, just git gud
None of the perks you are mentioning are helping specifically against camping or tunneling? Besides from DS, which is useless now with only a 3 second stun.
I give up on this Forum. I came on here to adress a serious balance issue with Solo versus SWF and to tell my side of why I and many others choose switch to killer or find a SWF group instead of staying in solo. Nowhere do I ask for killers to be nerfed or for killer perks to be removed, and yet I keep getting attacked for my post. People are only looking for “things not adding up” in my post, questioning my rank, my skills ect when even really experienced and skilled DBD streamers are giving up on Solo and play more SWF and survive with viewers. But apparently it’s just me.. None of you are actually able to come up with anything besides from “Git Gud”, “don’t get caught first or “live with it”, which doesn’t really fix anything in the Long run. I kind of understand the State the game is in, considering How toxic and indifferent it’s community is. Everytime someone on the Forum tries to speak up about an issue, this is what they are met with.
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If everyone was just hiding in a locker until someone Else Got found, nothing would ever get done. It’s not really a counter. Against a strong killer who knows what they are doing, everyone Will go Down at Some point. It’s enevitable. Especially against killers like nurse, Huntress and Blight. And it still doesn’t solve the issue with Solo… cause facecamped solo survivors have absolutely no reason to stay in the match… most of Them Will either try to Kobe or DC and the remaining survivors are doomed.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352096#Comment_3352096
So your issue isn't killers but team mates?
It’s both. I still Think Facecamping and tunneling should be less beneficial for the killer to do. I still Think it ruins the game. You are all saying that facecamping is not preventing the hooked survivor from playing the game, but none of you Can come up with actual counterplay or options for the person hooked the entire match.
Tunneling is not too bad if you are in a SWF but waay too strong when dealing with solo survivors because they are never guaranteed a helping hand from their teammates, often quite the opposite. Being unhooked right in front of the killer, gives you what options to survive? DS 3 second stun or a DH easy to wait out? People sandbagging, noone willing to take a hit ect. There is only so much you can do when you are on your own. If solo survivor is gonna survive, it needs to be balanced more and I Think this is a Way to do it. People need to feel that they can protect themselves and right now there are no perks strong enough to balance solo.
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@MrPeanutbutter said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352009#Comment_3352009
So…you get immediately camped/tunneled out of every match and somehow you’re able to pip up consistently enough to get to “red ranks” every month? Something isn’t adding up here…
I didn’t say I was the one getting tunneled out first each game? But as a solo player, random teammates doesn’t always know How to loop. You never know what you are gonna get or what level or skill your random teammates have. If the first player is tunneled out before you are done with the first gen, you know as Well as I How the rest of the game is gonna go. One survivor Can not carry an entire team, and it’s more often than not the case with solo. I wouldn’t mind being facecamped as much, if I at least knew my teammates were doing gens.. but watching Them all Crouch around like headless chickens is just so frustrating. Solo has a huge disadvantage because you can’t rely on People to help you, but you also don’t have any perks to help yourself much. You can’t use reassurance on yourself while hooked, you can’t prevent teammates from unhooking you right in front of the killer and have nothing to counter it with. Solo need more perk options to protect one-self, and I honestly don’t Think anyone on here disagrees with this?
Solo doesn’t have anything at all even close to what SWF Can offer. And the biggest issue with Solo is the lack of options to protect yourself from careless teammates. And I actually do Think that creating perks that seems redundant to SWF but useful to Solo survivors would buff solo quite a bit. Not to where it should be, but at least enough to make more People consider it an option.
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@HaunterofShadows said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352051#Comment_3352051
Oh boy. Please don't tell me you think the Dbd playerbase is actually capable of that.
I guess not. I Think I am a very atypical DBD player 🤷🏼♀️ No matter what side I play I try to play fair. I had a new Wraith the other day, and mid-game he cloaked up and went to the corner to wait it out and be over with it. I went over to him and gave him a hook, tried to be kind.. and then 2 of my randoms comes over and start to bully the poor guy who hadn’t had a single hook the entire match. He was clearly sad and struggling and I felt so bad for him. My bet is he brought his worst into the next match or gave up and logged off. And the devs Will never be able to fix this, cause it’s an attitude problem and no amount of perks in the world can fix the toxicity in this comnunity. But we can’t all just be like “might as Well be toxic like everyone Else” cause then it’s for sure not getting any better. But increasing amount of SWF groups is definately not gonna make things better… so if we could find a Way to keep solo in the game, it would be a huge difference
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352062#Comment_3352062
But that goes back around to: design a perk that counters tunnelling, isn't a free lifeline to do whatever to the point that if the rescuer can't be downed there's no pressure, and doesn't benefit the team by being used as a weapon.
I know it’s hard to balance these things without giving the survivors a Way to exploit it. But I Think DS just lasting longer would be okay. A 3 second stun is an absolute joke and gets you nowhere before the killer is able to catch up. I Think it should be 10 second ish, but as soon as you touch a gen or a totem the cooldown goes away. Makes it hard to exploit the perk, but gives the survivor enough time to make it to a loop and at least have a fair chance of escaping. If the killer really really wants to tunnel, they will still follow Them, but I Think more killers would go for someone Else if they had to wait out the longer cooldown. Most anti-tunneling/anticamping perks are dependent on your teammates using Them on you (like reassurance or BT) and it would just be nice to have something to counter in Solo where you can almost guarantee that your teammates almost never have any of those perks
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352051#Comment_3352051
The issue is going "they're tunnelling, so they're toxic." Facecamping Bubba that keeps hitting you on hook? That's toxic. Someone tunnelling out of the gate? That's just sweaty and trying to win.
Most people tunnelling aren't interested in giving you a bad time, they're just trying to win as hard as they can.
Survivors splitting up instantly and sitting on gens with no deviation until the Killer's right on them isn't toxic, it's efficient. The guy who teabags after every pallet drop or spams loud noise notifications is. It's the same deal.
As for "maybe wait and see first": the thing is, the game is snowbally. Playing chill and not tunnelling doesn't leave much time to start trying seriously if multiple gens pop immediately and you spread hooks--it's easier to defend fewer gens, but if the first ones go that quickly, there's no wiggle room. Forcing a delay is why things like Wesker's vial add-on or Corrupt Intervention are so good, because it gives that room.
That is exactly my point. I do see the difference in tunnelling and camping because you run out of options, or doing it because you enjoy being toxic and doing it before you even know what kind of team you are up against. I don’t think tunnelling in a pressured situation towards the end-game is toxic, but hardcore tunnelling someone before a single gen is popped is just unnecessary. I have often tried to take a hit from someone being tunnelled and the killer completely ignores me, even if I literally stand right in front of Them and offer myself in trade. They get a free hook, and yet they go for the person who was on the hook the entire match when there are still plenty of gens left. It would just be nice to have a perk to counter it. A bit more useful than DS, That’s all I am saying.
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@Hi_Im_Chucky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352037#Comment_3352037
Even in my shittiest Killer games ‘I’m still playing’!? Haha! I can twist logic just as simply as you, ready?
Oh man, I was held hostage by survivors again today. I’m so tired of being held hostage every other game. Unlike Survivors I can’t run so I’m just put on a walking simulator for the 3-4 mins in takes to do gens and I never even got to hit anybody! I walk after them in a house, they jump a window and disappear! I get to a loop and the drop a pallet and I go around and around and then try going the other direction and moon walking too. Nothing helps me catch up. Sometimes they drop a pallet but I know if I try to destroy it then my camera will look down and they will be gone immediately!
The whole time they keep popping gens and then they open the gates, everyone mocks me at the door with t-bags. How am I paying money for this? I never get to play the game. I just walk around the map and never get to play! I never get a hit, never get a down, just walk around the map and then they leave. I’m not playing a game, I’m being held hostage while everyone else gets to have a good time!
(that’s how silly you sound, I dunno how to be more clear~)
You still have options? You can still try to mindgame, still try to influence the game. What options do you have while hanging on the hook the entire match while the killer takes out months of frustration on your dangling body? You can DC or hang in there, that’s the options you got. Because someone else chose not to play the game and take the easiest route to BPs. The killer never runs out of options. You can’t be bodyblocked or captured in a corner the entire match so the fact that you are even comparing the two things 😂😂 you always have the option of chasing someone else, patrol gens, choose your own Strategy. But being facecamped is literally impossible to counter or even stall (if you are the one hooked)
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@GensByDaylight said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352021#Comment_3352021
Killers that are trying to consistantly win have to tunnel as they have no way to indentify a SWF before the match starts.
Don't blame the individual player who just wants to win, they aren't holding the game hostage or abusing any broken mechanics in any way. Blame BHVR who implements these mechanics and encourages you to use them if you want to win.
Killers do get more BP than solo q survivors, but its not their fault they don't care about how much of a meaningless in game currency you get. Again, blame BHVR for this.
Facecamping... is just dumb, its pretty rare in my experience and I agree that there should be a perk to hard counter it.
The killer is just another player who wants to win, if he plays in a way that isn't fun for you, it isn't his fault, its BHVR's fault for making that strategy very viable.
I am adressing BHVR and the devs in my post but as I mentioned earlier, I also Think players carry a Big part of the responsibility for things to get better. If everyone is just bringing in their worst toxic behaviour and don’t give a Damn about other players, it’s never gonna be fixed. We also carry a responsibility for what we pay forward. The toxic cycle never ends if we don’t start with what we actually can change. Why not give people the benefit of the doubt? Am I playing against a toxic person or am I being toxic for no reason… am I playing against a sweaty killer/SWF or can I slow things down a bit and relax? Am I playing against a new player that is clearly struggling and could I help them out? In a multiplayer game everyone carries a responsibility for the community it’s not just the devs. That being said, Solo is too weak compared to SWF and they need to come up with a way to make it worth playing compared to SWF
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@illNicola said:
The only option to fix tunneling, beside being good (for example like 1 hour ago I found a pinhead who tunneled me the whole match and got destroyed because he didn't get me and the others devoured gens), is balance the game. Gens fly at top MMR, tunneling and camping are needed since survs "tunnel gens" and killer must tunnel kills, why should I play for hooks if my objective is to kill? And why should I play for hooks when survs play to make gen fast af?
Tunneling is in both sides, but the "surv tunneling" is genrush. But genrush is ok, is "only playing efficiently", tunneling isn't ok but it's the same thing: playing efficiently. So Devs keep inserting perks to make gens faster, and gens are already fast af, and at the same time they're destroying every slowdown perk of the killer, how am I supposed to counter gen speed perks without slowdowns? So, if Devs doesn't want to balance their ######### game, killers will hard tunnel and camp because are the only tactics allowed. I know, it's unfair to be thrown out a match after like 2/3 minutes, but in that time already 2.5/3 gens are made.
I don’t Think slowing gens Down is an option as Long as Tunneling and camping is not adressed. People tunnel because a survivor out of the match within the first few minutes of the match is almost a guaranteed 3-4K. Imagine being facecamped and the gens going even slower, it would be impossible to more than one and a half gen pr hooked survivor. I agree the gens are going too fast, but a lot of killers tunnel and Camp no matter if they are pressured or not, so slowing Down gens is not enough to balance the game. Adding more objectives on both sides, rewarding more activity with more BP ect would be the best Way to balance things. It would be nice to have more things to do than just gens tbh
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@Hi_Im_Chucky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3352006#Comment_3352006
Yeah, it’s the only real logical answer but he stated twice that he gets red ranks every season, but then also stated he has a family and also works, so has limited time to play….
Anyway, the way you phrase your grievances is confusing because you’re using terms that indicate one thing and when the community tries to correct you, you get upset. You’re not being held hostage, you are, in fact, playing the game even if you get tunneled and camp.
If you have 5+ years under your belt then you should be mentally checked out from DbD logic or have quit by now. I’m not sure why your acting like the community hasn’t been voicing concerns with SWF and begging to buff Solo for years, but feel free, whenever you want a dose of reality, to use that search bar and look up the topic after topic after topic after topic addressing all this over and over again.
SWF is unfair - we know
Solo is weak - we know
BHVR needs to buff Solo to a similar strength to SWF - we know
Killers need to be buff strong enough to fight against Survivors after. - WE KNOW
Until this happens, any strong Killers decimate Solo and SWF destroys Killer. Solo will continue to be unhappy, Killers will continue to play hard to achieve any once of accomplishment and SWF will continue to bully Killers.
So if you want the best Survivor experience, then yeah, find a SWF. Or…start any number of the many suggestions that can be found to help your Solo exp. From changing your build, your playstyle, your mindset, your personal goals, or take a break or quit. BHVR and the community can’t snap our fingers and make the game better~
I don't get upset. I admit I think it's frustrating that I try to adress my issues with Solo (Same as all the other solo players trying to be heard) just to get told to stop playing, that my rank is too low, that I suck at the game or that I just need to "accept the reality". Or people just trying to belittle me, being rude or pick on my grammar which has nothing to do with the subject?
As much as solo players are complaining about their reality, killers are complaining about only going up against SWF groups, but right now it's the only alternative? It's not like I am the only one adressing the issue as you said yourself. Even really good streamers have given up on Solo.
I still consider it being "Held hostage" to dangle on a hook the entire match and get to do absolutely nothing? How is that not preventing people from playing the game?? Same with people tunneling, ignoring people right next to the unhooked survivor, just to eliminate them from the match before they have touched a gen? You have to admit that even in your shittiest killer games, you still get to play the game? To chase, to break pallets, to kick gens ect..
I play the amount of hours I can? Doesn't mean I don't play. I just don't have like 5+ hours pr day I can play. I play when my kids are tucked in, during weekends ect. But compared to the average gamer, no I don't play much.
Anyway, my point is that there needs to be a counter to tunneling/camping as Solo. You never know if your teammates are gonna help you or not, so there should at least be a perk or two to higher your chances of survival if you are totally on your own. Or at least just make the BP decent enough to make Solo worth the while?
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3351932#Comment_3351932
You seem reasonable.
Tunneling and camping are things your opponents are doing that you don't like. That is what their game function is. That is good.
Your team is doing things you don't like. That is the opposite of their game function. That is bad.
The only ways to resolve these issues that I can see are:
play SWF, which you already noted.
Request the developers implement a player to player match making ban, that is under each players control.
Petition Behavior to start a media program in and out of game that is aimed at showing survivors how to play.
None of those involve the killer, tunneling, or camping. Yelling at these things is a waste of time. At best the developers will do something stupid and make it worse.
Exactly my point. I know it's hard, but I really hope the devs would come up with some perks that would seem rather redundant to SWF teams, but make a huge difference if you are playing Solo. I don't think SWF teams would "waste" a perk slot on Anti-tunneling or anti-camping perks as much, cause they rely on eachother. They know someone else is there for the protection hit, they know someone else is gonna try and prevent them from going on death hook or switch places with them on hook if needed. There are so many perks way more usefull for SWF teams, so my hope was that it would balance SWF and Solo a little more.
Another idea could be to increase BP for "Switching hooks" or protection hits. I don't know if it would make more people do it or not, but I think it's worth a shot. I would hate to see Solo die completely, but I would lie if I said I don't understand why people give up on it :/
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@GensByDaylight said:
What did I just read?
If somehow preventing someone from playing the way they want is holding the game hostage than body blocking, genrushing, and looping is holding the game hostage...
If a killer tunnels you, you don't get the pleasure of holding M1 for 90+ seconds? You actually get to be in chase for most of the game, you just don't get to win.
If you hate getting tunneled so much, run OTR + DS and maybe Lucky Break + Lithe to help.
If a killer facecamps you, you have to wait for 2 minutes and you can move on to a different game. It sucks and should be penalized, but it isnt holding the game hostage.
Have you ever played killer? If you make a SWF salty(sorry to break it to you but they're not that rare) they can decide to hide in corners and actually hold the game hostage for an hour.
What it sounds like you're trying to say is that your an entitled survivor main and if you don't win the opposing team is "holding the game hostage". I reccomend you play a single player game, so you can call for the NPCs to be banned.
Are any of you actually reading my original post? Yes I do play killer and survivor pretty even and I have been playing more and more killer and less survivor over the last months. Even if I have a ######### game as killer and go against a really good team, I still get a decent amount of BP for chases, pallets, hooks ect. Even if I only get one or two kills. Even for the bare minimum as killer, you still get more as you do in a bad survivor match. Solo Survivor is just not worth it anymore compared to what you get for playing killer or SWF. And I think it's really sad more and more people are giving up on it. I used to enjoy Solo, but it's a nightmare and with the endless camping and tunneling (at least on the EU servers) Solo is just not balanced enough around it. I think survivors should at least have ONE decent anti-camping perk (they can actually use on themselves) and at the very least the old DS back with 6 seconds stun instead of 3. The 3 second stun is a joke, and it's pointless to even bring in at this point.
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Lmao.. I reach red rank every reset, so I fail to see why I would be in low MMR? Even really skilled DBD streamers with thousands of hours in the game are giving up on Solo and go for SWF or survive with viewers to stand a fair chance. Solo is almost dead, and everyone denying it are lying to themselves. Killer mains sit on this forum and cry about strong SWF teams every chance they get, but when Solo Survivors are trying to adress the issues that makes them avoid Solo, they get attacked and told they should stop playing, that they are just ######### at playing or they are low rank. You go play Solo if you think it's that much fun then?
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@RainehDaze said:
It's spelled queue.
That aside, tunnelling isn't preventing you from playing the game. As people have said again and again (when extolling the virtues of looping) for years, chases are supposedly the fun part of the game. Like, you're engaging in the game. Losing, yes, but engaging in it. Most hooks do not exist in giant dead zones from the start of the game, and the endurance effect has its speed boost.
And way too many people invite tunnelling by staying to heal under hook. Like, what? Why are you staying there?
Did you feel better about yourself correcting my spelling? English is not my first language, and I fail to see it has any relevance for my post?
And yes, it does prevent people from playing the game. If you have a hardcore tunneler and get caught first, you are out. With a pretty much useless DS, a DH that can be waited out as easily as nothing, there is only so much you can do against strong killers. If you don't have teammates willing to take hits for you (Which is rare in Solo) you are pretty #########. Same with camping. If noone on your team is willing to trade hooks with you, your entire match is wasted on hook, doing absolutely nothing. There are no strong anti-tunnel perks and I think there should be. Killers have lightborn to counter flashlights, Gen perks to counter gen-rush, anti healing perks to counter altruism.. But Survivors don't have anything equal to counter Tunneling or facecamping.
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@wydyadoit said:
your understanding of what this game is seems flawed. the game is not about completing generators as survivors and winning by escaping.
that isn't dead by daylight. i'm sorry that you were misinformed or that upon purchase of the product you thought you were entitled to a free escape. or at least a chance to do anything other than die repeatedly as a survivor.
the reality of dead by daylight is that you paid for the opportunity to connect to an online environment where the objective is to TRY to survive against a human controlled killer in an arena called a trial while 3 other players do the same.
if you're dying constantly then you're succeeding in participating in the game. if you're escaping then you're participating in the game. if you're doing anything at all that relates to objectives, chases, or surviving then you're playing the game - especially if you die.
refusing to participate in normal gameplay means you're exploiting a glitch/bug intentionally, afk, or working with the killer as a survivor.
face camping, slugging, and tunneling are strategies for eliminating players systematically one at a time. it's not effective and the choice to do so shows a killer's lack of skill, but it is not something that interferes with the trial.
my recommendation is that if you feel like you're not surviving long enough to have fun then how about trying out the killer role instead?
Well your understanding on how to debate in a civilized and respectul matter also seems kind of flawed, but oh well..
You clearly haven't read my original post, as I specifically wrote that I do play killer more and more often because it actually lets me play the game way more and provides me with more BP. Dead by daylight is a MULTIplayer game and is supposed to be balanced pretty even. You make it sound like the game was made for the killers to enjoy themselves and get a 4K almost every match and for the survivors to be grateful if they get to do anything during their matches.. It's supposed to be fun for both sides and chases are not everything there is to it. Survivors objectives are also healing, unhooking, doing gens, flashlight saves and much much more. Yes the chases are fun, but there are much more to the survivor role.
Where in my post do I write anything about escaping? I don't mention winning or losing at all, and seems to be more of your entitled concern than mine. I am simply adressing the fact that facecamping and tunneling prevents survivors from participating in the game that makes it worth their while. Especially in Solo Que. My entire post was to adress the fact that Solo Que is not strong enough to counter the tunneling/Camping issues, but you don't seem to have read anything I actually wrote
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@Brimp said:
Then this simply isn't the game for you which is a suggestion.
Saying someone else should just stop playing when they adress serious issues with the game, is just arrogant and narrowminded. If you don't have anything constructive to bring to the table, why comment at all?
So everyone should just accept that Solo Que is slowly dying and adapt to the new reality where hardcore SWF groups and sweaty killers are the only thing left in this game? If it reaches that point, maybe I will go play something else. But at least I am trying to adress the issues and actually keep Solo Que interesting enough for people to keep playing it. What are you bringing to the table?
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@Sonzaishinai said:
Tunneling is not preventing somebody from playing. You are playing, just cause you get eliminated quickly in the match if you go down fast doesn't mean you didn't get to play
Camping on the the other hand totally agree
How is tunneling not being prevented from playing? If you go down fast with Iri Hatches, A strong nurse or a Meyers, just to be tunneled right off hook? With the DS nerf it's almost impossible to escape the killer if a teammate is not willing to step in and take a hit or distract long enough for you to get away. The DS is useless with the 3 second stun
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@burt0r said:
Welcome to a pvp game that has itself slestablished for years and the general playerbase has found the most efficient ways to play.
I could say the same when playing rocket league or rainbow six siege.
I played both when they released, same as DBD, and in the beginning no one know how to play most efficiently and the game was way more relaxed.
Try to play rocket league without being somewhat proficient in aerials or try to approach the building in R6S without either being spawn killed or shot through 3 walls at an angle that pros found by breaking specific points in the map.
Same with DBD, in the beginning survivor were borderline brokenly strong but until the masses found the infinites killer were dominating just from basic gameplay.
There will always be the "perfect" way to play to win and thanks to YouTube, social Media and the internet itself, information like that spreads like wildfire.
As I said.. Killers complain about too many SWF groups, and want more people to play solo... BHVR wants more people to play Solo. But both Devs and killers ignore the biggest issue about Solo Que. It's not balanced enough compared to SWF with the "Strats" the killers are using.
If a killer facecamps a person in SWF the person will try to buy their teammate as much time as possible. Even if it means they don't get out. In most cases the other teammates will switch places with the hooked survivor and the chances are way higher of being saved during the end-game.
In Solo - people either DC or try to Kobe right away if they are being facecamped, so the killer can move straight on to the next person. They don't give a damn about the randoms they are dooming by leaving the match. If you get tunneled - too bad.. Noone will risk anything to save you from deathhook or take a hit if needed. If these are the new strats and everyone is starting to play killer like this, there won't be a solo que moving forward. If every other game is just being tunneled out, the options are either SWF or switching to killer.
Everyone in this game are too busy washing their hands.. "Other peoples fun is not my concern".. but it should be as you play a multiplayer game, and I think everyone (not just the devs) are responsible for creating a good game. But I do think the tunneling and Facecamping at least should compensate the survivor being denied to play enough points to make it worth it. If Solo Que is gonna survive, something has to happen to make it worth it for people, cause right now it aint it
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@Hi_Im_Chucky said:
You’re on a team as a survivor, your actions are team based and the result reflects the groups effort. If the camping is truly as you say, very early and actual face-camping…then the Killer should be sacrificing the game and taking a Loss, just to ensure a Kill. Why you keep being the chosen one is probably bad luck.
My theory is…since your time is very limited to play, that you are in low ranks. Low rank Killers, who are legit, are still at the stage where they only understand that
- Their job is to Kill other team.
- Leaving a hooked area risks not finding another survivor, not killing the survivor I caught, not being able to win.
- I should secure this Kill because Three survivors are easier to mange then Four.
It takes a certain level of confidence and understanding, that Killers have to build up with experience, plus getting punished for not adding pressure, before Killers naturally learn that you need to leave and patrol gens. The best case scenario being that you have 1 hook, 1 go save and 1 being chased, while last does gen, spreading pressure.
Sadly, at low levels, Killers are rewarded by weak survivors who struggle to understand that the hard counter to a face-camp is to do gens and 3 man escape. Instead they get caught up into figuring out how to lure Killer away or attempt a trade but usually fail because of hook grabs.
Your probably just the by-product of people learning the game, because the only other answer is that EU has a hard-on for ruining games lol.
Seriously, try staying stealthy and not being the first one found for awhile. Wait till someone else gets injured before you start a gen. Yeah, it’s not time efficient but you need a break from being first found and as a SoloQ you have a higher chance being abandoned. Just wait a minute for the game to kick-off without you and then you’ll probably have a better time in DbD.
I am not a new survivior... I have been playing DBD on and off for 5+ years, and I reach red ranks every single reset. The problem is that even in red ranks I still get potato survivors doing nothing all game (Cause matchmaking is not about rank anymore) . Solo que is too weak for the tunneling/Camping strat. SWF is the only way forward to counter it, and while BHVR is trying so hard to keep people playing Solo, I see absolutely no reason to play Solo with the way the game is "balanced" right now. Too many times I have been trying to buy my teammates as much time as possible, just to watch all 3 of them crouching around in the bushes doing absolutely nothing while I dangle on hook. Even the most experienced killers tunnel, because it's the fastest and easiest way to turn the game to your advantage from the beginning of the match.
I still fail to see why people should pay for a game they don't get to play, because someone elses "Strategy" is to deny them to do anything at all. Mention just one other game where one player can determine wether or not someone else gets to play at all ?? People pay for a service they don't get? The killer at least get to chase, destroy pallets, hit, slug ect. even in a bad match with no kills, they still get points for all of the above. Survivors gets absolutely nothing if the killer decides to be a douchebag. And for people with limited time to play, it's just not worth it as survivor compared to killer BP.
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It's still preventing someone else from playing the game. From doing nothing at all the entire match. And I fail to see why a person who WANTS to play the game, should pay the price for someone who decides to be toxic for no reason at all
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But post after post about genrushing, teabagging and all those swat SWF team you all run into all the time is just fine or?
You can’t compare clicking with a flashlight or teabagging at the exit gate to tunneling and camping.. tunnel and camping a survivor out of the match is a sure depip for the survivor that is targeted, but as a killer you don’t waste an entire match, waiting 10 minutes in que just to secure some scumbag a hell lot of blood points on your behalf while the only “reward” you get is a depip? You can do almost nothing as killer and still get more points than a survivor doing totems, saves and gens. A few chases and a kill or two and you are on your way.
I get that camping can be nessesary during end-game or if you have a hard time keeping up with gens, but 9 out of 10 matches the tunneling and camping begins with the very first survivor found, so it’s bullshit. Most killers do it because it’s easy, require no skill and gets rewarded by BHVR for some odd reason. Their reason for nerfing ruin back then was for “killers to improve their skills and not just rely on ruin” but apparently its fine to refuse to play the game and taking a survivor hostage until they die without giving Them a chance to play?
Had the pleasure of two tunneling rank 1 huntresses this evening with Iri hatches... the fact that this is still even a thing is beyond me. But noooo this game is definitely survivor sided 😂😂😂
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@Viktor1853 said:
then play killer
I am. Way better bloodpoints and less que times. But when I used to love playing survivor I think it's sad to see them completely nerf it beyond reason
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@IWasLeft2Die said:
Sounds like this isn't the game for you since you hate everything about the game.
I agree, it isn't for me anymore. I used to love playing DBD, was my favorite game for years. It's just sad that the experience is so terrible now, that I simply have to go play something else. I only play killer now if i play, but I hate to see them destroy solo survivor that was struggling enough as it was before the nerfs. I don't see why killers should be buffed towards SWF if they want more people to play alone
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I agree, but you will never get this forum to agree with you. 90% of people in here are killer mains. Everytime someone makes a post about this, they will classify it as "bait" 🙃 Facebook forums and twitter are more survivor sided than this forum
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I always loved Nurse! Really fun to go against. Sure a really good nurse is a super hard challenge, but I always enjoyed going up against them. I also like the trapper and Billyboy :)
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Well crying whiny killers got what they wanted I guess.. 🤷🏼♀️ Well.... Solo survivor is over for me, only going to play SWF and killer from now on. Good job BHVR, thanks for ruining the game completely. In a week this Forum will be overflooded with “Why are my killer ques so long” and SWF complaints 🤦♀️
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Yes the tunneling has definately gotten worse, and no we Don’t bring DS because it’s useless... you can use if ONE time, the killer will just eat the DS and slug you 3 seconds later anyway 🤷🏼♀️ Makes no difference, so why bring it. It’s literally one of the most useless perks now.
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We are just as tired of Toxic killers... I never play toxic as survivor, i don’t teabag or blind the killer (unless i have a challenge). I don’t do anything to provoke the killer, and yet I often get slashed repeadtly on hook.. slugged while the killer just follow me around waiting for me to bleed out. Tunneling and camping happening more often than not, not to mention killers carrying survivors to the hatch just to close it in their face. Toxicity is on both sides and killers are just as bad as survivors. This whole community is toxic and before We all start to work on it, nothing Will get better. Both survivors and killers carry their frustration from last game to the next and punish someone who had nothing to do with it 🤷🏼♀️
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This is why I stopped playing this game. I haven't been playing DBD for 6 months or so. Decided to give a shot again to see if things had improved. Played around 25 matches in a row, only 3 killers didn't tunnel, more than half brought a mori. This game is broken beyond compare. Killers get more bloodpoints for tunneling and camping 1 or 2 survivors, than 1 survivor does for doing almost every objective in the map.
I play solo survivor, as all of my friends has stopped playing DBD. We started out 8, I was the last to leave. Almost every ######### match, our team gets stomped 4-5 mins within the match. (Purple rank). Usually the killer will get around 25-30.00 and most survivors get around 7-15.000 points. The killer will tunnel the first person, mori him, do the same with the next person, and with 2 people left, you face a certain death and can only pray you find the hatch before the killer does. I really don't understand why you Behavior, reward this kind of playstyle. You won't get a penny more from me, that's for certain..
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Nice bait... It's so obivous you are just another killer-main pretending to be a survivor who suddenly woke up to see the light. First of all, If you really were playing survivor mostly, you would already have noticed this behaviour amongst your teammates. You would also know how terrible the survivor experience is right now if you are playing solo surv. Killer has never been easier than it is right now, and i see WAY more toxicity amongst killers than survivors (and yes I play both sides in purple rank)
Since the last archive came out I have desperately tried to complete the survivor quests, and I am at the point of giving up. Match after match I go against tunneling, camping killers bringing in moris, iri-hatches ect. It's a freaking nightmare and making solo survivor almost unplayable. Killers purposly trying to deny survivors any chance of getting points, just playing as scummy as ever and then whining about toxic survivors here on the forums, I just cant take it serious anymore.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1576003#Comment_1576003
While, sure, what I described is the survivors objective, it's the how.
When you look at how many of exactly that kind of survivor complain that, basically, the existence of killers ruins their fun, then you have to admit something went sideways.
And that is what this is about: not that survivors do gens, but that they seem out to break some record or something without any hindrance.
Why do you take this as an attack on killers? Nowhere have I mentioned that killers are the ones ruining my fun.. Do you consider it a fun match hanging on the hook watching your 3 teammates crouching around the hook, reaching second stage, getting unhooked right in front of the killer just to be hooked again and die??
This post is NOT about killers, it's about being a good teammate, which this game is about if you are a survivor. So stop being so entitled thinking every post on this forum is an attack on killers existense. It's not.. But something has to chance for solo survivor, unless all you want to face is SWF in the future.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
Thing is, a lot of purple and red ranks seem so obsessed with playing dbd competitive. Like '*win*as many matches per day as possible' seems to be the main mentality, which leads to the approach of 'go in, rush gens, go out, rinse and repeat'...
we can be glad that the game's mechanics not actually lend to that (even though we still have ranks) or it would be much much worse.
but yeah, it's a nonsensical mentality, and they are were much playing the wrong game if that is their approach. and they are usually those loudest to cry how this and that killer needs a nerf because... they can't do their shallow routine playstyle.
Lol! And killers just play to have fun right? Your argument doesnt make any sense. Survivors have their objektives, killers have theirs... and no i dont consider a match where I don’t get to do ######### fun, just as much as killers don’t consider it fun being renrushed within the first minute of the game.. as killer you have a saying in how the match turn out, as survivor you are completely relying on your teammates, if they want to bodyblock you, unhook you in front of the killer, point the killer towards you... Well just too bad.. I Think most people play to win, so most people are playing the wrong game i suppose for wanting to do their objectives....
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@RoMainPuppy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1565118#Comment_1565118
Lol right? It's funny because people get mad all the time at the "Survivor Rulebook" but like the "killer rulebook" is: No looping of any kind, no hiding in lockers, No touching gens until the killer finds hits and hooks someone, no 99-ing the doors, no BT, no DS, no Unbreakable, no Soul Guard, no DH, no Adrenaline, no combining of any of those perks together WHATSOEVER, no dark cosmetics, no Stealth/Hiding, no Spine Chill, no toolboxes, no medkits, no flashlights, oh and no dropping pallets whatsoever. Oh and also no luck offerings, luck offerings are TOXIC. No kobe-ing of any kind. Also also you can't escape through the hatch as the last survivor, because muh 4k.
(There is no such thing as the "KIller Rulebook" btw, I'm just making one based off the things killers complain about the most)
I love this! 😂😂😂 its so true
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i agree that people DC more when penalties are active, and I Think a Big part of the issue is that people play more toxic when they know the penalty is active. I have noticed WAY more Moris, iri hatches and tunneling after the penalties came back, and survivors teabag and bully the killers Way more, because they know the risk of the killer dcing is lower.
I never liked the penalties, they do not solve anything. People DC for a reason and if people want out of a match they will suicide on first hook, or go AFK in a corner to avoid bullying. If I face a tunneling huntress with IRI and a mori, there is no Way in hell I am going to stick around, why would i? I know I am going to depip anyway, and not get to do anything but giving this toxic person free points, And if I am on a team with toxic survivors who constantly Will rat me out to the killer, bodyblock me and get me killed purposly so they Can get the hatch, I want to be able to move on to the next match. I still suicide on first hook when I face these things, and even if I Got a penalty for that also, I still would..
And finally these weren’t the conditions when I first bought this game, and I start to feel the urge to demand my money back.. people get banned for hours/days not being able to play a game WE PAYED for, for something as silly as DC’ing. I can fully understand getting bans for hacking, harrasment, abuse ect. but dc’ing is not a valid reason for banning people for days. Just do like in WOW, give people a 30 min “deserter” ban and keep it at that.
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All survivors should have some kind of disability... i suggest the following.. one survivor is blind and can’t see anything but a blurry screen (total Black screen would be preferable but let’s be fair) , one is deaf and can’t hear skill-checks or terror radious, the third survivor is in a wheel-chair, and the fourth has some neurological illness, which Will result in seizures every 30’th second... There will be 8 gens instead of 5, only one door to escape, and the amount of pallets Will be reduced with 50 %...how is that? I Think even under these conditions you guys would still ask for nerfs 😂😂😂😂
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@Splinterverse said:
Face it. This game has become killer-side over the last year+. It's not going to change until enough of us quit playing for them to maybe take notice. Perhaps with crossplay, they'll never notice. Oh well.
I agree with you, I really hope more survivors will take a break from the game, or switch side, until this massive killer favoring stops. Someone said it in another thread “I love winning, but not when it’s shooting fish in a barrel”.
#survivorslivesmatters
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I am thinking i finally had it.... done playing survivor, there is no Way in hell this game is even close to balanced after adding this... solo survivor is terrible enough as it is, with these new killer perks it’s going to be a freaking nightmare.
My Bet Will be that a few weeks after launce, there won’t be enough survivors playing, cause everyone wants to play killer now. SMH...
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Toxicity on both sides are insane right now because of People’s frustrations, and the toxicity just makes everything worse.. killers being bullied with flashlights, teabagging and insults, by the team who just came from 3 matches in a row being camped and tunneled to death... this killer will then out of frustration Bring his worst build and a mori to the next match and so it goes on...
I Think if everyone actually tried to switch side just for a few days, to see what the opposite side is dealing with, would help a great deal.
This game is insanely hard to balance, but I do believe removing/reworking keys and Moris, increasing gen-times and adressing tunneling would be a good place to start.
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remove remove, nerf this nerf that... nerf pallets, flashlights, medkits, toolboxes, keys, DS, unbrekable... nerf self-Care, nerf adrenaline.. just nerf survivors!! all while tunneling, camping, pop, BBQ, NOED, iri hatches and moris still exists.. but as soon as someone just mentions touching some of this, killers go nuts.. no no all these things are all fine, they are acceptable playstyles...
And now you all start complaining about Long que times.. SMH... wonder why 🤣
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Cause Killer is Way easier, and give better bloodpoints.. thats why :)