BadMrFrosty
BadMrFrosty
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- BadMrFrosty
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Survivor: Drop palette and hold W.
Killer. Hold W, break palette, maybe hit survivor.
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I rarely play him. Nemesis wastes too much time for the lack of lethality he has. I don't feel like giving each survivor extra sprint bursts in a meta where two generators are often done as the first hook happens.
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Goodnight, cowboy. We'll miss you buddy.
Arthur Morgan dying flashbacks...
:'(
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@Zeidoktor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2532927#Comment_2532927
That's exactly why they reduced the base recovery, though. If they do that and people really do still use the recovery addons only, then that means overhauling everything. But if other addons start setting more use then that might mean a different approach is warranted.
From what I've gathered the devs goal seems to be making as many different addons as appealing as possible. To do that with Ghost Face, they need a situation where the most primarily used addons aren't and, of they remain so, that too, is valuable to know.
Why did they have to leave him in this state to make his other add-ons better? So they reduced the CD on his power by 6 seconds.. fine, but then why does it come out as a net nerf? I mean, it's only 1 second longer with double CD, but let's be real.. his other add-ons are so bad that people will likely just keep using book/pen anyway.
What this does is leave Ghostface slightly weaker than before and give him nothing in return. At high MMR, I'd be willing to bet most people use add-ons (if they even dare play this miserable pile of doodoo). That basically means that his 6 second CD reduction buff is worthless.
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@Zeidoktor said:
I personally wonder if this isn't part of the idea. Reduce the need for recovery addons, see what people use or don't use, and use that information for a more thorough add-on pass later.
If what you say is indeed true, I find it funnier than anything else. You know what people don't use? Anything that doesn't reduce the CD of his power. It has been this way for a couple years already, but hey.. more D A T A, right?
These developers are a straight up parody.
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Think about why killers might just default to camping. I'll list some reasons:
- Too many generators popped at once (can happen regardless of chase length if survivors spawn spread apart on generators).
- Multiple tiles strung together that makes catching them borderline impossible - add in safe pallets for additional fun.
- End game collapse is happening, which means they have no real reason to leave the hook.
- Suspected SWF coordination over Discord, which makes the match harder by an order of magnitude.
- Forces survivors to hook bomb or be bored on generators for the entire match.
Chasing is not the strength of killers, it's the strength of survivors. Chasing can lose you the game as can camping. HOWEVER, there's a high likelihood that you'll win by camping since most survivors tend to be overly altruistic and feed into hook saves (especially if they're in a group).
What this comes down to is acknowledging that the developers have only given 1 - 3 (soon to be 2) killers the ability to compete against most survivors. The rest are just left dangling in the wind, useless at high tiers of play and designed to stomp low-mid skill level survivors.
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The hatch is only one small issue in a massive list of reasons why this game is horribly imbalanced. Even with the current nerf, survivors still heavily outpower the entirety of the killer cast save for one. That should tell you something.
I don't think anyone has ever gone: "Yeah, hatch is the reason why survivors are overpowered. If they nerf it, the game will swing closer to the middle, balance-wise." Most people realize this doesn't really do much for the overall state of the game where killers are considered, especially since keys weren't showing up in every game as the norm.
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@Rey_512 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2528979#Comment_2528979
Where does the “uncanny valley” reference come from?
It's not a reference really, more of a saying used to describe things that appear close to human, but are just "off" enough to provoke an awkward or unsure feeling about them. As an easy example, sophisticated robots can cause this sort of reaction.
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Funny part is they've reworked and updated some of the maps. What do you mean they're still terrible? God damnit..
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They look incredibly out of place and awkward. Sort of an uncanny valley effect going on here imo.
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@Voodoo_Thirsty said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2528190#Comment_2528190
Wut...?
Spirit was top tier for YEARS now and you're complaining about keys being 9 months later than moris?
And I believe those changes are pretty standard.
Sure, coming down to a B from a S tier might feel huge, but to me, a Plague main, going from a C to a B feels pretty good.
Maybe A/S tier killers can actually learn how to properly play their respective killers without having to rely on their once-broken powers.
Survivors have been at the very pinnacle of top tier at every point in this game's lifespan, even when killers were at their most powerful.
Your move, Kaiba.
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@NekoTorvic said:
I don't know what you're talking about. We all know that reacting to things is the only actual valid counterplay that exists in videogames. Prediction, deception, careful positioning and strategy are a myth perpetuated by slinger mains that wanna have easy games while depriving survivors of interactivity.
I for one have watched one person play slinger for half a game ONE time and I know for a fact that he is completely uncounterable because he shoots so fast and you can't react to it. Every streamer agrees with me on this.
Like, why should a killer have the right to have more control over chases than survivors? It's not like chases are the ONLY thing killers need to do in their gameplay, and the only other thing that survivors have to do is hold M1 on gens. So if you make the chase bad for survivors then all they have left is to hold M1 on a thing for a bit and win the game because outplaying their opponents is optional...
I've lost track of my sarcasm at this point. Yeah it's painful. Reminds me of when I desperately and fruitlessly tried to explain to a survivor how Blight is not actually able to spin 180 degrees and how mechanically complex it is to appear to turn 180 degrees... people will spout out easily disprovable bullshit because mediocre players will never fathom that there's a whole lot of stuff they can't see, cuz they are ignorant of it, and they will scoff at the idea of ever trying because it's not immediately obvious to them.
Killers should have control over chases because survivors have control over their objective, which is far more difficult to thwart given that math is against the killer.
1 killer chases 1 survivor = assuming a minimum chase time of 20 - 30 seconds (being generous here with a pretty quick chase), that means each other survivor on a generator has passed roughly 50 - 60 of 80 seconds required to complete their objective (each). It takes time for the killer to find a survivor, and then if you tack on what is generally considered fairly quick chase time, they're already on their back foot.
So, let's summarize:
You find a survivor within the first 10 - 15 seconds of the match, chase them for 20 - 30 seconds, down them (3 second attack CD), pick them up (3 - 4 seconds), and carry them to a hook (let's say 5 - 7 seconds).
If we're being generous and assume every value there is at its lowest, you're looking at 41 seconds total time spent dealing with one survivor. That's slightly over half a generator spread across three. How is that in any way fair or balanced?
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@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2526248#Comment_2526248
Same argument could be said about the start of the game: Windows started being blocked when they never were. Stagger was added when there was none. Pallet vacuums were removed. Hooks gained a respawn timer. That is when the metabuild of survivors started being used.
But what happened? That metabuild was nerfed, EGC was even added? Dying Light didnt get nerfed? A lot of survivors did drop off increasing the killer queue quite significantly? Oh, but what's this? Killers were then starting to be addressed too?
Survivor "fun" was gutted in favor of making killer more fun to play. Anything killers "demanded" was granted. Extra BP to BBQ so it would be comparable to WGLF? Sure. A secondary effect to WGLF so it would be more comparable to BBQ? Didnt happen untill 1 year ago.
I can create a massive list of examples that happen to killers now, that happened to survivors then. Yes, it's a sour apple to bite through, but the end result does become sweeter. Deathslinger might become unplayable for a while, welcome to the grand list of killers that have once been practically unplayable after their 1 strength was nerfed: Hag, Doctor, Bubba, Clown, Demo, Trickster, Legion. All killers that have been in a state of being incapable of even holding a match together, but are now quite capable of holding their own in higher than ever tiers. Heck, higher tiers than old Nurse was even capable of holding. Because maps have been balanced, powers have been readjusted.
Yeah, Deathslinger might have 3 months where he is going to be unplayable, at worst. Which is much better than the killers mentioned previously, who were unplayable for over a year before they got adjusted.
Here's the thing, never once did I ever claim that survivors haven't been nerfed. Survivors have been massively depowered compared to how broken they once were, on that I think we can both agree. The sad part? Survivor is, and always has been the most powerful role in the game, pre and post-nerf. They were so vastly overpowered before that even after a slew of changes, they're still the most dominant role AFTER killers got several buffs in the form of perks, power designs, and map changes. So what does this tell us? Well, clearly one side can afford to suffer multiple fairly large nerfs and remain incredibly potent, while the other, much weaker side, cannot sustain the same level of aggressive change without suffering in the long term. Not all killers are created equal, however all survivors can use the same base mechanics to combat all but one killer on the roster. Just think about it.
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@Haddix said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2526222#Comment_2526222
Because that's not my argument. My argument is the entire rest of the post that has nothing to do with the sentence "as a survivor player.." beyond how I've shared that my survivor experience, especially since MMR has released, has lacked variety a ton. But instead of actually reading and responding to the contents of my post, you're fixating on the first 4 words of the title. Where's YOUR argument?
I play survivor, I face a very low variety of killers every time I play, and my stance is that the recent changes are hurting the already lacking variety of killers. If all you're going to respond with is "uhh u cant prove you play survivor," then why are you here on a forum? People share their experiences and opinions on the game constantly without providing government-approved evidence that details exactly how long their grandma was logged on DBD the previous night and what she ate for breakfast the following morning. Get real.
Variety isn't going to get any better after this patch if most of it goes through, I can tell you that. Even more depressing, is if some of the killers are fortunate in their add-on buffs, I seriously, seriously doubt it'll be enough to push them into viability. Map RNG is just far too volatile and unbalanced, with no real check and balance system to prevent strong tiles from linking together.
Pig with better add-ons is still Pig. Myers will still be Myers, etc etc.
In order for weaker killers to compete with the game's current state (thereby increasing variety), their add-ons would have to be massively over buffed. This won't happen, so yeah.. survivor is going to be a real snooze fest after this patch assuming the majority of these changes go through (which they likely will). Variety was already awful as it is, so I agree with you here.
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Everybody likes to complain about unfun this and that, but at the end of the day, understand this:
- You will get the nerfs to killer that you want as survivors, this has already been proven in BVHR's patch records.
- A finger on the monkey paw will close, and you will see Blight, Nurse, and METAMAN (the build) even more.
- And if, by some insane twist of fate, Nurse and Blight get gutted.. then the final two fingers of the paw will close and survivor queues will jump from 5 - 10 minutes to 20 - 30 as there's nothing truly strong left for killers to use.
The game is not in a good enough state to change killers this drastically, and all this does is pen people into a few viable choices along with METAMAN accompanying it.
For those that say: I play X and Y at high levels and I'm fine. Alright, let me level set you real quick:
- You play those killers and succeed due to not facing survivors playing to actually win - bringing the best perks, being efficient on generators, and bringing excellent items/add-ons.
- These teams are rare, and won't show up in a majority of your games, HOWEVER, make peace with this fact: no matter how good you are, if you're not playing Nurse, you will never win. Ever. Your skill cap is much lower on literally every killer in the game save for one, giving them the natural advantage over you to start. Throw in map RNG and.. well, your options are depleted.
Some of us do not gain any sort of satisfaction from beating new or average survivors, nor do we enjoy the idea that we're getting ahead not because of our skill, but because of their poor decisions. See what I've noticed is that survivors are completely fine with chases being dictated by how they play, but not ok with the opposite being true. Hypocritical, but that's how it is. Four people will always find a way to band together and stick with their tribe against the singular opposition. Human nature's a #########.
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@feruis said:
You can say whatever you want, but at the current state of the game he needed buff if anything.
Should we all now jump on how survivors are beyond strong because of Oracle? Where so called uncountable free win Spirit got only one hook in the match? How gens flied whenever killer got in a chase? Or how killer loses the game because of the smallest mistake, where survivors make dozens and still win easily?
And what if you encounter survivors of that level? Where is the killers fun? Where is the counterplay for million second chances? Or how do you counter splitting up with let's say Clown or now Slinger? You don't. That is automatic lose for the killer, but i guess only survivors are allowed to have fun, keep balancing the game around the potatoes on this forum, and let's see how long q will be.
Listen, BVHR just didn't want to program killer AI. Now be a good killer, walk in a straight line, and get hit by palette. :)
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inb4 ruin/undying lmao
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@Myla said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2525914#Comment_2525914
You would think that would be the point of test servers for people to test ideas but implement it anyway the next week regardless of feedback lol
That's why I've always said, they're not test servers, they're hype servers.
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I agree that Deathslinger and Spirit needed changes, HOWEVER, AND I MUST BOLD THIS PART:
- THIS IS NOT THE RIGHT TIME TO CHANGE THESE KILLERS WITH MAPS/RNG BEING THE WAY IT IS.
Maps need to be adjusted before we start nerfing killers, especially those in the mid/upper mid tier. But hey, why do something difficult when you can just slap some nerfs on a killer, not examine your broken map design/RNG system, and call it a day.
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Here's the issue: killers like Deathslinger are a symptom of a much greater problem in DBD - map design. Rather than take the necessary long road for the game's health and fixing problematic maps, what the team has instead opted to do is nerf killers whose chase potential is overwhelming. This leads us into asking: why is their chase so strong? Simple, it's to make up for how ridiculous most maps are, and more importantly, how many safe loops/linking tiles there are (or can spawn).
Deathslinger's strengths are the following:
- Low TR (allows for cheeky first engagement hits and follow up shots).
- Quickscope shots that cannot be reacted to (not fair for survivors, granted, but neither is the pace of the game especially for slower killers).
- Zoning (again, not really fair for survivors as it's essentially a one-sided guessing game).
So, in conclusion, what we've seen is that in order for this killer to maintain what is generally considered upper mid tier strength, he's needed several unfair advantages over survivors in the chase. That said, as many people would state, he's not unbeatable because he lacks map pressure which is the most critical part of a killer's design, if they're fortunate enough to have it. That being said, if you take away his overwhelming chase potential, nerf his TR, and leave him at 110%.. without strong add-ons, he's essentially a worse huntress in every way possible.
If we go down the road of assuming his new add-ons are strong, then he simply becomes another add-on dependent killer. Again, we just seem to be in a worse place than before OR turning him into yet another killer who'll need add-ons to function similarly to before.
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They don't play the game at any level that matters which means their entire design process goes: concept --> paper --> implementation.
Normal folks would ask about the testing phase, to which I very politely respond with "lmao."
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I'm not surprised and honestly I've kept my expectations low and close to non-existent. These developers are massively out of touch, and without a complete shake up of their map/balance teams, I doubt that'll change. Expect more of the same.
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@MyNamePete said:
this posts title brought me back to 2018
We never left. Just look for yourself, the game is mostly the same.
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@indieeden7 said:
Pretty sure that's why the PTB exists. If I recall correctly, Ash didn't have a PTB, and therefore the devs didn't receive feedback regarding the first iteration of MoM.
We don't have a PTB, we have a hype server.
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It's a feature now. You like?
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Variety. That's it.
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No.
:(
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Spirit's entire design is a symptom of a greater issue - poor map design and unbalanced survivor perks (similar to Nurse). Changing her doesn't fix the game or get it to a better place, but.. y'know, expecting the developers to realize this might be nigh-impossible.
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Poor map design, quick gen speeds, and incredibly powerful second chance perks give survivors incentive to bully, play recklessly, and treat the killer like a joke. Experienced survivors know they can get away with it because the developers are out of touch and blindly follow data across low and mid tier skill levels primarily, which means map RNG/parameters are designed with that experience in mind. As survivors get better at the game, the system goes from barely acceptable to absolutely broken, especially when tile linking and pallet conservation become the norm.
For a decrease in survivor toxicity, you'd need to flip the roles. All killers would need to become powerful enough to compete with the best survivors, and while some people will always try and tilt their opposition by being obnoxious, a lot of people would suddenly become far less bold if they knew there was a huge risk of going down quickly. Knowing there's a loop nearby (or several of them linked together due to bad RNG) that guarantees complete safety emboldens the worst of the survivor player base to act the way they do.
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I mean, if the survivors want to slam every gen and leave early, let them. Everyone wastes their time and gets no points.
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Freddy, Legion, and Clown in no particular order.
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Without a rework, Trapper will never be good unless the game shifts to a meta where time is against the survivors. That or they massively buff his base kit and add-ons to insane degrees (doubt).
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@Brokenbones said:
Hillbilly mains are probably excited
His addons are rock bottom, so how could they possibly make them worse?
This is not the sort of curse you want to put on his add-ons. When it comes to being out of touch and making bad decisions, that is where your faith should be high in BVHR.
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@Danielgdp3 said:
Everyone complaining about how the mmr isn't working and that they are still matching with people better/worse than them too often need to realise that it's only been out for a week, it will be chaos you probably won't start getting consistent games until at least a months time, and even then there will still be old players who rarely play who are in those lower mmr levels that you may come across (if your mmr is low - average).
Just give it time, take some L's and get some W's and try to have faith that it will even out in time.
Hopefully the devs do announce how the mmr scores players though I feel that's important information for us as players to know.
How much time do we need to give this company to not only fix MMR, but every other pressing issue that's been in this game for years? Patience has run out, and now people are snippy and more toxic than ever. BVHR has contributed to this by allowing the game to stagnate and degrade over time with each patch.
People are paying money, so they're expecting results. That's not unreasonable - a return on investment, if you will.
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Demo's power is a flying hug. What more do you want? He's about to be put to sleep :'(
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There's a time and a place for self-care. The issue starts when you prioritize healing over generators at every point in the game.
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There is no self-care epidemic, just a moron epidemic.
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When they removed his voice lines, they tore his soul apart.
Now there's only a husk.
/ripcamers
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I would just like to say that MandyTalk nerfed this thread by removing my beautiful, well-made Gordon Ramsay meme. Monstrous abuse of mod powers.
Sadge.
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@Jasonisanicefella said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2500216#Comment_2500216
XD I don't know but I have been having my butt kicked since Tuesday. I will play some dbd in a couple of hours and will keep you posted :)
Please do because you might be reverse Otzdarva - 50 losses in a row. That does suck though, man. I'd probably take a four month break if I lost that much. Infuriating.
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God DAYUM.. that's a hell of a streak. What fresh hell did you get yourself into? 21 losses? Never, on my worst day, could I ever have that kind of bad luck. Yeesh.
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@ThiccBudhha said:
Hex: Plaything has quickly become one of my favorite perks in the game. I am running it on a lot of killers already.
I'm actually worried they're gonna nerf it out of nowhere because anything but ruin/undying is blasphemy of the highest order.
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@GrimoireWeiss said:
I'm actually surprised because this is the 3rd chapter in a row that killers get decent perks. They are doing quite a good job on that department especially if you consider that 2020 killers had horrible perks (except old Undying, but that was busted).
I'm suspicious as to whether or not this is just pure luck, or if we rolled well on the developer that actually has an idea of what's valuable. You can tell there's at least one person on the team that makes handy/powerful stuff based on certain add-ons, perk designs, etc.
C'mon lady luck, keep the streak of good stuff coming.
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It's w/e for me. Whether or not they live depends on if they follow T H E R U L E S.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
"A) The perks are, of course, useful- but they don't want to make it something they absolutely have to equip constantly. And if people are feeling forced into generator slowdown perks, then it's not good for the game and something needs to be done."
Yeah you guys are like....a year and some change late to this one, cause we've already started the mandatory Thano+Dying or Ruin+Tinker or Ruin+Undying. Yall are late. Any killer who doesn't already have built in slow, or some godlike mobility, this is pretty much required at high ranks if you wanna get any more than 2 kills.
Just another two years worth of D A T A to figure that out. Hold on to your seat, this is gonna be a bumpy ride.
I swear to god reality has become full on parody.
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@latinfla4 said:
Take your pick...I vote for smaller maps and,selfishly, buffing some killers. Split some of the larger maps into two sections (hello rpd).
I mean trickster got how much time and work put into him while other killers like legion pig Myers and trapper sit there outdated🤨
I love sbmm knowledge is power🤑
The same changes they implement 95% of the time: "Whatever they feel like, even if it makes no sense or makes the game worse."
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@enormous_bruh_moment said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2498316#Comment_2498316
"When it happens to guys it's nothing, but if the same thing happens to girls it's an organized system of oppression." lmao
Truly spoken like someone who has no clue what they're talking about. This is a forum for discussion about a video game. If we wanted to listen to you regurgitating buzzwords & political talking points onto every facet of your life, we would follow you on twitter.
We know what you are. Take your intersectional bs somewhere else. It has no place here.
Hearing more and more people say/get behind what enormous has just said is giving me hope that the west will return to sanity. Bless you, my dude/gal.
😃
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Well, it took them 2 years to design this SBMM system. How long do you think it'll take them for this? If the leaked code is to be believed as to how our SBMM is generated.. wowee. 2 years. 2 YEARS.
Competition needs to get some major hype behind it, live up to that hype, and shake BVHR off their throne. This crap is ridiculous.
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Nea is hideous. That's the joke.
/thread
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I don't really see what there is to get triggered about. An underused (arguably terrible) perk is finally seeing some use on a killer whose niche allows it to function at a mediocre level.
You wonder why there are maybe six perks killers are running at any given time.. :-/