dednark
dednark
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@Brimp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3024249#Comment_3024249
2 seconds of distance is more than enough time to make it to another loop. People can head on a killer in the middle of nowhere and still make it so some other tile. I'm talking head on'ing a killer in one tile then be able to run to another tile completely. Just because you cant make it past 3 tiles doesn't make it useless.
Again, the point of ds is not to make to a tile, but to gain significant distance on killer to discourage tunneling. Not only 3sec in some situations would be too little to reach any tile, but even if you do it is also ultimately worthless against half of killer roster with antilooping abilities.
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@Brimp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3024073#Comment_3024073
No perks truly prevent tunneling? The whole point of ds and bt is to buy time for your team if the killer does decide to tunnel you. If something truly prevented tunneling you would have a 2 meter force field around you for 60 seconds after being unhooked where the killer cant hit you through it even by ranged means.
Also unless you run yourself into a dead zone... you 100% have enough distance and time to make it to another tile even with a 3 second ds.
The whole point of ds is to discourage killers from tunneling by severely punishing them if they do decide to tunnel. New ds more than anything will encourage killer to tunnel more because 3 sec is nothing
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@Brimp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3022826#Comment_3022826
You realize thats what made ds op right? Just being able to work on a gen in front of the killers face and they're able to do nothing about other than eat a 5 second stun or wait out the ds. Either way I don't consider it tunneling if you're doing your objective and I've hooked people before I came back to you.
I do, but I don't think you realize that 3 sec ds stun as of right now is worthless and doesn't prevent tunneling, since you don't make any distance whatsoever.
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@Brimp said:
Only reason that DS was buffed to a 5 second stun was because enduring worked on it with the 75% stun reduction. So by the time your feet touched the ground the killer could swing again and down you. Now that enduring hasn't affected the DS stun for what.. 3 years? It's safe to say that it being 3 seconds will be fine.
Sure, 3 sec was fine 4 years ago. For consistency, let's bring back ability to use it without being hooked, while simultaneously being able to work on gens and perform all other actions.
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@Bran said:
It should be deactivated on the vaulting actions.
If you can't perform actions, dh would become useless. We'll see in ptb I guess
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@tenoresax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2681766#Comment_2681766
And by contrast, trapping a survivor at a loop and spamming Punishment until you hit them is more fun for both sides?
Absolutely. It is more engaging and you're not hopeless that he'll just run you down with you not being able to do anything.
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@Labrac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2681844#Comment_2681844
You don't need to learn how to counter each killer. The base game already favors survivors, so you just need to learn how to use that in your favor. You can be horrible at running a Doctor, but if you just hold W away from your teammates, use some good exhaustion perk to carry you to safe areas and pre-drop some pallets you'll be fine.
Your objective as a survivor is doing 5 gens and opening the gates. You don't need to be good at looping or anything fancy. As killer the objective requires you to be good at chases, because there's no other way to kill survivors (well, maybe basement Bubba).
Also very few people play only one killer. There's 26 of them right now and I'm pretty sure the majority of the playerbase plays at least a handful of them.
I get it, you're a killer main and don't play survivor.
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2681844#Comment_2681844
You usually have to learn multiple killers. I doubt there is any player that found his main on first try...
Also you need multiple killers to unlock optimal build and you usually play them.
I don't think there is any player that played only 1 killer from start.
Look, at least half of killer roster have very simple powers and are easy to play. Wraith, pig, hag, legion, myers and so on. So unless you want to master a bunch of really unique killers, overall learning killer should be easier than learning survivor.
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2681801#Comment_2681801
I can see your logic behind it, but it's not really true.
Learn how to play against a killer is usually way easier than learning how to play that killer.
It's like few simple rules for each killer. Break line of sight, predrop pallets, etc.
But easiest way? Hold W... That works against most killers.
>Learn how to play against a killer is usually way easier than learning how to play that killer.
That's true. What I'm saying is that killers not necessarily have to learn all killers, while survivors forced to play against all killers and it's mandatory to learn counterplay to each killer
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2681697#Comment_2681697
lol, since when?
just 1 is enough.
Survivors don't have to choose which killers they want to play against, so automatically while playing survivor you have to learn how to play against ALL killers with different powers and different addons. At the same time survivor is just a skin without any abilities, so you can pick 1 killer and master him without even touching others, because every game you play against the same opponent.
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@tenoresax said:
It's amazing how bhvr has made the same mistake when nerfing a killer basically 3 times in a row now.
They have nerfed Pyramid Head, Twins and Deathslinger all in such a way that it doesn't really affect their performance, it just makes them feel more like ######### to play.
Pphead's nerf(?) was good, since he could no longer just follow you until you either drop a pallet to get hit by M2, or run through to get hit by M1. Basically they gave survivors more counterplay, removed lose/lose situations, while actually buffing him in other part.
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@Labrac said:
Considering the skill ceilling of killer is much higher than survivor, yes. They should not be unbeatable, but losing to unskillful things like spreading up on Haddonfield feels cheap.
Unless you want to learn all killers at once, playing survivor requires more skill.
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@Moxie said:
I just stop playing after 3 games of unfun.
No counter-play besides hoping she misses. it's impossible to miss setting up around pallets.
Like Pre nerf Slinger with full MS.
Looking forward to well deserved nerfs very soon.
Not slinger, but pre nerf Pphead on crack. She forces you into an actual lose/lose situation without any counterplay. She needes some sort of cd, just like they gave one to pphead.
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@Xaggy said:
She has no cooldown after using a power. It doesn't matter if I dodge the crow. She gets the M1 so easily. In some loops it's a guaranteed hit for her no matter what you are doing.
It will take a few weeks until people realise that she is pre nerf Pphead on crack, then the crying will begin and devs finally give her cd after using crow attack, so she'll have some kind of counterplay.
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Honestly if they release her in ptb state I would probably kill myself on first hook every time I play against her. She is like old legion, zero interaction in chase because she can deny any loop with just 1 crow and as a survivor you can do absolutely nothing but to keep running and get m1'ed. Buff long range capability, but definitely tone down chasing.
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It's good, the downside is awful, but upsides are huge as well. The problem is people will never try to learn to play perfect with this exact addon while they have normal Blight.
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@[Deleted User] said:
She's difficult to play. More difficult than nurse in my opinion. I try hag every time i get a daily and i have no idea what i am doing.
Oh come on, drop that 'you need 2000IQ to play hag' bullshit. She is by far one of the easiest killers in dbd just for the fact that she requires ZERO mechanical skill to be good at.
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2658990#Comment_2658990
Aim assist is never cheating and is usually worse than MNK anyway
We are on dbd forum, luckily not an fps game that can be ruined by aim assist, so I'm not even gonna argue about that. I just don't want them to delete interesting mechanics simply because they're harder to do on controller.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2658363#Comment_2658363
#1 I didn't mention anything about limiting things on MnK.
#2 there are ways to make controller way better than it is right now and if you're not playing on controller your input is completely irrelevant.
#3 oh you're one of those people. The type that blames their lost gunfights on muh aim assist.
Don't pretend that aim assist in fps games doesn't give you huge advantage. Anyway, if they can make controller feel better WITHOUT restraining mnk or giving cheats to consoles then I don't care.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2657289#Comment_2657289
There's actually a very similar problem with Oni, where it's like yeah you can absolutely turn 90 degrees with the bash but not at the same turn rate as MnK. Meaning you'll just barely miss your target on some of the tighter turns (and it can be rough keeping up with someone in your face but that's more of an overall control feel discussion for me). At least with Oni you don't have to be dashing to bonk people. That and, you know, it instadowns.
I wish people were more privy to the technical constraints of these things (some of which could be rectified) and didn't automatically assume everything is 1:1 comparable concerning MnK and controller.
There is no need to restrain/change things that work better on mnk. Just accept some differences, disadvantages and restrictions on controller and move on. Mnk will always be superior in this game and you will never balance them, unless you straight out give cheats to consoles(like they did in Cod and Apex)
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I hate him because of how easy he is to play while being able to down you at any loop that doesn't have high walls. Like huntress can down you too, even faster, but she gets punished if she misses or if she pulls out hatchet at the wrong time, while trickster just machine guns you. No aim, no skill needed. Truly the Freddy of ranged killers
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Perk should stay as it is, but it shouldn't cancel m2 powers.
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Hag is the only killer in dbd that downs people without chasing them, completely ignoring any interaction between killer and survivor. She does not take any mechanical skill to play whatsoever, just a little map knowledge. Incredibly boring to play as/against. Add on top of that excellent proxy camping. She needs major rework, but probably wont get because no one plays her anyway.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2605058#Comment_2605058
What about cancelling powers?
I meant exactly this, not a default m1 lunge. I was just thinking at the moment about Blight's lunge after rush, and Nurse's lunge after perfect blink on top of survivor.
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Yes, but dead hard shouldn't cancel lunge.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593773#Comment_2593773
I am now authority.
Dead Hard nerf will happen.
My dad works in bhvr and he confirmed dead hard wont be nerfed. Sorry, try next time.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2592590#Comment_2592590
I'm not a Killer main, despite popular belief.
It hurts your argument when you just go out and start name-calling people.
You're not the only one crying about perk fix, calling it a buff. Regardless, if you think it's a "buff", then consider this: dead hard got unwarranted nerf in 2018 when dedicated servers were implemented, so now devs "buff" it back to its initial state.
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Pallet hits get fixed, so killers can no longer abuse bad ping and have free undeserved hits they had for 5 years == survivor buff
Dead hard gets fixed to work properly after 3 years of being exhausted on the floor == another survivor buff
How dare they make the game work as intended? How us, poor killer mains, can get undeserved hits now in this undeniably survivor-sided game, devs?
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- Hag. The only killer in dbd able to down you without a chase. Needs rework.
- Trickster. Second best camper, but I also consider him to be the Freddy of ranged killer, he's too easy to play. Thankfully he's not very good.
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Change Nurse for Hag and I would agree.
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@botrax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2575300#Comment_2575300
COH is better compare to medkit. Its 1 perk slot on 1 survivor for everyone to have a free medkit
Disagree. Medkit is faster and available at any time and place.
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Ok? It was already dead if someone had a medkit. You have to commit to chase if you want to down them. Still COH is worse than medkits.
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@Nayru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2574993#Comment_2574993
[eep] off plx, bad enough spirit got pretty much all of her good green+ addons deleted except md/yakuyoke
If you intend to gut soloq by making every survivor item useless, it's only fair if we do the same with killer addons.
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I agree. Also, to compliment that change, we should look at every addon killers have and adjust them accordingly, by making their numbers and effects insignificant. Alchemist ring and mother-daughter ring should not exist.
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@Falkner09 said:
Dead hard and Iron Will are a bailout from failure and a remover of consequences for failure, in that order. Ruin, Undying, and Pop are not.
Ruin, undying, pop, corrupt are a bailout from failure to pressure gens. What do you mean you can't pressure all gens at once? Get gud.
Literally same argument. Dh is not a bailout, it is a utility perk that supposed to help you in chase.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2547217#Comment_2547217
Right, but you have a huge number of people on this forum who claim that dead hard is whatever….. and then 3/4 survivors use it. Cognitive dissonance.
DH is strong, but SB is stronger. Only reason survivors use dh instead of sb is because it is a fun perk. And only reason killers find it op or obnoxious is because they see it too frequently, and because when survivor uses it in the killer's face, they feel they've been robbed a hit/down.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2547623#Comment_2547623
Sprint Burst is so much less powerful and way more counterable.
I would enjoy that time.
Lol. If they nerf dh, you will be the first screaming how the game became unfun for killers because everyone uses SB, that you can no longer catch people off guard, dead zones do not matter, and chases overall take too long to even catch up to survivors.
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@slendermansmoom said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2546596#Comment_2546596
actually shining her body does that but blinding her while charging it causes her to go into fatigue
I know, but realistically it's impossible to burn her as you pointed out. That's why I said practical use of flashlight against Nurse is to deny her second blink and force her into fatigue.
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@slendermansmoom said:
love the mechanic too much to see it go
I hear the wraith with the max volume headphones
I see the invisible wraith
I burn him then chain the blind 17 times and hide :)
and for nurse well it's almost impossible unless they require a lot of time to aim the blink but if they know what they are doing then they won't waste any time.
so with wraith I think it's necessary but for nurse it's kinda pointless
You can't lightburn Nurse, but you can prevent her from blinking, which can be really useful, especially if she misses her 1 blink.
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Survivors use dead hard because it is the most fun exhaustion perk. Don't get me wrong, it is strong, but SB is better and yet almost no one takes it over DH, cause it's boring. Also DH does have a condition of being injured.
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@SunderMun said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2543146#Comment_2543146
Funny. I, too, can string together random sarcastic sentences to make it sound like I'm right and everyone else is wrong.
You said quickscoping doesn't take skill, I said I disagree. On tiles and loops he plays almost the same, except you no longer can quickly react to sudden survivor movement and instead have to preplan every shot you want to make. He became slow. Before you'd see a glimpse of survivor and hit them, if you're fast and precise enough, which drastically shortens the chase because you deny them access to a loop. Now, after changes, it's almost impossible to hit someone in between loops, because whenever survivors see you raising your gun, they start to move so chaotic that it's too hard to predict, better just not even try. Also they buffed his zoning more, now garbage slingers have even more of excuse to never shoot and hold m2 until they catch up. Only ones who got hurt by nerfs are the rare good slingers.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2543804#Comment_2543804
Shockingly, yes. Or some of them.
These are entirely my own opinion, based on playing as and against the killers, just for the record.
Nurse gives me feedback so I can react to her movements, giving my brain the thought process of "If I'd reacted just a little bit better I could've won that".
Basekit blight is fun, and gives plenty of feedback. Ruin/Undying/Tinkerer isn't literally only because of how much I've seen it. Alchemist's Ring is just crackpot strong, but even then it isn't the worst thing in the world.
Nemesis isn't fun, to me. His power isn't awful to face but it's his zombies that annoy me, as both killer and survivor. The map pressure of the guy is entirely based on RNG and a lot of the players that I've faced like to facecamp and tunnel at 5 gens, which isn't particularly great to deal with. He doesn't give me the good feeling of "I could've done better".
Pyramid Head is actually fun to face a lot of the time, because I can read them like a book. Mostly due to how much I've played as him- since I tragically main the guy. And in order to tunnel me through cages, they need to down me :p
Huntress is one more that gives very clear audio and visual feedback and leaves you ample time to react- since you know, she has a charge time, limited ammo, and takes skill to deal with even when her hitboxes are stupidly large. Once more she leaves me with the feeling of "I could've done better", which is a good feeling to have
Trickster isn't fun for me to face. He has the limited ammo of Huntress, as well as the feedback, but the basically zero windup and ability to machine gun in the open makes it frustrating. Trickster chases are either auto loss (open area) or auto win (high walls) with practically nothing in-between.
Twins aren't great either imho. They give feedback, yes, but Victor respawning in half a second and the fact that their best strategy of play is to solo stomp with mass slugging (since SWF teams will just group together, one goes down then the other crushes Victor and heals them up with WGLF; trust me on this since it's how my usual 4man buddies deal with them). They're far from the worst and when they changed Victor's pounce cooldown they 100% nerfed the wrong thing about them. I wish Charlotte would become a lot more useful at the cost of Victor taking a lot longer to respawn- and their anti-camp mechanic could use a lot of work. Maybe, idk, once Victor has been crushed, the survivor who crushed him is exposed for some time (this is an add-on I think) and Charlotte sees their aura/killer instinct as she's waking up. Maybe a speed boost instead/as well.
Either way, some of them I find fun and some I do not. Usually the ones I enjoy have a windup time for their power and feedback on what they're doing. Some have mobility and some don't- the ones that don't are the ones hit much harder by the M1 game and also the ones usually a lot less enjoyable for me to face. Unfortunately Slinger is one of them.
If I were to propose changes to Slinger- I'd keep his current 1v1 as is or maybe worsen it some more (this is a big maybe, it all depends on what he's like going into live) and give him much more 1v4 potential. I proposed a "Bounty System" somewhere in feedback maybe a week ago, and in a different thread allowing him to use his gun as mobility by lodging into a wall and reeling himself closer. Depending on how nice the devs feel, even allowing vertical mobility so you can swing from trees or travel upwards on indoor maps or something. I doubt any of these would be implemented but off of the top of my head, this is what I could come up with.
I'd like to once more stress that these are my opinions from my own time playing as and against these killers. Surprisingly the killers I don't enjoy facing are also the ones I don't enjoy playing as- maybe there's something going on there in my brain I don't know.
Sorry for the long response; I got a bit carried away.
In case of Blight, do you think hug tech, 180s, shoulder flick are healthy mechanics? I'm alright with them being in the game, but since quickscoping now considered unfun mechanic, they should go too, because they have no reliable counterplay.
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> Pyramid Head is actually fun to face a lot of the time, because I can read them like a book. Mostly due to how much I've played as him
Same for me but in case of slinger. When people say he creates lose-lose situation, or that he's uncounterable in chase, I believe it comes from either being inexperienced in playing the character itself, or parroting streamer's opinion. It comes from experience, there are certain timings and in each situation you can predict when slinger is going to shoot. It mostly depends on player though, but absolute majority of slinger players are easily predictable.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2543797#Comment_2543797
Did I say unfair? I don't think those words were uttered by me anywhere.
Sorry, I meant fun. Do you find them fun and engaging?
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2543587#Comment_2543587
Yeah sure I get dunked on by everyone because I'm happy he got nerfed, and even when I escaped vs slinger I just didn't find it fun because his counterplay is holding M1 on gens as quickly as you possibly can which as we all know is incredibly engaging gameplay.
I'm just bad for not enjoying holding a single button for 300 seconds I guess :/
Holding M1 on gens as quickly as you possibly can is a counterplay to every killer. Tell me this, if you find slinger unfair, then logically you should find unfair such killers like: Nurse, Blight, Pphead, Nemesis, Huntress, Trickster, Twins. All of them have strong antiloop abilities, forcing you to change your usual pathing and play in an unconventional way. Are they fun?
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@SunderMun said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2542585#Comment_2542585
quickscoping was the epitome of removing any semblance of skill from him...
Disagree, but at least with new changes he became more skillful, right? Holding m2 until you catch up definitely raises slinger's skill ceiling...
No more of these unskillful, unfun, uncounterable, easily obtainable, unfair damned quickscopes. Thank god devs took care of them and finally buffed zoning even more. Now I don't have to take any risks of missing my shots because I don't need to shoot unless they're locked in animation. See, pressing m2 for a long period of time is REALLY HARD, your finger gets tired, and that just elevates slinger to a whole new level of skill you have to master.
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First 2 weeks had been heaven. I didn't get a single weak teammate. Games were fun and interesting because I knew I could rely on my team. Now all I get are literal bots. I guess mmr really does have a cap, so now every 100 hours dbd god, by ditching teammates and camping hatch with a key, reached highest mmr and plays with me. What's the point of mmr then?
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Yes, I'll go back to playing huntress. Removing quickscoping takes away fun and skill from this killer. Though I can say NOED Slingers love the new update, now that zoning even more encouraged and you don't have to shoot nearly as much.
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@Harold_Shipman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/285452/slinger-changes
It'll most certainly go ahead I'd have thought. It's a shame, because more than anything he feels so clunky and horrible now; they've tried to make him more fun to play against and to do so have made him horrible to play as.
Imo I'd prefer if they would bring back quick scoping, but have the accuracy of your shot increase the longer you aim (100% accurate after full aim animation) kind of like how you have aim spread on FPS games. That way, at least he'll still feel fluid to play as, with quick scoping being a high risk kind of strat. It'll also mean you'll need to aim 100% for long range shots, giving them chance to dodge, but around tight loops might be able to get away with a quick shot, making him not so weak around them,
But they didn't make him fun to play against. They took away skillful part of his kit which is quickscoping, and made zoning stronger and pretty much mandatory if you want to down survivors. New way of playing slinger is hold m2 until you catch up, or until they lock themselves in animation and you have guaranteed hit. I don't think slinger is B-tier, I believe he's quite strong in good hands, at least on par with huntress, but you definitely need skill and a lot of practise to have good results. His nerfs hinder and take away freedom from any good slinger who relied on hitting their shots, and buff NOED slinger who couldn't land a single shot in the open. Less skill, more zoning, more clumsiness - what a terrible change.
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@DelsKibara said:
I hope they listen to the community feedback about it.
But Dowsey making videos about how "it's not bad" certainly makes me worry they might just listen to influencers more.
I respect Dowsey as a content creator but wow, that ######### video was just so problematic.
- He played in a map that is INSANELY favoured towards him (Wreckers Yard, Open, Little LOS Blockers/Blockers in general)
- He played during a PTB when everyone just wants to test out the new perks and survivor.
- It took over 5 minutes for the first generator to pop.
- The survivors he was playing against were not very good.
And somehow he came to the conclusion Deathslinger is fine. When the odds were completely stacked towards him.
Contrast that to Zubat who has been struggling with the Deathslinger nerf.
I mean, strength-wise he did not became worse than clown, so I guess he's right :) But really dowsey misses the point of what makes slinger a slinger, and that is shooting fast without any delays. Sure, you can still down people, but it is much slower and you no longer have fun doing so