jmwjmw27
jmwjmw27
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If they made the cages stronger anti-camp (like 2v8 so he can't camp the uncage for a free down with power + range add-ons) and gave basekit BT out of a cage rescue I'd have no issue. Realistically the power is only dodgeable if you shift+W, he is meant to torment you eventually, which is fine save for how easy it is to camp and tunnel out with cages.
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Basekit more chests, "bleed self out" or 120s basekit unbreakable, basekit 15s corrupt for gens and totems, basekit 5s decisive strike and no collision with killer for basekit BT, basekit 10% pop and 60s block for nearest gen upon unique hook seems like a decent start
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3830075#Comment_3830075
Other games do it just fine and harshly punish people who afk. What makes DBD so special that it wouldn't work here?
If you harshly punish AFK, they will run into the killer. And then you have to prove that running into the killer is intentionally sabotaging the game, and not just trying to use OTR/DS or be a distraction, or just a bad play. If they make running in front of the killer punishable then they will just sit on a gen and not react as the killer approaches, how can you prove they weren't distracted, or in chase they will just go down quickly by greeding everything or running to a deadzone.
Basically, no matter how hard you try, you would end up needing to have some sort of manual review process for what is essentially inting in league. And given DBD's track record of requiring an ingame report and a recording, you would need both of those, and on top of that be able to prove that their play was throwing. I have no faith in BHVR to implement and maintain any sort of punishment system like this. They could throw together an anti-AFK system like they do for killers but once survivors learn about it they will do the method I described. In a different type of game it could probably work better but I just don't see it working here.
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My opinion is it should stay. Simply put, you cannot force someone who does not want to play, to play, they will simply AFK, or play poorly, and you cannot snuff out all of these methods. If you try to make such an action reportable, they will simply play really poorly and it will be impossible to prove, and clog the report system. When it is justifiable to do so is more controversial, but I think everyone agrees that if someone else on your team has already quit or it's a 2v1 and you want to give your teammate to hatch then it is fine to "go next".
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@Viciusaurus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829417#Comment_3829417
I've yet to play Knight! Is he easy to pick up? I've heard he can he a bit buggy, unless that's been fixed. His guards do seem like fun though :)
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829445#Comment_3829445
It sounds quite nasty on Doctor, I'll have to give the video a look! Thank you for the suggestion!!
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829447#Comment_3829447
Scratched Mirror Myers has always been one of my favorites. I might have to see if Batteries Included can help his speed some.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3829466#Comment_3829466
Susie going vrrroom sounds right up my alley! I like the idea of stealth Demo. Entity knows I have never actually played him since I bought him years back. This could be a good build to try to get into him. The Doc buold soinds exciting! Do you know if using Dark Devotion and Unforeseen grants two separate Terror Radii at once, or must it be chosen? This one sounds like it can bring lots of chaos.
Dark Devotion + Unforeseen used to grant 2 terror radiuses on the PTB, but it's since been patched so you can only have one :(
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Agreed, would be perfect information to see in the match info or another tab in the pause menu midgame.
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Some fun builds that might have been covered on youtube before:
Endgame speed legion: BFFs add-on with noed, no way out, machine learning, batteries included. Make sure machine learning activates when the final gen pops and you will be incredibly fast.
Stealth demogorgon: run vermillion webcap with red moss, ideally on an indoor map. Bring perks like tinkerer, discordance, spies, etc to discern location of survivors, and then use portals to sneak up on them. Exiting portals is silent and you have 16 seconds of undetectable after exiting, which means you can refresh the undetectable before you lose it by going into another portal. You can take off vermillion webcap and substitute it with another add-on that buffs portals if it suits you, and you would still have 13 seconds of undetectable.
Remote shock doctor: Bring unforseen, dark devotion, and two perks of your choice. I like quick gambit to change obsession and something to debuff survivors in your terror radius, like coulrophobia or unnerving presence. Kick a gen or hit the obsession to give them your terror radius, then you can remotely apply static blast through that terror radius at another time for massive confusion. Even better if you have a debuff perk or two that you can stick to the obsession or a generator!
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I main both roles. Mostly play solo except when the rare occasion a friend wants to play the game with me.
As both sides, I do not BM unless I am BM'd first - I should probably be the better person but reciprocating feels great. So as survivor, I don't do the "watch me leave" at the gates unless the killer was hitting me on hook or WSing, and vice versa as killer.
As killer, I do not actively camp or tunnel unless I am being destroyed and have no other chances to come back into the game, never at 5 gens. If someone tries to suicide on hook and run into me to go next and ruin their teammates' game, they will be ignored and slugged for 4 minutes - this is the only time I do this as I find screwing your team over incredibly offensive and boring for both sides.
Aside from that I usually just play the game for achievements and tome challenges, as I have so many hours in this game now that I've done really everything else.
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As others have said, bots always know where you are (but only act on it if you're close) and have pre-determined "paths" to follow for any loop that they are at. They will always run that path and double back immediately if necessary if you switch directions. They are also incredibly aware of projectile attacks and will dodge with 0ms reaction time. The best way to beat a bot is to exploit its weaknesses in programming - they are scared of the terror radius so you can pressure them easily and they will attempt to play bad tiles rather than make distance (like z-walls)
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Anything OK or above I have no qualms playing against. Characters in "meh" it depends on playstyle, for example many pyramid heads do not use their power in fun ways like wall snipes but rather boring zoning at pallets, but the ones that don't can be fun. Boring tier is killers whose gameplay I really just do not enjoy at all.
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And of course if the survivor is way better than me and wins mindgames, they can force that window to block too but then they need another tile, there is no pallet to fall back on.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3828685#Comment_3828685
Oh, believe me. I'd rather chase an insane survivor around the shack or a jungle gym than a TL wall. If you haven't seen what some survivors can do with these, you're really missing out.
Luckily very few survivors are actually on that level.
The thing about TL walls is that as an M1 killer you have counterplay. Again, assuming no exhaustion or tile chaining it only takes 1 vault before you are in a position to mindgame. An insane survivor can get guaranteed no counterplay value at low ping on shack/gyms with checkspots, there are no safe checkspots on TL walls. I'd much rather chase someone there where I have opportunities to cut the chase short.
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@bjorksnas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3828670#Comment_3828670
Its generous if there is a survivor within 16m of the hook not 16m of the killer, if you can keep dragging a killer around the hook but stay outside of 16m you can get a ton of progress, its not currently used because no one can see it but like all things in dbd it will be pushed to its limits if people can see it
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say this doesn't happen, given how precise a survivor would have to be with the distance and where the loop would be. You'd need a loop that is partially inside the 16m range. Even if we assume that the killer is always counted as 16 meters away and no survivor is counted, that would give the anticamp 0.5 charges per second and it would take 200 seconds to fill the bar. At that point, even if you exclude the free grace period the killer has when the hook happens, the survivor would still die well before the unhook ever happens. Even if the survivors saw this bar I doubt that would change anything if you actually look at the numbers involved.
Keep in mind, even if the bar goes to 99% it doesn't matter, as long as it doesn't fill up nothing has changed.
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The only change aura needs is letting survivors know when their aura is revealed like in 2v8. Distortion still counters lethal's main ability and with this the +2 seconds are not a problem.
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p2w implies paying gives you something more powerful than what you'd have if you didn't pay, and nurse still exists, so not really.
The most pay to win aspect of this game is easily perks, the most key perks on both sides but especially on the killer side are locked behind either soft or hard paywalls.
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@TragicSolitude said:
This is why I keep Lightborn equipped and get annoyed when people are like, "just look at a wall." I've been blinded by survivors well outside my POV, I've been blinded at near or even actual 90-degree angles. (Add the console issues on top of all that and yeah, I haven't unequipped Lightborn for years).
It would be nice if BHVR would fix blinds. I used to be able to counter them back in the day. Used to. Something changed and it's never been fixed.
I'm all for hyperbole but you can't get blinded at 90 degree angles with a flashlight and never have been able to. Eating walls still counters flashlights, at least at the default killer FOV (and even with the highest setting, you'd need 180 FOV for a 90 degree blind…)
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3828162#Comment_3828162
The problem is that the killer doesn't have that many perk slots. It's exactly 4. Weaker killers don't need other perks than stronger killers, they need additional ones. Meaning, a stronger killer will get to play with a good build and deal with such strong loops, while a M1 killer will can either play with such a strong build or deal with those loops. They can't do both. This doesn't mean that a M1 killer can't win but that they are at a significant disadvantage.
I agree that good loops are necessary to deal with killers that already have powerful chase abilities. I just wish that M1 killers didn't always get the short end of the stick. On top of being reliant on certain perks more than other killers, they are also expected to equip additional perks for something that stronger killers can deal with either way.
Also, I'm not sure that there are more unsafe than safe loops. Most main buildings (even the ones that aren't as powerful) are safe, TL walls, if played correctly are damn strong, jungle gyms are safe, all shacks are safe, variant gyms are about 50/50 between safe and unsafe, all filler loops on Eyrie of Crows are safe (literally all of them have check spots), all filler loops on GoJ are safe and connected to other strong loops, most loops on the McMillan maps are safe, the same goes for Autohaven Wreckers, all loops on The Game are ungodly safe (there is exactly one pallet, that is weak and even that can become strong if you chain it)... I could go on but you get the idea. Survivors have LOTS of strong loops.
The issue is, that on some maps you have tons of those and on others you have 2 good loops and 4 useless loops (Haddonfield comes to mind). Ironically the maps with good loops usually have large amounts of resources while those with terrible loops have very few.
M1 killers are typically quite bad at zoning too by virtue of being M1 killers. If they don't have a power to support them in chase, they have no way to zone a survivor, if the loop they are on isn't useless already. In which case, why would you zone them? On a jungle gym a M1 killer in general has no way to zone. As long as you have some distance or a wall between you and the killer, they are no threat to you (other than Doctor, whom I wouldn't consider weak against jungle gyms either way), so you don't need to leave a loop and there is nothing they can do about it. I mean, what are they supposed to do? Come from 2 directions at once? If you aren't playing Dredge or Twins, this isn't possible and those 2 have little trouble dealing with jungle gyms.
Leaving is also something that works in theory but typically not for M1 killers. Most of them have one thing in common. They don't have great mobility, so if they leave a survivor, it will take a while for them to actually get to another. And what is to stop them from running to the same safe set up, that you just came from? You can of course try to cut them off but most survivors run exhaustion perks that allow them to get extra distance which they can use to run around you. And if that doesn't work, then they still have the opportunity to use the speed boost after a hit to get there. Are you going to leave them again? Sure, you got them away from a gen and they will need to heal, so you have slowed down the game but you haven't actually progressed. Meaning, you are still in a worse spot than you were before. The next problem is that you also don't get to use your slowdown perks, if you don't progress. This is a downwards spiral.
Cool writeup, but TL walls on their own are not strong at all, they are probably slightly killer sided. On their own, you rely on mindgames or suboptimal play from your opponent to make more than 1 vault without getting hit (against M1 killers). Even checkspots are 50/50s on this tile.
They are strong if and only if they have another tile or resource nearby you can chain to, or if you have Lithe to use them to move somewhere else.
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@bjorksnas said:
I think it would be a bit too abusable
How?
This would only do anything if survivors notice the bar filling up. Are they going to abuse it by bringing the killer to the hook? Maybe you haven't seen it in action, but it is very generous to the killer if there's a survivor nearby.
The only thing this change is realistically going to do is allow survivors to be more efficient when a killer is camping, which is a good thing.
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Unfortunately, a lot of times unless you've brought certain perks or you're in a 4 man SWF there is no reason to try and help against a tunneler, it is more efficient to sit on gens than be altruistic. I have also seen a lot of tunneling in my survivor matches since the event started.
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Because of how strong and easy tunneling is compared to spreading hooks, there is no real incentive that would make spreading hooks better than tunneling without flat-out breaking the game if the killer chooses to tunnel. So any incentives would have to come after huge tunnel prevention changes.
But ignoring that (we could always push incentives first and see how bad it gets), basekit 60s of gen blocking on the generator closest to the hook and a 10 or 15% pop after hooking a survivor you haven't hooked in a row. Now I don't have to worry about someone insta unhooking and two-manning a nearly completed gen by the hook, and I get a little incentive to go away and apply my pop somewhere else. The gen blockage also means I'm disincentivized from camping the gen by the hook or hooking by a gen to pop and then camp it.
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@CleanseThis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3826360#Comment_3826360
WoO and old Zanshin were 1 to 1 perks. Do you think survivors get more value from WoO than killers got from old Zanshin if so why? if not why?
Depends on the skill level of the players. I'll use my level (4000 hours ingame) as an example. At my level, I think the value survivors get is more than what killers got, because most maps it is not difficult to know pallet and window locations on. For me as a killer and for killers around my level, the only real utility is when there's a new map or event that introduces resources (void, temporary pallets) or the killer wants to turn their brain off and not worry about what resources they've already depleted. For survivor, it's basically the same but provides a bit of extra utility for solo queue and seeing the killer break a pallet or breakable wall through walls.
In general, considering the average skill level, I also think survivors make more of it than killers do (probably a lot more so), as simply being able to get to a resource is very important for survivor and gives more than the killer knowing what resource is ahead. Killers can use it to zone survivors, but in general suboptimal survivors being able to avoid deadzones is a huge plus that's hard to outweigh with Zanshin.
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@jajay119 said:
saying this for about the 50th time: a bleed out button would incentivise slugging, not discourage the killers from doing it and that’s what’s any solution should do.
Not really.
Killers that want to play for survivors ragequitting can already do so, survivor can always go AFK or DC and leave behind an easily manipulated bot. A "bleed self out" button as one of the final two survivors would disincentivize slugging, because if you leave them on the floor they can bleed out and the other guy can find hatch, whereas hooking gives you more time before the sacrifice.
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@NarkoTri1er said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3826362#Comment_3826362
this perk highlights the "most important resources" while at the same time your teammate might be working a gen on a tile you are taking killer to during chase just because you see yellow and you run to yellow :)
I mean yeah that happens a lot in solo queue. But the average player is very much not good at the game, so that's why I'm not surprised that a perk meant to help in chase like this is among the top ones. Your own survival is #1 in solo queue, team play is often disregarded.
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My prediction:
Mastermind - hindered slowdown buff on infection, or faster infection buildup
Lich - Small number buffs for spells.
Good Guy - addon nerfs (jump rope, drill, razor, rat poison) and cooldown increase, maybe patch some bugs.
Ghost Face - Some kind of buff. Hard to imagine what, given they've buffed almost every aspect of his kit, and I can't imagine they'd bother fixing the jank with lean stalking.
Shape - Tier 1 and stalk buffs, maybe partial basekit stalk speed add-on, and tombstone nerfs.
Dark Lord - Bat form and medusa hair nerfs.
Demogorgon - Portal buffs (setting speed and traversal perhaps).
I would be very surprised if Vecna gets nerfed, if it happens it is probably going to be something related to Flight of the Damned
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I feel like the most likely tweak is something about gates you open or touch to be shown to teammates at all times, or something like that. Showing your aura while opening is good, but I still see a lot of survivors who have no idea where the gates are, that might be what they aim to address?
Total shot in the dark though. We have no idea of knowing.
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Resident Evil has a lot more success but FNAF has a lot more "frequently online" fans, so it is possible. Depends on how good the characters, perk, and map(?) are though, if they're awful I can see people taking a break until the hype dies down.
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Agreed. I've seen a good suggestion for a "pick self up ritual" where a survivor can crawl directly under a working hook and pick themselves up, but good luck indicating that this is a feature to players with a UI element. A simple "bleed out faster" or give up if you're slugged as one of two would be nice.
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@BurnedTerrormisu said:
The time he can spend in bat form should be limited, also there should be a significant recharge after he used bat form.
I think you could be a bit less harsh with the nerf and still achieve the desired effect - after switching out of bat form, a timer cooldown before you can go into it again. I think spending a lot of time in bat form is fine for map coverage and scouting, you can stealth it if he's not following you mid chase, and it only takes a couple seconds in chase to catch back up.
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Depends on the person and the game.
Skills fade if you don't practice them so I would not fault yourself for being rusty when you come back. If you play a lot of different killers it can also be harder to re-adjust to using all of their powers in addition to the traditional M1 killer skillset.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3826360#Comment_3826360
Survivors running tiles based on their knowledge and awareness is more fun to play against than pallet autopilots.
Survivors that run tiles aren't predropping or doing brainless hold W to yellow, which is the issue yes?
I agree that actually playing tiles is more fun than running to the pallet and dropping it. My question is why you think this is something that would go away without Windows.The proper way to encourage survivors to play tiles isn't to try and prevent them from knowing what resources are nearby - that isn't viable with knowledgeable players anyway. It's proper map and killer balance.
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@NarkoTri1er said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3825950#Comment_3825950
don't you see anything strange with a perk that is supposed to be a training wheel actually being #1 perk by pickrate amongst survivors?
The average survivor is bad at the game and this perk highlights the most important resources needed for the most skilled part of gameplay (the chase), not that weird to me.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3825854#Comment_3825854
At least then they'd have to learn the maps instead of letting the yellow glow autopilot them from tile to tile.
And once they do learn the maps?
Would you say to yourself after seeing survivors predrop pallets "oh well, at least they learned where the set pallet spawns are or can recognize a jungle gym, I no longer have any complaints"? Would you go against a full slowdown midwich nurse and say "well she's not using aura so this is completely fine"?
Be real with yourself.
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@Caiman said:
Going against a survivor who is obviously running it and just mindlessly running from pallet to vault to pallet to vault is simply boring to play against. Killers can play boring and survivors can too.
I agree with you that playing against shift W predrop can be boring on certain maps as lower tier killers.
A question for you then: Why is this Windows of Opportunity's fault?
If you nerf WoO, let's say even remove it from the game, the playstyle remains. Balance wise, nothing changes, only the playstyle becomes a bit harder to use (but not by much). Anyone with a decent amount of hours or good map knowledge can still do it. It's still just as strong.
A much better solution is more balanced maps (so not Gideon Meat Plant) and buffs for lower tiers. A windows nerf only helps if all of your opponents are so new that they don't know the map.
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If by #1 you mean his endgame add-on, I don't find that as much of a problem since it only works in endgame.
Aside from that yeah he is riddled with bugs, all scampers under pallets (have not tested windows) will make him look and sound like he is ending his dash with a swing but he's actually scampering, so you can't tell unless you know to look for it. Additionally you can use your power AFTER hidey-ho ends and it will recharge mid dash (!!!) and be available faster after you finish using it.
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All new maps and reworks have very unsafe tiles. Tiles have generally been made more unsafe with the introduction of more variants to the classic maps and new maps like greenville/dungeon are mostly made up of unsafe loops but might be unbalanced in other ways to accommodate for it (dungeon loop with window).
I surely can't be the only one that remembers the AWFUL new tile they introduced to autohaven with the world's unsafest pallet and a terrible window, that could replace every other tile on the map, until BHVR got their sense together and removed it.
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Bat is the strongest because you can very quickly shift to and from it, it moves insanely fast, you can hover in between pallets/vaults to cause a 50/50 when transforming back, you can teleport to vault locations, and you can use it as a spirit phase with enhanced audio. It is so good that it makes wolf form completely obsolete for following up after a hit when in normal form, as you can just shift to bat and use your ears to close the gap.
His weakest form after the hug tech removal is wolf.
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As mentioned. You can use it as a pseudo "ignore" list for survivors, as you can check to see if they're blocked in your pregame lobby, but it really doesn't do anything matchmaking wise.
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Limit survivor actions, such as only medium vaults for survivors with Deep Wounds (lethality)
Hindred on deep wounds 10%
Tunneling is good enough as is
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@Perfect_Dank said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3825532#Comment_3825532
Ohh that tracks... I play so little survivor i had no clue. Has this always been the case?
Yes, since its introduction I believe. Since there isn't really much else for the killer to do if the gates are already opened.
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Because people don't like the information it gives.
I think asking for a WOO nerf is silly and naive, and doesn't resolve any issues these people have. But to play devil's advocate, it is the most popular survivor perk at this moment and it gives the map knowledge of a studious veteran on comms to anyone who runs it, so they don't path to deadzones.
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Had a blight game on Ormond today where one of the survivors was way better than the rest and super hard to catch. Near the end of the game we collectively agreed to practice some chases before she took the hatch. She outplayed me on shack but I managed to outplay her at the next tile. Very good feeling to find a likeminded player and communicate without any way of typing or talking to each other like that.
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I'm sorry to hear you had an experience like that. I had a game today where a survivor decided to try to go next at 5 gens and ruin the game for their team (attempt on hook, got unhooked, ran in my face mid chase) and everyone stopped what they were doing to teabag this guy on the ground until he DC'd for being such a poor sport. Then I let them go after we practiced 1v1s at shack. Anecdotal, and you won't get it every game, but there are still good natured players out there that care about both sides' fun.
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As survivor:
Hex: Pentimento
Scourge Hook: Gift Of Pain
Lightborn
Knock Out
Franklin's Demise
Scourge Hook: Pain Resonance and Pop Goes the Weasel (only when paired together)
Hex: No One Escapes Death (in non endgame builds)
As killer:
Lightweight (Losing a survivor because you were baited by bad scratch mark placement feels horrible)
Iron Will / Light-Footed (100% silence for unlimited time is just bad game design imo and prevents me from using my ears in chase for no justifiable reason)
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Quick question, why is there a "+4 more" on a ROADMAP meant for transparency? Let us know what's being worked on, otherwise what's the point?
Please tell us what the rest of the planned changes are too.
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@adaw0ng said:
Does somebody remember how when the anti-camp mechanic was introduced everybody was concerned about Leatherface being able to stil camp and double tap through it, making it even impossible to trade if he knew well where to stand? It was said that Leatherface would not be able to do such thing and yet it's a lie since he is pretty much still able to down the unhooker and the unhooked survivor, let alone the solo survivor if they self-unhook. It's been a year since this mechanic was implemented and it's been not looked into ever since despite it being mentioned that this would not be possible to do for Leatherface.
Edit note: I have found this even easier to do after the buffs he received to his base-kit this year.I think I recall this being a thing in the PTB where the feature was released? I remember twitch streamers testing the changes and something like that being a thing, but it doesn't seem to be working now. While playing Leatherface I've downed an unlucky unhooker and the guy getting unhooked in a single saw without using any add-ons. It probably shouldn't work that way
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I have noticed an uptick in this as well. Unfortunately, depending on the strength of the killer and survivor being chased, oftentimes altruistic measures to prevent tunneling are game losing compared to sitting on gens.
Babysitter, Reassurance, For The People, Syringes and Sabo builds are options to try to counter it.
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@PuddleOfBludd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3823851#Comment_3823851
If you are the first hook and your teammates are not making the effort to save you or trade, if they have to, then this lies in the fault of your teammates you shouldn’t just be given a free pass. You got caught, it sucks yes. But this is where the four verses one comes into play you have three people that are capable of removing you from the hook so that you have your agency again. The fact of the matter is in a game, where it is four versus one, one of those four people is going to be the unlucky one that gets got first. You don’t have to like it but that’s the reality of it. And the game shouldn’t be changed to make you equal to the killer when there are four of you.
This has nothing to do with being equal to the killer. There are plenty of scenarios where not saving the person on the hook and letting them die is the right play. For example, basement against a camping Huntress, or when a camping nurse has anti-heal and pain res. Getting caught first or at all is fine. Most people, myself included, just want the game to be balanced around more fun forms of gameplay with limitations on unhealthy gameplay on both sides. Survivors will never be "equal to the killer" as long as they can be downed and hooked by them, most people just want the opportunity to play the game in the way it was designed and (likely) advertised to them.
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I wouldn't say the frequency of killers I face has changed. But I have noticed both sides playing a lot sweatier, which I suspect is the reason you're seeing stronger character picks from your opponents.
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@PuddleOfBludd said:
The fact that you have people complaining that they’re not able to do something the entire game if they’ve got caught and hooked or slugged or whatever is ridiculous. It’s entitlement. It’s an elimination game. One person is going to have gameplay mechanics taken away from them as a CONSEQUENCE of being caught. To complain about that is laughable.
And I will tell you right now that when I get hooked, I’m not thinking about the fact that I can’t do generators or I can’t cleanse totems or whatever else. This is about the fact that you don’t like to lose. That’s it plain and simple all of this agency being taken away and you unable to do things and not have fun is a strawman argument for the fact that you are a sore loser.
Never once at any time that I have been hooked, have I sat there and thought about how the killer has ruined my game because I can’t do generators or cleanse totems. When you are on the hook, the only thing that you are pissy about is the fact that you are losing. And every single one of these threads that pop up about this needs to be changed and that needs to be changed because we should be able to have fun, all you are saying is you need to make it so that the survivors can win all of the time. All four survivors should be able to play 100% of the game and screw the killer. No that’s not how it works. You get caught you get hooked or you get left on the ground. That’s the consequence of losing the chase. The game nor your opponent owes you anything.
Not necessarily.
There is a reason this game is built around multiple chances. It is fun to get back into the game (and to help others get back into the game). When games last longer and have multiple opportunities to play, they are more fun. This is why many competitive multiplayer games moved toward respawn formats (such as point based TDM, capture the point/flag, reboot/revive) or have multiple elimination rounds in quick succession, so that even if you are eliminated you don't wait long to come back.
Sure, some people complaining just want to win and nothing else, but you can't hand-wave away a lot of valid complaints about loss of agency. If I get chased by a nurse like this one here who decides to camp like this, I get one chase, maybe 1 minute or less if they are really good, then I spend 140 seconds on the hook, then back to lobby, etc. I have very few chances to interact with my teammates and the killer. If I go against a nurse who doesn't play like this, I might get another one or two chases in before dying, which is just objectively more fun. Not to mention, all 3 of OP's teammates are encouraged by the game to sit on generators and NOT go for killer interaction or altruism, which is also boring.
Even if survivors 3 man escape against a proxy camping killer by playing optimally, you can't tell me that their complaints of the game being boring are just them just wanting 4 man outs every game. Doing gens all game and avoiding a camping killer with zero interaction is not that fun.
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Lithe only gives you a speed boost after the vault animation finishes and you start moving, at which point you should be out of aim dressing range.
Doesn't really have anything to do with lithe but more with trying for close hits while scraping along a wall while a survivor is fast vaulting, as the game turns your camera toward the survivor and makes you hit the wall. If anything, Finesse would be the perk making it worse.