imakepeoplehateme
imakepeoplehateme
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3392607#Comment_3392607
Self-Care.
DS.
DH.
MoM.
We'll Make It.
OoO.
Should I keep going?
It is so difficult for you to argue your point that you are literally bringing up ancient perk changes.Self care,We'll Make it and OoO were changed over 5 years ago,thats an unfair arguement,that once againt overlooks my argued point(I specifically stated in recent years).MoM triggering on every hit was game breaking,even bringig it up as an argument is disingenuous. The only time that perk was good was when it broke the game,it wasn't a perk used over a long period of timed altered to irrelevance for the sake of change.
Ds was brought up in my original post(along with Iron Will),but to further discuss it,they gave survivor base kit bt as a safety measure,and added off the record in the same patch,a perk serving a similar purpose,better in some scenarios and worse in others.The perk also still keeps a niche use case.You can tank a bit with basekit bt,use Ds and still have deadhard,effectively tanking 3 hits for free,so i would say its far from dead.
Dh is literally just being discussed and altered,the changes are not even final,and i guarantee you it will see more use than ruin,cob and eruption combine in 2 months.
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@Pulsar said:
DH is definitely dead.
Pain Res got buffed from the PTB.
CoH got its main strength completely removed.
You can't use Dh in your first chase,any chase after thats if fair game.Just like its first nerf,people are overeacting,good players will still get value out of it.
Pain res did not get buffed.They just chose not to kill it,it's definitely worse than it previous iteration.If the devs consider it a buff just revert the changes then,i'm sure you wouldn't mind.
CoH is still strong.It doesn't break the game anymore,and its hard to use in solo queue,but swf will abuse the heck out of it.
It also feels like you didn't read my post.Never did i mention pain res in it,nor is it an attempt at answering the injustice being commited,devs can't just alt f4 a survivor perk for good and it shows
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@[Deleted User] said:
This isn't intended to be a commentary about OP or anything, but I think the average killer player tends to be extremely vocal while overestimating their own abilities. There may be a simple reason that killer slowdowns got nerfed harshly relative to some other changes: killer slowdowns were affecting games more, especially at the top end. I have as much data as next person around here, which is to say, none. But if we're trying to find a reason, that's a good place to start. And we have to remember that many killers find a 70% win rate to be a balance issue not in their favor. If we're trying to look at this objectively, being able to stall out a game indefinitely with gen kick perks wasn't healthy.
You brought up a very good point,and you also did not use it as an insult towards me so you have my respect.I fully agree that gen kicking perks were toxic for the game.Holding a 3 gens like your life depends on it is indeed obnoxious ,and i'm glad it got addressed. I personally never used No were to hide,Call of Brine or Overcharge,i dread kicking gens,but their changes do strengthen my point.
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@Clueless said:
With the new DH the counter is to just tunnel.
If you hit the unhooked during the free BT there is no more DH for the chase and rehooking them isn't going to give another use.
If you chase the unhooker, the unhooked gets to heal and STILL has DH. And when you down the second survivor you just gave another survivor DH.
When playing killer just tunnel. It is almost always the right move.
@philward1953 said:
"DH still keeps its annoying aspect of not being able to lunge with confidence,it's been meta since release and probably the most complained survivor perk,can't we just remove it already?"
It's literally been killed off. You're only ever gonna encounter DH now if you're tunneling.
You will need to kill a survivor at some point.The perk also does not deactivate after a minute,or conspicuous action,so if they have it you will still encounter it.Even worse you will expect it less,becoming more effective as a result.You just spare killers from encountering it in their first two chases.After that its back to the same thing.
Its such a frustrating perk to face,litteraly prevents you from downing survivors as quickly as possible in a fast paced game,reiterating my main point that they can't just mess it up, like ruin a perk that went from the most used perk in the game to a tragedy
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@philward1953 said:
DH was literally just killed off.
Pain Res. was just buffed from the last patch notes.
COH is objectively less powerful.
...What are you talking about? Yes we've seen a lot of changes with killer perks, but the survivor perks you've complained about have been nerfed.
Pain Res did not get buffed.Its a rework at best.You need to keep in mind how inconsistent it will become.It only proks once on a different survivors,you need to hook them on one of the 4 hooks.It doesn't reward you for quick chases like before,and it lacks the ability to be delivered it where and when its needed like old pop.
CoH is less powerful yes,but its still like a top 10 perk.Why didn't they leave it be,and murder a survivor perk for once,thats the point of my post.
@Firellius said:
DH still keeps its annoying aspect of not being able to lunge with confidence,it's been meta since release and probably the most complained survivor perk,can't we just remove it already?
You know, de facto, who can have it, and who can't. It's still going to be a really trash perk after this change, assuming that they stuck with the 'it deactivates whether it works or not'. Even without that second nerf, I'd still say the perk is not worth using.
Dh is weaker,no arguing here but its still annoying to face.They changed it so many times and yet it will still be used.Name a killer perk that received the same treatment.
My point still stands,they are afraid to out right remove a survivor perk from the game,while they don't hesitate to do it to killer.
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@I_am_Negan said:
What you describing is just being chased.
Tunneling is downing and hooking someone, camping or returning to the hook when they get unhooked nothing else matters just tunnel that one player down to place them back on the hook again.
But we all have our own opinions on what tunneling is.
@Phantom_ said:
Your title should be "being chased is fun", since that's what you're actually describing.
I feel like more and more people don't even know anymore what tunneling/face-camping is and just throw around the words they hear 😅
I dissagree,killes don't fully commit to you unless they are terrible or tunneling.An example would be if make it to a fun buss with a middle window tough luck,the killer HAS to mindgame it,and if shack happens to be near thats a wrap.But when the killer is just chasing you he will leave the moment he realises the tile ahead is to strong.
@Cassiopeiae said:
It's not that bad as long as I've got something to loop. If you get hooked in the basement or a deadzone you are pretty much F'd. Having nothing to loop and going down to a Pepega because of it is quite frustrating.
It's also not fun at all for the other 3 people that will (hopefully) just be doing gens to go next.
The 10 seconds of bt plus the speed boost allow you to get to safety 90% of the time.If somehow they don't or it's a common occurrence just bring ds,or off the record or get a teammate to body block for you.
@Saiph said:
The problem with tunneling is not when you're the one getting tunneled, but rather when your (incompetent) teammate is tunneled and you lose the game without anything in your control
Fully agree,I even mentioned it in my post above,that having someone else in your team get tunneled sucks
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Bad timing on my part I must say,the update released while i was writing my post.Glad to hear changes are on their way to make the game healthier!
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@Annso_x said:
1 - That's the goal? Why would you want to buff meta killers? There's no point in making M1 killers better if you keep the gap between them and meta killers the same. Also bloodlust has been buffed too! So killers who know when to break pallets win bc it'll take less time to do and killers who don't kick pallets because they're bad also win because BHVR said so.
2 - The kick means survivor can't tap generators mid-chase anymore. It means kicking gens is actually useful now and also it takes less time to do. Also 10s gen increase means every single thing related to gen speed slowdown (add-ons & perks) has been buffed, because x% of 90s is higher than x% of 80s. 4 stacks of Thana alone will mean a gen takes 115 seconds to complete, that's insanely good (for killers, survivors will cry themselves to sleep thinking about forever plague and legion)
Ruin has been nerfed too hard I agree, it shouldn't be a hex anymore or the desactivation effect should be deleted, but both is way overkill. And the slowdown speed hasn't actually been reduced by half, bc 90>80.
POP is still good if you use it properly. Also it probably gets the extra 2.5% from the kick buff?
PR and DMS are stil veryl good on their own, but they were way too op together. The combo still works if you actually make the effort of pressuring the gen instead of getting free pressure + block a gen + know where the survivor is. You can just equip BBQ and still gain the same effect, if you work for it a little bit.
Also overcharge, jolt, thana, eruption have been buffed, and they're all gen perks, you'll be fine. Monstrous shrine buff is also very good.
On the survivor side, 5s BT is nothing if the killer wants to tunnel. DS won't be used anymore, DH for distance is dead (we'll have to wait for the ptb to judge the rest), OTR will probably be nerfed before it goes live, IW and Spine chill were nerfed to the ground, Self-care is even worse and calm spirit got the nerf it desperatly needed (I'm still not over it). Only lightweight and botany got actual good buffs on the survivor side (and OTR, but again i doubt it'll make it live).
In conclusion killers will be stronger in chases and survivors will take longer to do gens. Camping has been buffed unintentionnally (survivors can't "just do gens and leave" when the gens take longer but the hook stage weren't increased, and monstrous shrine makes it deplete a whole 20% faster). So no, i can hardly imagine how the kill rates would drop.
How many meta killers are in the game?The only ones that can really compete are blight and nurse,they aren’t getting buffed in this patch and yeah that’s a good thing,but neither are the other killers.The point I tried to make in my post was that the survivor meta perks got buffed while the kiler ones got nerfed.
Bt is stronger and not mandatory to run,OtR is a stronger ds.
Yeah iron will,spine chill,self care got nerfed but it doesn’t matter,they aren’t the perks you fear at a high level.As mentioned in my post above you mostly run these for comfort they aren’t the strongest perks.Ds,bt stops tunneling you can’t compete with them.Prove makes gens pop faster,and makes breaking a 3 gen so much easier.COH is beyond broken as you can place it far from the killer/obj.1 unbreakable completely kills a slug.All of these perks are stronger than spine chill and self care yet they weren’t nerfed.
The fact that Bt is basekit means you have an extra slot for one of the aforementioned perks making games even harder for killers.
The extra 10 seconds per gen won’t mean much as during you first chase you will lose a lot of gens.Losing 2 gens for your first down is the norm,that’s why killers stacked regression so that once they got the pressure going they could keep it.They nerfed all the viable regression perks without significantly buffing other to compensate.
The buffs they gave to m1 killers isn't significant enough for them to be feared in chase.M1 killers are weak due to the bad map design,the changes won't do much and the nerfed reggression will hit them harder than other killers.
Also bloodlust,really?B1 is still the same,and that the only relevant one,if a chase lasts long enough for it to get to tier 2-3 thats either a broken setup,bad matchmaking or a killer bloodlusting a pallet,in which case they lose to much time for it to be worth it.
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@GreyBigfoot said:
I wouldn't call it so early. That Monstrous Shrine buff is gonna be, well, monstrous. 20% is a lot faster than people realize.
And the slower gens means that every regression perk saves more time than before.
I disagree I don’t belive mostrous will be that good.It doesn’t slow down gens,get you downs faster neither does it help you snowball a game.With the nerfs to pain res and the distance requirement I don’t think it will see much play outside of fun builds.
I see your point with the gens perks being more effective but what perks are left?The only ones I can think of are thana and deadlock.I don’t belive the gen kicking perks will be that good,you just give up to much pressure to kick gens.
We will definitely need to wait and see how the changes play out