Traslogan
Traslogan
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- Traslogan
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Idk how much the map offerings influence it, but I would say I rarely see anyone use them overall, and it just likes to pick Coldwind farm. It's like its the default pick and has a bonus chance or something.
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I think tighter ranking with SWF would help a little, but it wouldn't return the balance overall. The ranking system is a tedious at best imo, given that if you take a break at the right time you can basically be a smurf from rank-reset a fortnight after the reset happened. It's tough to gauge the validity of a rank versus the skill it implies.
And yeah no one from the DBD team looks at the steam discussions at all. I've already said they should delete it and just put 1 sticky thread up saying they were ignoring it and that they should come to the forums, since the DBD steam discussions is actually more active than the forums themselves.
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I personally get peeved as I main The Shape, and no amount of aggression defeats a cornfield stopping your stalking whilst they can still see you. It's a nice challenge, but not at the frequency lol.
I do feel there could be a system where it checks the latest maps the 5 players have been on, and it works out what they've played the least between them, thus trying to keep map frequency balanced.
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We've already said we're against removing SWF and trying to block voice comms...In this very thread...
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My problem is whenever I play solo survivor I end up with a killer who finds the hatch whilst the 2nd last is on the hook, so they can insta-activate EGC and then they just find you and that's it, they will never let you go and you can't escape, unless by extreme luck you get an entire gate open in the time it takes them to check the wrong one.
that said, imo EGC has done very little. Now Killers can railroad the last survivor and SWF teams still just stand at the gate until 1s before EGC ends or until you come and knock them out of the map.
Also lol, the killer is fully at a disadvantage due to SWF spam with comms. The Killer wipes the floor with solo survivors, then SWF become nigh-invincible against the killer. The entire balance of the game is bad.
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I understand survivors want to have fun, but as a killer main I want to have fun too. It's not like I'm saying "ugh good survivors who get generators only to 99% to increase your patrol are a bad thing", but I am saying that SWF is breaking the game, especially here on whatever servers I'm on where it's as good as 99% SWF (As I said earlier, I often don't even see a single solo survivor at all and then 5-10 minutes pass and it just throws yet another 4-man SWF at me)
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I think it's unrelated to the fact that SWF rigging is a huge issue and we don't even have anything as simple as safety from deranking if we go against SWF teams that are communicating to give a massive advantage.
The "not all SWF teams are pro" argument doesn't really do much to counter that either. Being pro isn't even immensely relevant if they actually use their microphones.
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The one dude who advocated for removing SWF was shot down even by me. We said it immensely changes the balance and stops it being fun for a killer. Literally SWF players have come in and agreed when the other SWF players aren't flaming.
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I already said previously I check for SWF because it's so common. I didn't say "I see a high rank and thus I believe it's SWF".
Once again just misinterpreting the entire thread.
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Clearly you're not reading the past 2 pages of stuff where we've said we aren't advocating for removing SWF. You're just derailing the argument.
So far the only arguments against countering comms-SWF are:
1: Lol git gud I don't want SWF countered
2: Derail the thread by ignoring the arguments.
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still as usual, I get no one, not even a single solo survivor, in my lobbies. It's like the game intentionally waits for SWF. Somehow the game wants me to believe there isn't even a single survivor it could find at plus or minus 6 ranks of rank 10 (We all know it will gladly put a rank 4 or 16 in a rank 10 killer game), it's not even like one or two solo players come in and then quit, literally none appear... There's nothing left of DBD but this on the UK/EU servers.
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no point imo, hex placement is so RNG that they often just get put in the open with nothing to hide them and they become 100% obsolete, and SWF will just brute force your Hexes anyway.
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I didn't say anything about t-bagging? I said about them sitting at the edge of the exit so that you can do literally nothing except help them escape.
Maybe go play killer against the hordes of SWF and stare at them standing on the exit border for 120s
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Whilst the killer does need incentive not to facecamp, remember they take solid pip loss from being in the general vicinity of hooked survivors (Which means even just going to attack someone in a chase can cause a loss of the pip over a surprisingly short time).
And SWF generally just d/c if they aren't going to rank up because they know they can just play more SWF and get it back when they rig even more games. They're more concerned with denying the killer the ability to play.
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It's true, I see a lot of single rank-5 survivors carrying rank 10-15 SWF friends as a Rank 10-12 killer.
Today is another day of pure SWF, literally can't get a random for 3 minutes and then full 4-man-SWF appears every time. There's nothing left of DBD but this on whatever servers my lobby is going to.
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I think a sensible start is no killer deranks if there is SWF present. From there it's possible to look at long-term things like issues of spectator delay, SWF who d/c because they don't care about deranking due to how fast they can regain it, and incentivizing SWF for killers so there is actually some fun or at least it's bearable to go against such bad odds.
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2 kills won't stop a derank when SWF communicate to find Hex Ruin and then get all 5 gens and they have 3 insta-medkits every time and every single person has MoM, Dead Hard and Decisive Strike and often Adrenaline. The killer needs to literally let everyone go time and time again, let them all heal up again and again, get hit after hit after hit on every person, and then somehow still not let all gens pop and get 2-3 kills (Where everyone is hooked at least twice) to prevent derank. Somehow you are meant to do this against communicating-SWF who all have Dead Hard, Adrenaline, MoM, and Decisive Strike, and they bring as many instaheal medkits as possible and usually the designated obsession has a well-equipped flashlight for guaranteed stunning every pallet just to waste as much time as possible whilst they tell their friends what gens are safe to do.
And Lemon, the game is like an incomplete rock-paper-scissors:
Killer beats Solo Survivor, comms-SWF beats killer, nothing beats comms-SWF.
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Well I wrote a big long post but it seemed to delete itself and save a blank draft so gg.
I can agree that yeah, fixing spectating players would help some things, it would likely be a complimentary addition around other potential solutions.
Yeah you find partial-SWF as a solo survivor here on UK/EU servers, but I don't think it does anything for the solo survivor's experience. In the end if the killer finds you, you're not going to get any help from them outside of whatever you would usually get, though perhaps more generators will pop up faster than usual. Solo survivor is still a total meme of "everyone quits because they got hit too early, now you get demoted if you can't 2v1 the killer"
Obviously you can't nerf survivors just for being SWF, but I think the focus has to be on incentivizing it to be worth playing as a killer. Perhaps if you're red-ranked you want the added challenge of SWF-comms, but when you want to learn killers, you haven't unlocked core meta perks, or you're just not top 5%, it really detracts from the fun, especially at the consistent rate of encountering SWF almost all the time here (I'm going to guess that EU server players are disproportionately playing SWF more than on US servers)
Literally the only reason I made a forum account here was because I, like many others, was shouting at a brick wall in the form of the steam suggestions board for DBD, until someone finally comes along and goes "lol yeah no one official ever checks this" and you can see that's true by looking at page after page of posts that are ultimately players that have devolved into bickering amongst themselves because there's no moderation nor official input to address anything they say, most pages of the steam suggestions is a loop of the previous one, just a week prior and still never getting good answers.
I want DBD to get better, and I think atm to me as a current player that means trying to ensure that constant SWF teams isn't something that makes me just want to quit as killer.
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*message disappeared then reappeared after I retyped below*
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spectating players delay isn't going to fix anything. The core advantages of SWF stem from what you can do whilst alive. You can tell other players if the killer comes for them when they leave you on the hook, if they orbit the hook, which generators they're checking, you can tell people to pick up your almost-done generators as you lead the killer away, you can ensure people are in wait so you intentionally go down on pallets with survivors waiting nearby to drop them.
In short, so many things that solo survivors would literally never or almost never have the info to do.
I don't have friends with DBD (and in the current SWF-haven state, I'd never recommend it to them), so I can't go rigging the game for tons of bloodpoints via SWF of my own. I have to play solo survivor and be weak as the balance intended, or I have to deal with permanent SWF issues as a killer, and I can't change to a new killer since i never have enough bloodpoints to get them to a level where they won't be guaranteed to lose due to no perks and no items.
Also if you go to the steam suggestions board for DBD, you'll see it is literally more active than this forum's suggestion / feedback areas. If it truly is getting ignored (which I believe it is, based on seeing it for a long time), then it needs to be shut down / have an official pinned thread saying where to go to actually stand a chance at being heard.
I can't say what will fix SWF, and sure I understand that maybe opt-out would be a bad option, but I think the very least that could be done whilst a long-term solution is found is stop killers deranking if they go against SWF (You already merge lobbies into one where the killer is host, which is why the game has issues with retaining SWF after a game, so surely you can tell the lobby if it's bringing in multiple clients and thus deny killer derank). If you see the steam discussions boards then you know it's an issue people have all the time, but everyone who mentions it on the steam discussions feels ignored about it.
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The only reason I'm here is because their steam suggestions( which is more active than this forum) is 100% ignored. They get more feedback there than anywhere else and it is 100% ignored, no one gets any responses at all. It looks like it was put up to draw flak. And the in-game match-review is pointless since there's no criteria for why you thought a game was good or bad, so once again it just looks like it draws flak.
Well if opting out of SWF isn't a good fix, tell me what is. All I know is that I literally, LITERALLY, have basically 98% guaranteed SWF games. I can't learn any new killers because I just end up going against rank 8-10 SWF and there's no non-ranked / practise for me to learn anything else. There is no incentive for going against SWF. It detracts from the fun, the excessively increased challenge is present before you're high-ranking, and you're barely able to do anything other than get 1-2 kills and derank because they popped all the gens anyway.
All I see is pure SWF, and time after time after time it is teams clearly rigging the game with communication and the killer isn't even given the grace of being allowed to not derank when the tables are flipped beyond compare. There's no fun left in this SWF environment. I would understand if i was going up against top-rank pros and that was where the challenge was, but you can't even learn the game now because of the SWF.
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32 games in the past 2 days, 25 4-man SWF, 3 3-man SWF, rest were solo or duo.
I would honestly question the devs statistics about SWF frequency. Again, if it's true then let us opt out and it won't affect anything but at least some of us can enjoy playing killer.
Not that they read feedback forums anyway, their steam suggestions proves that every day it's still up.
You're literally punishing killers for daring to even try to play the game now thanks to SWF.
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if you ban one, they just find another. Eventually you would have teams using steam voice chat on a steam game.
The bare minimum they could do is let us opt out of SWF. If it really is so rare, just let us opt out. Worry about incentivizing its ludicrous gameplay for killers after that quickfix.
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Nah they need to just let us opt out. If what they say is true and there's still tons of solo survivors, then opting out should stop me getting guaranteed SWF.
It's brokenly unfair to play against SWF, they always know where you are, where you're going, and always knowing info 30s earlier than they should. They need to buff killers in SWF, deny deranking during SWF, derank SWF if any of them d/c (Since they know they're gonna keep rigging games so they happily d/c).
You could give me triple bloodpoints for going against SWF and I still wouldn't because it simply isn't fun to watch the game be rigged.
If what the devs say is true and SWF is not that common and somehow the UK is just SWF-plaza, then there should be no problem letting us opt out of it, since surely there are countless other survivors to match up with...
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Another day, another time where I hit rank 12 and the game becomes literally 100% SWF, teams that gaurantee you derank no matter what you do.
Seriously, someone give me another reason other than "git gud" for dealing with SWF. You can't beat the god damn communication advantage. Devs are clearly just ignoring the issue, and I can honestly say 99% of my games are SWF now, so whatever stats are being touted are pure BS.
I bet it's just gonna be permanently ignored just like the steam suggestions board they put up is though.
There is zero fun to watching teams rig the entire game against you, even if you can keep your rank. Why do you expect us to keep shilling out for your DLC and cosmetic spam when you can't even make the base game work.
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I can't speak for every other player, but it's obvious as hell that I get SWF. I check profiles for friends before matches start. Some hide it, but usually there's at least 1 who has all 3 other survivors as offline friends on their friends list.
Any rage or joking aside, I legitimately see at least 90%+ of my games be SWF here in the UK, irrespective of timezone (I play peak evenings and into the NA timezones). Not every SWF team is 4000-hour players who are just there to annoy a killer and all of them follow you and bodyblock at all times (or they all go flashlight just to get insta-stuns if you pick one up), but there are still tons and tons of SWF that are doing what I've mentioned above where they override any balance that is left in DBD.
I don't see what's unfair about simply saying that if one side gets to up the challenge, the other side should be able to as well.
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Whilst I agree that not all SWF are a problem, I disagree that it's not gamebreaking. Having returned to DBD in the past month or two, I worked my way to Rank 11 Killer and then realized I simply cannot rank up anymore. It's not like I suddenly got pros in my game, I suddenly got nothing but communicating-SWF teams.
You can tell they know it's a problem because they're setting themselves to offline on steam, hiding their friends lists, trying to ensure the killer won't realize it's rigged inside the 55 seconds they have before game-start. The communicating-SWF teams are abundant imo, not few and far between.
You get situations where it's clear they override the intended game balance, for example:
SWF Survivor: Your team tells you where the killer is upon spotting them, you know where they are going and who their target is, and if your friend gets chased off of a nearly-complete generator, you get asked to come and get it whilst they lead the killer away from nearly-complete generators specifically because they know they can call someone to come do it (And you wouldn't know it was almost done if you were a solo survivor).
SWF Survivor: You get hooked, so you tell your team if the killer is camping, orbiting, and if he goes for a specific generator, you tell that person to run away when the killer is still 80m out, meanwhile telling someone else to specifically come get you now that the killer is definitely distracted.
People say "oh but I don't see comms-SWF very often.", so that's great but here I find them 99% of the time. I barely keep rank above 15 simply because it's that tough to get no-comms SWF or solo survivors. The strongest argument I've seen against dealing with SWF is "lol git gud" tbh
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Imo a good start would be 50% faster bloodlust, a 0.1 speed increase to all killers if it's SWF, and prevent deranking for killer if they're gonna go up against rigged teams. That would at least be a step in the right direction.
If people wanna play SWF, they should expect the increased challenge to work both ways.
The game is in a state where it's better to DERANK as a killer because at least it gives you a tiny chance of not being against SWF. The devs have made the game anti-solo and anti-killer.
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It's understandable why SWF is in. It encourages more player activity by having friends, but I don't think it's an unfair statement that it overrides the intended game balance to a significant degree.
You can mind-game like a pro, you can pick killers that are great for quick chases, you can take Hex:Ruin since it's critical meta, but you're still not going to get past discord-teams telling each other where you're going after a hook, what generators to finish if you chase them off it, and so many other issues that arise from the communication that the game otherwise does not allow.
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They can't stop discord etc being used, but they need to confer significant gameplay changes to the killer to actually even it out. Faster movement buffs in chases, longer generator times, faster generator decay, make it take more than 1 frame of gametime to stop generator decay, if one SWF guy quits to deny you score, derank the entire SWF team for each one of them that quits.
Tbh blinding survivors and making them unable to hear terror radius when on the hook would be such an immense change too, though it won't stop the rest of the SWF problems.
Honestly you could literally put 2 killers in SWF games and I think that might balance it legitimately, but in terms of keeping 1 killer around, they need to be significantly more powerful against SWF. Killers tend to tear solo survivors apart, as intended, but SWF teams just bypass all intended balance and their efficiency skyrockets to a point that just being a good killer isn't going to change things at all.
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Agreed, but they desperately need to do something to alleviate the fact that it derails the gamebalance for killers. SWF has just become a way to guarantee you're farming bloodpoints, whilst killers get minimal bloodpoints, typically derank or at least can't rank up, and watch game after game after game be the same old "They know what I'm doing at all times and thus they can't be countered"
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There are still toxic solo survivors who will stand at a 99% generator just to dab on you when you pop up and watch them insta-finish it. Toxicity can be dealt with via tunnelling. SWF is like 99% of the game now though. It's not that it exists, it's that it's ruining the balance. You could give me double bloodpoints and no-deranks for playing with SWF and I still wouldn't choose to do it because it's taken all the fun out of the game.
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I understand why they have it in, removing it would hurt the playerbase, but seriously it's so broken / unbalanced due to the advantages it confers. We're getting spammed by licensed DLC, premium currency stores on top of that, and these things just seem to get 100% ignored no matter what. If it's going to be so aggressively monetized, at least be fixing it.
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And everyone is d/c'ing because they're rigging the game with SWF and then they know that if they derank, it doesn't affect their team, they feel good for denying you points, and they know they're gonna just rig more games and get that rank back instantly anyway.
You know the game's in a mess when SWF teams set their profiles to private or offline before loading up DBD, but then tell you to 'git-gud' when you only kill one of them after they rig the game.
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imo EGC isn't really that effective. Survivors weren't lingering around anyway for the past 2 years since they disabled 90% of ways to gain score once exit gates have power. Now survivors are just being toxic SWF teams, waiting for the final 1 second of EGC before leaving. I've never seen survivors linger ever since the updates that removed post-exit-gates scoring for most things.
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I can't emphasise enough the issue of SWF. I'm trying to play DBD and I'm stuck in rank-12 purgatory. Unable to ever rank up, just getting enough points to never rank down. Every single game is SWF, they get toxic if you don't just bend over and let them get free bloodpoints, and then they trash-talk you anyway.
The game's reputation at this point is "A DLC factory that never fixes the broken conveyor belts". You've hyper-monetized the game with DLC and premium currency, and then we get things like the end-game collapse, which fixes an issue that I've never even seen exist. You banned most ways of gaining score once exit gates were powered up, so survivors never lingered at all. The biggest problem is the game's 3-year-wait for fixes for critical issues, and the fact that SWF rigged-games has run rampant now. No one wants to play against rigged teams. Only the absolute best players in the game have even a moderate chance against rigged teams.
The game is now in a situation where it's better to derank as killer because then you get less rigged games. You get anything better than rank 15 and the game becomes 100% rigged, and it just becomes toxic trash of SWF teams having a go at you for not being able to beat rigged teams.