DeDoeH
DeDoeH
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I would say that in 2016 the game was probably objectively in it's worst state for killers because there were quite some infinte loops and very unfair spots in the game. Yet, it did not feel like it to mebecause the majority of the survivor player base was not good enough to utlize it.
For me as killer the absolute worst time I had in DBD was after the release of Dead Hard. This started the era of the constant DH,DS,SC meta. A huge majority of survivors I played against it had that every single game and it felt boring and unfair to the point where I decided to take a break from the game.
As for survivor, I think I have to agree with OP. For me, 2022 killer felt stronger than ever before. The gen-kick-meta was also very unfun to play against.
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As killer main, I dislike several things about the singularity:
- This is very subjective but his abiltiy to place cameras and to look through them takes away the pacing of the game.
- They are easily dodged and countered.
- I feel like his power is almost useless on some maps.
- Even if you get overclock, it's not a guaranteed hit.
- His power is very situational/inconsistent at best and suffers heavily against good survivors.
I think that other killers powers seem to be more rewarding/fun. But maybe I am wrong and somebody other than me will figure out how to play this one to great success.
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You clearly put a lot of effort in writing this. Some ideas with perks and things like Freddy might be interesting.
As killer main though there are several suggestions that would heavily bother me, some of them would be extremely harsh nerf:
- no bloodlust: this is a terrible, terrible, terrible idea. It will not only be the most brutal nerf the game has ever seen for most killers but it will also enable a myriad of infinite loops in the game.
- no grap on healthy unhook: this combined with meta perks will make unhooking very safe and securing kills lategame even harder;
- deactivating powers near hooked survivors sounds fine at first but is in reality something that would a) be a significant nerf in sitautions in which people should not have a free escepoe and b) could be heavily abused during chases if people on purpose approach hooks (just an example: deactivating trapper traps near hooked people would shut down some of his best strategies, and further weaken an already borerline useless killers
- blocking totems the first 30 seconds of the game would be a killer buff - but I still woudnt like it since it would probably result in survivors caming nearby until timer runs off and produce more boring earlygames
With descriptions of the rickster I wonder if you have played him extensively? The trickster has quite some counterplay it's just that he is very stong in some areas and very weak in others - which good survivors will use to their advantage. Is it really so boring to play against as survivor?
Hillbilly in my opinion should be reverted to what he was before. Wasn't OP, had dedicated mains, was considered strong but not OP and fun to play against, had also nice skill ceiling with proper rewards. No one knows why the decided to gut one of the most balanced and rewarding killers that never even got lots of hate.
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That would not be the point of it at all.
I already assume that people know that the 0.X% best players will definitely have a very high killrate or if you take survivors escape rate. So do all very good players in all games I've ever played.
The interesting thing for me would be to see the differences in killrate with each killer when played to their maximum efficiency. I am absolutely certain that most of the top 5% will never ever play a nurse or huntress even close to their full potential whilst I suspect that with "easier" and less mechanically challenging killers like let's say the wraith more people can get close to really good performances. These statistics might actually give us an interesting tier list.
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In my opinion the main issues for the trapper are:
-> He needs time to setup early in the game. This is sadly during the time when disturbing survivors is most valuable. Once survivors need time to heal, unhook etc., their progress slows exponentially. If you are not effective early in the game you are massively behind.
-> His power is usually not worth the time to set up. Compared to other killers powers it can be avoided, countered and has the tendency to overall be very bad once you play experienced hight rank survivors.
-> Distant traps are borderline useless and rarely lead to any advantage/hooking.
-> His traps and his seutp are very vulnerable to SWF sabotage - thus making him probably the single worst killer against SWF groups.
Here is an idea how to make the trapper more interesting:
-> I have always thought that it might be interesting to have the option to pre-trap maps. Like having a prepared trap-layout for each map. (that you could place in a custom game and save) I mean it does make sense that a trapper would already have traps in his domain. This would a) remove the setup-time and b) be a nasty surprise if you step into one before seing a trapper.
-> I think 5 pre-set traps could make a huge difference.
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Can only speak from the killers perspective:
-> map looks nice designwise
-> some interesting spots
-> lots of clearly visible open area with quite some open-vision-pallet loops that are a bit boring because they dont even allow mindgames.
-> That being said, these areas highly depend on the killer; Trickster for example has a great time because of very little cover in huge areas while killers like wraith etc. will probably be very sad against good loopers.
-> Basically all areas close to the border of the map are horrible for survivors and almost a guaranteed instanthit when chasing there.
I havent encountered a version of the map with an abundance of pallets. So far I've enjoyed playing it.
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I have also encountered this bug. Heres More information:
Platform: PC
Issue: In the map Raccon City Police Station there is a corridor on the 2nd floor with a tiger pelt. If a pallet spawns in this corridor it is unbreakable because the floor architecture seems to narrow to allow break animation. Seen on the Wraith. Not sure if smaller killers can.
Steps: Drop this pallet. It cant be broken by break animation.
Frequency: Supposedly each time this pallet exists.
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Here is the thing with DS:
It technically is an anti tunneling perk
But even in games in which you are not tunneled, it is extremely powerful in a number of situations. Here are some examples:
- it counters people being killed too fast
- it enables misplayed saves in stupid situations
- when the gates are up and DS is still active, it basically guarantess a free escape unless you get downed a mile away from the gate
Even if you do not get actively tunneled, this perk is by far the best choice for one perkslot. Nothing is closely as good as this perk - especially when the whole team runs it. Even if I knew the killer would not tunnel, I would always take this perk.
Here is one more interesting thing:
Recently, many survivors started complaining about excessive slugging. This kind of playstyle is a direct reaction to the possiblity of people having DS. DS is a perk that single handedly changes how killers play the game. It is THAT good. (Yet the direction into which it forces the game is not particularly fun)
Here is what I would do to fix it:
- disable it once the gate is open (if the gate is open and you are still alive, you have obviously not been tunneled to death - an anti tunnel perk should not help you!
- Limit it's usage to twice per match (even if 4 ppl run it). If more than two people DS, the killer has hooked/downed so many different people that we can't talk about tunneling anymore
- if someone else is hooked before the person who was rescued from the hook is put into dying state, it cannot be used
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I get what you are trying to say. The situation described in your thread is indeed hard for survivors.
But have you every looked at it this way:
this problem only occurs if:
...you failed to escape the normal way
...the rest of your team is dead
...no gate is open or gens are even up
... then you failed to find the hatch before the killer
Which means you (or your group/randoms) have been outplayed every step of the game so far. In my opinion if all of that happens, even a slim chance to escape (e.g. lucky gate spawn) is basically more than you earned over the course of the game.
One piece of advice: If you dont know where the hatch is try going to a gate ASAP and camp nearby. Once the killer closes the hatch instantly work on the gate. This works surprisingly well if the hatch is not by bad luck too close to you.
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Here is what I think of DS:
Decisive Strike currently is in a better and fairer spot than it used to be.
DS is, as it has alyways been, easily one of the very best survivor perks. There is no better option for that slot. It is vastly superior to most other survivor perks.
It is somehow meant to counterplay tunneling...yet it does so much more. It is very strong in many situations in which the killer does not actively tunnel or camp. Here are a few examples:
- when a person is on the hook near an open gate, having DS up is a free escape
- it makes bad survivor play successful as in: I can run right past the killer unhook in plain sight and I know that we both have DS up, so even if somebody gets downed he will either have a free health bar or the killer will have to wait 60 secs (60 secs is an eternity on R1)
- from my experience the number of people running DS is a rather big factor on how good a game is going for the killer - in games when I am NOT camping or tunneling
- in fact I would argue that the perk -despite being meant as counterplay to tunneling- is still the best choice for its slot when you are not tunneled.
What could we do?
- disable the perk once all generators are done. If you have manageed to come this far, you have not been tunneled to death. An anti tunneling perk should not give you the ability to escape in that stage of the game.
- DS is only useable by the last survivor who was hooked
I feel that these changes would leave the core anti tunneling idea intact but would weaken the perks ability in other situations, thus making it more situational. (comparable to Adrenaline)
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The issue here is the mori. Moris, as well as keys feel frustrating for one side and extremely fun for the other. If a person uses it, it is meant to tamper with Balance.
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I am not joking and find your accusations unfriendly and unwarranted. I do not see where any of those changes make me a person with no regard for other human beings feelings. That is an extremely unfriendly way to talk to another person who just made some suggestions. But that is sadly the way some people like to communicate online.
I'd really prefer if you could explain why you think so because I feel that my suggested changes would not really affect balance a big deal. Except maybe the killer house, but t that thing even bores me as survivor.
Also I find it annoying that all survivors are just skins and not unique - but I feel that special perks that are locked to survivors would require tons of balancing changes or a big survivor overhaul. If you just decicded to lock existing perks into certain survivors that would anger many people who would lose that perk on their favorite character and influence balance way more than the things i suggested.
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I've never stumbled across that explanation. But even If that was so, it would not really change the the rest of my points and the rest of the data i'd be interested in would still matter.
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Having been R1 as survivor and killer for a long time, I find these statistics interesting. Yet, I feel that we have to be careful in interpreting these statistics and especially careful if we want to use them as reference for game balance. All the following thoughts are my ideas and based on my long experience.
1) Red ranks and all the statistics around it suffer from a problematic rating system:
- With the current rating system, reaching high ranks as survivor is far too easy. It is almost impossible to depip and relatively easy to gain one pip. Reaching red ranks is more a thing of playing many games than of actually being good.
- This causes that the skill differences on R5-R1 and between R1 survivors are as big as the grand canyon. There are many R1 survivors who make tons of mistakes both in mechanics and decision making and then there are few who are really good. There are so many R5-1 survivors who constantly make catastropic beginner mistakes.
- At the same time, I feel that reaching R1 as killer is currently quite a bit more challenging than it has ever been before. You can actually depip without playing horrible. You can even kill two people and still depip.
- If the above mentioned points are as I think they are, red ranks would often match survivors who got there because everyone basically gets there against killers who are a bit better/or have at least better perks which results in higher kill rates.
2) SWF Deathsquads and really good players are hidden in the statistics:
- The true thing that makes killers lash out and complain about the balance are organized high skill deathsquads/high skill survivors. These people are usually good or very good players, perfectly perked and sometimes geared.
- These groups will usually have the skill/knowledge to abuse everything. (e.g. the best looper running object of obsession).
- These groups can make games look like taking candy from a baby and frustrate killers.
- Yet, you very rarely meet such groups, because to be brutally honest, about 95% of the high ranked survivor base are not nearly good enough. Statistically these are not relevant but they heavily influence killer's perceptions of balance.
3) The statistics clearly prove that they do not show balance but mostly lack of skill
- The statistics show that things which are harder to use are seemingly bad, when they are in fact far more powerful when in the right hands.
- example: nurse! There is no way in hell the nurse is worse than wraith or leatherface. Those two are dogshit killers. Her statistics are just bad because very few people can use her properly.
- vice versa: Freddy. he is mechanically very easy to play. His power does neither require finesse nor special skill/planning . Therefore he performs well
My conclusions:
- Just because something unerperforms statistically, it does not mean it is bad. (nurse!)
- We need a better rating system. Preferably one that makes ranking up as survivor considerably harder. This would seriously improve the quality of matches.
- The game will never ever be nor should ever be balanced for ultra high skill and for deaths squads. If you balance the game for ultra high skill survivors you would make it unfun for 95% of the community.
I usually tend to be a bit more killer sided. But to all people who often accuse killers of always wanting 4ks. No way man. The fun in the game is the tension, the thrill of the hunt. The frustation fo someone almost in your grasp escaping etc. Always 4k would bore me to death.
But on the other way around we have to see that it is an aysmetrical 1v4 horror, so no survivor should ever be able (no matter how good he is) to stall 75% of the game in one chase. Survivors should feel at a disadvantage when being chased. Is that not the point and fun of playing a horror survival game?