Pain Resonance should deactivate after someone dies
The whole idea of Pain Resonance is to reward the killer for hooking multiple survivors instead of tunneling, but a lot of killers get the first regression for free, tunnel that survivor and then it's almost impossible to win for the other survivors when there are 2-3 gens left and the killer can activate Pain Res 3 times (and probably some other perks like Pop or Eruption)
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Pain Resonance and Grim Embrace both need this change imo
I've said the same thing for ages, the perk design is supposed to encourage hook spreading, but because you can continue to get value out of it even after tunneling a survivor out, many killers who hard tunnel from 5 gens still use it.
But you know, Windows of Opportunity, which was ironically less popular than Pain Res and is almost unused by experienced players, was too problematic so they had to change that instead.
Not really for free, they still need to find the survivor, chase them and hook them (safely, flashlight saves or sabotaging can still happen) and the scourge hook RNG can be really bad sometimes.
it's actually worse than this, because Pain Res can be used on the same hook, which rewards tunneling even more because it takes a minute for survivors to realize what's going on but it effectively plays out like this in solo queue:
Hook Survivor
Pain Res procs
Proxy Hook
Tunnel Survivor, put them on hook again
Survivor Team realizes the killer is tunneling and has to become more involved
Force a hook trade or injure at the hook
Run down second survivor who goes for unhook and Scourge hook them, immediately tunnel first survivor to death
(2 Pain Res Procs and Dead Survivor)
Free Game.
Almost no interaction either, forcing players to come to the hook where they can't fight back, and at the same time you can abuse anti camp like this, hit them when they go for a save like they had any other choice, damage most progressed gen without even being there, One Survivor tunneled so they don't even really get to participate in the game, other survivors punished for the mandatory action of unhooking a teammate. BT on unhook is significantly shorter now too and BT the perk just got removed from the game effectively.
Also if you manage to get decently far from the hook Iron Grasp just got a pretty solid buff, wouidn't be surprised to see it more.
There is a more elegant way to do this, instead of disabling it completely, which I feel is a bad design choice for any of the perk to do to deny their full potential.
Just make it "When you hook a survivor on Scourge Hook first time, for every survivor alive generator with highest progress loses 3/4/5% of total progress". This way pain resonances will be 20% while all survivors are alive, but 15% if one got killed. 15% of a generator is 13,5s, instead of 18, which is a big difference already.
Straight up disabling it after kill will just make people replace it with another perk, and what then? Make them disable after kill too? Repeat until all of them are disabled?
The point is to discourage tunneling one survivor until they are dead. Which the perk in it's current state does nothing to actually encourage and since it gets stronger the longer the game goes on it's incentivizing people to hard tunnel.
pain res only works from 4 fresh hooks and then shuts off on specific hooks it got nerfed to this point.
it's a skill issue on survivors part
Yeah no. Current design neither encourages nor discourages tunneling/not tunneling. It's a simple gen regression perk. Disabling it after someone dies simply will, as I said before, make people replace it with another perk. This is not a solution to the tunneling, this is a suggestion to nerf perk instead of addressing the core issue. Do you really think nerfing pain res this way will affect tunneling in the slightest?
What really doesn't encourage not tunneling, is the game itself like lmao can we start suggesting actual benefits for spreading hooks? Right now there are none of them, spreading hooks, the healthiest strategy for the game, is also the worst one for killers to use
Like have to admit Pain Resonance is not a perk on my opinion that needs any nerfs. Like I know it is one of the most used perks on the killer side but in the end its also nerfed as much as it should be already. Like four activations max and you can get shafted by Scourge Hook RNG. It can be strong perk and it can also be not that strong as in the end it explodes the gen with most progress and the gen can be one with 95% or one with 5% it has quite decent RNG with hooks placements and the damage value you might get. There is also counters to it like Repressed Alliance from preventing it from damaging the highest progress gen and as its now only 15 second block its not going to block the gen that long anymore.
There is issue that killer role must be rewarded/slightly punished for certain play. While I see where this is going, you have to incetivize killers to spread hooks (hookig at all instead of slugging). You must give killers gigabuffs/giganerfs.
Fresh hooks (min 2 survivors must be cycled) reward big amount of regression, auras and BP, may also reward haste.
Tunneling someone out before 4th hook may disable killer perks or give permanent repair boost.
… No, regression on the last generators matter far more than the first few. The only generator that matters is the last one and by making the last one or few harder to get through that provides far more value than slowing down the first few generators. I am sorry if this sounds patronizing but this is rudimentary gameplay flow that you should understand if you want to look knowledgeable.
Partially, you are correct. Last gen is the highest stakes state of the game and thus feels much more important in terms of defending.
However, you are wrong in thinking this is related to current discussion of pain res. The 18s of regression pain res provides are absolutely equal whether used at 5 gens or 1 gen. The 18s at 5 gens might as well be "18 seconds before survivors move to the crucial last gen".
And the bigger factor, is that it's not last gen that gives pain res bigger value. It's the 1v3 condition which gives it bigger value. But even still, ANY regression perk gets much bigger value in 1v3 scenario, this is not pain res exclusive. So it's not the design of the perk, it's the wide gap of 1v4 and 1v3.
As I said before, don't nerf the perk because it helps unhealthiest strategy, nerf the strategy itself or buff the healthiest one, spreading hooks.
Again no that's just not how the game works. It's much harder for survivors to get progress on the last gen because it's the last gen. The killer only has three places to protect and thus it's much easier to interrupt and stop survivors on gens. Likewise resources are going to be depleted and make it much harder for survivors to do the final gen safely. Finally if you do tunnel it requires almost perfect teamwork from the survivors to do. The last generator matters far more because of this and any gen regression or slowdown matters far more.
Agree to disagree then