Grind Reduction is now reduced, but by how much?
The new patch makes it so you get higher-rarity objects in your low level bloodwebs as you prestige. However, the developers had already stated the following with regard to the grind changes:
"I hate to sneak in again and ruin all your hard work (huge kudos for going through the effort of putting together the spreadsheet!), but there's another big oversight here: Prestiging resets you to level 1, meaning you get the super tiny levels again. The overall bloodpoints required ends up being ~75% lower, not the number of levels. You spend way more BP per level on the old system by repeating the huge level 50 bloodwebs" - Peanits,
@KnotEnthusiast said:
Howdy folks, it's your favourite angry DBD nerd here to be annoyed a second time. I made a post after the "grind reduction" was first announced, where I did some math to determine that the grind reduction seemed to be in name only:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/330040/we-reduced-the-grind-except-we-kinda-didnt
This discussion was responded to by @Peanits :
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3017065#Comment_3017065
Who said that the fact that you could get all killers to P1 and then level accordingly in the most efficient way possible would result in substantial BP gains as you leveled up more and more killers. So I've been thinking about that, and because I am a total nerd and dislike losing my sweet sweet BBQ bonus, I figured I'd actually calculate that value.
So! We can start by explaining what the most efficient way of getting all perks on every killer, then calculate the number of levels required, then compare them to the current method. I'm also going to ignore inherent inefficiencies in starting out leveling, such as that before you unlock any teachables in the new method, a small number of levels will be wasted on bloodwebs that have no perks, as you will not have enough perk levels to fill every bloodweb up to 50. I also will assume you get the RNG that results in the most favourable amount of bloodwebs possible, and no perks get eaten. I'll also be calculating for killer, because there are fewer and therefore less work.
Most efficient level up method in the new system:
Much like the most efficient method in the current build, the best way to get all perks starts with getting all teachables on every killer. So, every killer goes up to level 50, then prestiged. But once we hit this point, then things get a bit more complicated:
Between P1 and P3, there exist 100 levels that will unlock 120 perk tiers. However, as you P3 more and more killers, the number of perks you have to buy to complete a killer drops, as you unlock more teachables by P2 and P3ing. So to get the most optimal leveling system, you have to find the balance between leveling up killers to P3 to remove their tiers from later bloodwebs, but not so many that you're wasting BP that didn't need to be spent. So, being a good nerd, I did what I had to do:
I MADE A SPREADSHEET.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/LV66TJ5IXMTD/bpmaths.xlsx
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/IF22MABS40KB/image.png
Using this spreadsheet, I found that P3ing either 14 or 13 killers resulted in the least BP used, at roughly 3458 levels used. Notably less than the current 4182, but nowhere near the magical 75% reduction that the devs keep touting, and not even close enough to warrant the loss of BP bonuses on perks. This also isn't counting the new 50k BP fee to prestige, which is basically just an extra level that provides no perks to your total. I'd love to have my maths proven wrong, so if anyone sees a mistake, let me know.
TL:DR: I made a spreadsheet to find that the grind has reduced 18%, from 4182 levels required to 3458, not the magical 75%. According to Peanits, this should have been the most BP saved, but I'm still hard pressed to see how this new system required that BBQ and WGLF needed to be nerfed. This feels like the BP grind is simply going to get much worse, and urge the devs to make their BP bonuses base kit.
However, if the rarity of the things in the bloodweb goes up, so does the price of those things, which means that the same 'super tiny levels' will soon cost considerably more than they did under the old system. This means that by their standard by which they measured the grind reduction, it is no longer at the 75% they had stated.
I want to know by how much the grind reduction total has changed by BHVR's own measurements; only they have the algorithm for how higher rarity things are added, so only they can answer.
Comments
do you want all perks on all characters? it was reduced, with how much it was reduced by depending on your previous progress. Do you prioritize literally anything else? It was increased slightly/moderately/tremendously.
It has literally increased for survivors btw.
It massively increased for me as survivor. Dwight is the only survivor I play, and all the other survivors only exist so they can unlock the very few specific perks I want to use on Dwight. It is never worth it for me to prestige any of my other survivors.
I always unlocked the Bloody Cosmetics for every Character. Now we have to P9 every new Character instead of P3. The grinding is real...
There have been obvious solutions suggested by the community for years to reduce the grind that would have benefited everyone, not just players who want to level prestige every single character and get all perks on every single character. For the many players that don’t want to do that, including myself, the grind was made worse. It was yet another glaring example of the dev team ignoring community feedback and putting in their own solution rather than what the community wanted.
Old system:
If you want to grind character for every perk, you need to grind for 9 million BP. You need to level 40 for their teachable and find perks on your main. You have a BBQ/WGLF BP bonus to help with this.
New system:
Just grind your character to P1 if you are a new player or current player who plays 5 mains or less. Just grind your character to P3 if you are main everything. You need 4.5m BP for the P3 character, you basically need 50% less BP in the new system. However, you lost the 50% reduce grind from BBQ/WGLF. Basically, the grind doesn't change anything except it's longer and worse for a new player or current player who plays 5 mains or less.
BHVR just want you to play more in the new progression system when they could give bloodhunt or BBQ/WGLF base kit to help with grind in a new progression system.
Yep, the grind is worse AND there's not going to be matchmaking incentives for a long while yet.
Kinda a joke.
grind sucks I had every character p3 some p3 for a long time was still lvl up some after p3 now I have to get to 100 what waste of BP
Good news you only actually need p6 for bloody cosmetics p7-9 is for perk charms
I've said it before, but the people who last minute P1'd killers and the ones who p0L40'd all their survivors but one got hit hard with the changes. Terrible addon aquisition, and if those survivors didn't get those last 10 levels you're looking at a lot of wasted BP in prestige costs alone with those survivors.
Its more like a 20% grind reduction at most. They just looked at the new system and went "welp if they have killers/survivors p3 already they dont have to grind through 3 perk tiers so 75% reduction!". In reality it worsened the addon grind when certain killers powers become more useable with a green or purple.
The worst part about the addon struggle is that their proposed fix isn't even going to be as good as the previous system, they're just shifting the rarity weight, which is still going to have disproportionate affect on frequency due to sheer number of smaller bloodwebs and of course the oh so well received mandatory prestige tax. And since they don't go into a collective pool or anything, your addon grind on each killer is entirely separate, all full of their own flavor of worthless clutter~
Long while = 5 weeks or so, FYI
I had all my killers at P1 or P2 before the patch hit, all of them with about 30-40 levels of perks. The instant the patch hit I got every single teachable perk on every single killer at level 3. It was literally hundreds and hundreds of bloodwebs worth of perks, a HUGE windfall. We're talking millions and millions of bloodpoints saved.
And with all future killers now all I have to do is get them to Prestige 1 and their perks are on all of my killers (about 30 at this point). Then I can either Prestige that character some more or just not worry about getting to level 3 on everybody and let them level up normally. Either way I'm still saving a HUGE amount of points.
So basically if you have a bunch of killers then in the long run the new system saves a ton of bloodpoints. If you only play one character it doesn't really save you anything.
Yes.
I do not get why you people insist the grind was improved and then start up discussions contradicting yourselves. Why is this even a trend. Yes, it got worse for everyone but people who already had most of the perks. Same as it has been since they announced it... Nothing changed, believe it or not. Crazy, I know.
Trying to get items and addons has become massively inefficient and it costs WAY more bp to get greens and above.
No matter how you feel about perks, the grind has been overwhelming INCREASED for the things that you lose after each match. And since perks are one-and-done, the overhaul is a colossal failure in the long-term.
That is, assuming the new prestige system was made to reduce the grind.
Which it plainly was not.
Keep on grinding (but now with no BBQ/WGLF).
colossal failure is an understatement