Survivors still punished for stealth gameplay

Sythalin

Why are survivors still being punished for the EVADER emblem when you successfully EVADE the killer all game? Have had 3 or 4 games of not being seen by the killer, escape and earn BRONZE for the emblem? I don't understand why survivors are being forced to reveal themselves to the killer in order to gain higher ranks of this emblem.

Oblitiry

Evader is based around getting chased, not staying out of sight the whole game.

A longer chase nets you a bigger reward.

Kilmeran

If you look at the actual description for the emblem and how the points are awarded, it is for (1) being in a chase and escaping, or (2) being in the Killer's terror radius and not being seen.

So, you have to be stealthy and in the terror radius. If you're just being stealthy and avoiding being near the killer outright, then that is why your emblem is so low. It still requires you to at least engage with the terror radius for the emblem advancement.

https://deadbydaylight.gamepedia.com/Emblems#Evader

Sythalin

Which is exactly my point in general. You outplayed the killer, avoided detection and escaped yet you are awarded less than if you stand out in the open, loop the killer for 5 min and still die by the end of the game. In the latter, I've personally pulled Gold+ before, thus why I can't wrap my head around the logic of playing better = less reward.

Vortexas

@Sythalin said:
Which is exactly my point in general. You outplayed the killer, avoided detection and escaped yet you are awarded less than if you stand out in the open, loop the killer for 5 min and still die by the end of the game. In the latter, I've personally pulled Gold+ before, thus why I can't wrap my head around the logic of playing better = less reward.

Please stand out in the open, it makes it so much easier for me to find you.

Kilmeran

@Sythalin said:
Which is exactly my point in general. You outplayed the killer, avoided detection and escaped yet you are awarded less than if you stand out in the open, loop the killer for 5 min and still die by the end of the game. In the latter, I've personally pulled Gold+ before, thus why I can't wrap my head around the logic of playing better = less reward.

Yes, and it is by purposeful design. The Devs want some sort of engagement between the two sides, not simply avoiding the killer entirely, popping gens, and rushing the door. Which is why Evader is designed how it is. You might feel that by completely avoiding the killer and their terror radius all game that you won. And depending on your preferred way to play, you might be right. By the Dev's game design, however, you will not get advancement in the Evader emblem because that is not how the designers want the game to be played. Therefore, that play-style does not reward Evader emblem advancement.

By the Dev's design choices for DBD, engaging the terror radius near the killer and being unseen (bigger risk) or being seen and chased and escaping (bigger risk) is how they want the game played. Avoiding killer entirely all game (lesser risk) isn't worthy of a reward. They want risk and engagement to take place in a DBD match.

They have wanted this and enforced this since the game's launch. If you prefer to be rewarded for a different type of play-style, you simply aren't going to be. Whether that is right or wrong is immaterial, too. It is simply how DBD has been designed to be played.

DemonDaddy

I use stealth every game of survivor cause I don't use the traditional looping perks. It really is just a matter of staying out of sight and nearby. Not often or anything, but I have received a few iridescents just for being sneaky that way.

Vortexas

@DemonDaddy said:
I use stealth every game of survivor cause I don't use the traditional looping perks. It really is just a matter of staying out of sight and nearby. Not often or anything, but I have received a few iridescents just for being sneaky that way.

It's really not that hard to do.

Hell in low to Mid Ranks killers are like T-Rex's don't move, and they won't see you.

powerbats

@Kilmeran said:

@Sythalin said:
Which is exactly my point in general. You outplayed the killer, avoided detection and escaped yet you are awarded less than if you stand out in the open, loop the killer for 5 min and still die by the end of the game. In the latter, I've personally pulled Gold+ before, thus why I can't wrap my head around the logic of playing better = less reward.

Yes, and it is by purposeful design. The Devs want some sort of engagement between the two sides, not simply avoiding the killer entirely, popping gens, and rushing the door. Which is why Evader is designed how it is. You might feel that by completely avoiding the killer and their terror radius all game that you won. And depending on your preferred way to play, you might be right. By the Dev's game design, however, you will not get advancement in the Evader emblem because that is not how the designers want the game to be played. Therefore, that play-style does not reward Evader emblem advancement.

By the Dev's design choices for DBD, engaging the terror radius near the killer and being unseen (bigger risk) or being seen and chased and escaping (bigger risk) is how they want the game played. Avoiding killer entirely all game (lesser risk) isn't worthy of a reward. They want risk and engagement to take place in a DBD match.

The problem with that is it encourages endless looping and or gen rushing which killers hate, so survivors have to do 1 or the other. I'm not going to go run the killer endlessly because I suck at looping and i'm not going to challenge a Bubba/Nurse/Billy etc by running in plain sight of them just to get screwed.

It seriously needs to be changed to suit both play styles so that not everyone is forced into the 1 playstyle because otherwise get ready for endless looping then. If I've got to learn how to endlessly loop in order to get that i'll finally break down and do it.

Sythalin

@Kilmeran said:
Yes, and it is by purposeful design. The Devs want some sort of engagement between the two sides, not simply avoiding the killer entirely, popping gens, and rushing the door. Which is why Evader is designed how it is. You might feel that by completely avoiding the killer and their terror radius all game that you won. And depending on your preferred way to play, you might be right. By the Dev's game design, however, you will not get advancement in the Evader emblem because that is not how the designers want the game to be played. Therefore, that play-style does not reward Evader emblem advancement.

By the Dev's design choices for DBD, engaging the terror radius near the killer and being unseen (bigger risk) or being seen and chased and escaping (bigger risk) is how they want the game played. Avoiding killer entirely all game (lesser risk) isn't worthy of a reward. They want risk and engagement to take place in a DBD match.

They have wanted this and enforced this since the game's launch. If you prefer to be rewarded for a different type of play-style, you simply aren't going to be. Whether that is right or wrong is immaterial, too. It is simply how DBD has been designed to be played.

Fair enough, why not go both ways? Sure, you outplayed the killer by not being seen, earn less BP because it "wasn't a challenge", but get a bonus towards pipping so get you boosted towards more skilled killers that you are not as likely to get away unseen.

Vortexas

@Vortexas said:

@DemonDaddy said:
I use stealth every game of survivor cause I don't use the traditional looping perks. It really is just a matter of staying out of sight and nearby. Not often or anything, but I have received a few iridescents just for being sneaky that way.

It's really not that hard to do.

Hell in low to Mid Ranks killers are like T-Rex's don't move, and they won't see you.

We need a Meme Smith.

Photo Shop Dr Grant from Jurassic Park's head into Claudettes on the scene where he's holding a flare out infront of the T-rex. Shop the T-rex's head to any killers.

Volfawott

Sythalin said:

Which is exactly my point in general. You outplayed the killer, avoided detection and escaped yet you are awarded less than if you stand out in the open, loop the killer for 5 min and still die by the end of the game. In the latter, I've personally pulled Gold+ before, thus why I can't wrap my head around the logic of playing better = less reward.

Now how exactly would you put outplayed the killer into context. Because if you're one of those people who urban evasion  around and do absolutely nothing you shouldn't be rewarded for that shine or technicality unless the killer is lucky and happens to bump into you, you won't actually in be found by them but it's still not something you should be rewarded for.

Sythalin

@Aari_Piggy66 said:
Now how exactly would you put outplayed the killer into context. Because if you're one of those people who urban evasion  around and do absolutely nothing you shouldn't be rewarded for that shine or technicality unless the killer is lucky and happens to bump into you, you won't actually in be found by them but it's still not something you should be rewarded for.

Using Urban Evasion to just run around the map until everyone else finishes the gens for you? Clearly not, and that would be represented by lack of progress on the other emblems. I use UE myself and still do gens and rescues while escaping unseen. That is what I consider as being "outplayed" and "successfully evaded the killer".

Vortexas

@Sythalin said:

@Aari_Piggy66 said:
Now how exactly would you put outplayed the killer into context. Because if you're one of those people who urban evasion  around and do absolutely nothing you shouldn't be rewarded for that shine or technicality unless the killer is lucky and happens to bump into you, you won't actually in be found by them but it's still not something you should be rewarded for.

Using Urban Evasion to just run around the map until everyone else finishes the gens for you? Clearly not, and that would be represented by lack of progress on the other emblems. I use UE myself and still do gens and rescues while escaping unseen. That is what I consider as being "outplayed" and "successfully evaded the killer".

If you REALLY want to bamboozle a Killer throw in Dance with me, and Lilthe with UE.

Kilmeran

@powerbats said:

@Kilmeran said:

@Sythalin said:
Which is exactly my point in general. You outplayed the killer, avoided detection and escaped yet you are awarded less than if you stand out in the open, loop the killer for 5 min and still die by the end of the game. In the latter, I've personally pulled Gold+ before, thus why I can't wrap my head around the logic of playing better = less reward.

Yes, and it is by purposeful design. The Devs want some sort of engagement between the two sides, not simply avoiding the killer entirely, popping gens, and rushing the door. Which is why Evader is designed how it is. You might feel that by completely avoiding the killer and their terror radius all game that you won. And depending on your preferred way to play, you might be right. By the Dev's game design, however, you will not get advancement in the Evader emblem because that is not how the designers want the game to be played. Therefore, that play-style does not reward Evader emblem advancement.

By the Dev's design choices for DBD, engaging the terror radius near the killer and being unseen (bigger risk) or being seen and chased and escaping (bigger risk) is how they want the game played. Avoiding killer entirely all game (lesser risk) isn't worthy of a reward. They want risk and engagement to take place in a DBD match.

The problem with that is it encourages endless looping and or gen rushing which killers hate, so survivors have to do 1 or the other. I'm not going to go run the killer endlessly because I suck at looping and i'm not going to challenge a Bubba/Nurse/Billy etc by running in plain sight of them just to get screwed.

It seriously needs to be changed to suit both play styles so that not everyone is forced into the 1 playstyle because otherwise get ready for endless looping then. If I've got to learn how to endlessly loop in order to get that i'll finally break down and do it.

Yep. And I agree with everything you said. Not only about how it encourages endless looping of the Killer, but also how it needs to be changed to accommodate both stealth play-styles.

Brother, you will get zero argument from me about that.

(By the way, I, too, suck at looping.)

Rebel_Raven

Kinda torn now.
I love trying to be stealthy because I don't have uber reflexes so I can't juke like a crackhead, or home in on pallets like some crazed beaver, never mind use them as efficiently as others.
I don't like sprint burst because I can't couple it with urban evasion just yet, and I don't like burning it every time I want to move at a reasonable rate.
Doing gens, and not being seen is my bread, and butter.
My Evasion is #########-tier, IMO. Especially with Lithe being nailed to the wall with less to no windows in jungle gyms.

I can't say I gen rush, yet I run Deja Vu plenty (It usually shows gens across the map anyhow) but most of my time is spent trying to position myself so I can do gens in peace.
I prioritize gens, yet I generally am slow/cautious enough that I wouldn't call it a rush. A lot of times killers apply map pressure, or someone tries to kite them into me that it's hard to chain gens.

I can rescue, but odds are high there's 2, or 3 other people better suited for it at any given time, and I HATE it when all 3 people just stop, and panic when I'm hooked, not doing gens regardless of how far away they are.

Kinda funny when killers seem to be like "THERE YOU ARE!!!" and really try to kill my ass all of a sudden when they see me.

That said, I'd love to earn more BP for playing like I'm actually trying to avoid the killer, and working behind the scenes to help ensure people get out alive...
but seeing what people have to say, I'm reminded that extra BP might reward gen rushers that push for sub 5 minute games, and get out, too. Those people are the banes of my existence as killer.
People sitting in the corner doing nothing may get rewarded, too. Lame.

But I do agree that racking up bold, evader, and whatever points you get as a decoy might just blow my playstyle out of the water. Kinda sucks.

yeet

people need to realise that stealth isn't just sitting in a corner for the whole game

unknown

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