T1 Ruin Should Be Basekit
Hear me out!
Killers TACTICALLY camp because of time pressure. This is a fact. If we can remove 1 player, the Survivor's efficiency goes down by 25%. Sometimes MORE, since there's always at least someone going for the unhook.
We just feel that time crunch at the start of the match. And I've seen a gen pop in 20 seconds before. And we all know kicking is absolutely garbage & useless unless you're running Pop; Survivors can tap gens 120 times faster than Killers kick gens.
(My math is probably wrong, but it takes Killers 2 seconds to kick, and Survivors can 1-frame a tap in 1/60th of a second)
But!
If T1 Ruin was basekit, and gens just naturally regressed when not worked on, we would not feel that time crunch as much.
The trade (Because it would not be balance without trade!)
Kicking gens does not add regression over time!
Let me explain: Killers can still kick a gen for perks. But it will not add any speed to the regression over time itself.
And they can only kick a gen once, until it's been worked on again. Just like now.
I feel like this idea should at least be tried on the PTB. Hex: Ruin would have to be reworked into +25%/+50%/+100% (Thereby giving, when active, 125%/150%/200%, which is only slightly stronger (at Tier 1) than it is now. Tiers 2 & 3 would be the EXACT same bonus it gives now.)
Comments
Let's make DS, Unbreakable, Dead Hard, BT, Soul Guard Base kit. Then let's make it so all survivors get the endurance status effect every 1 second. Plus, How would Pop, and Dragons Grip work?
Sure, use a slippery slope fallacy.
So Pop would apply it's 25%, and the gen would regress as normal. Since the Killer no longer applies regression himself.
And Dragon's Grip would apply as normal.
The only difference, with my idea, is that the Killer no longer applies REGRESSION. He still gets his kick, with any effects thereof.
(Also, I was wrong; kicking does not apply any damage at the moment of the kick, according to the wiki)
No. As much as I despise camping/tunneling and I know this would help with it the issue is ruin is a perk that punishes survivors for playing as a team just like NOED does. If anything both ruin and NOED should be reworked and then we can look at gen speed and see what we have to do.
While I agree that some regression should be base kit, I don't think it is Ruin. What I believe is that:
I believe this would reward and encourage Killers to bother with kicking Generators with or without Perks, and lead to a healthier game. It would not impinge on the existing Perks because it is still half the speed of the lowest Tier of Ruin, but SO MUCH faster than base regression.
But ruin provides equal to what a kick does. At least at tier one. So you're saying a kick should apply half of what it already does? Because T1 Ruin = Kicked Gen. T2 = 150% T3 = 200%
I think, unless my math is way wrong, that Ruin is a LOT faster regression than a kick. I didn't think a kicked Generator regressed faster than:
Generators regress at a default rate of 0.25 c/s, taking a maximum of ~320 seconds to regress from 99.9... to 0 %.
Is that the same speed at Tier-1 Ruin? Because it sure doesn't seem like it in game. :) I always assumed that 100% regression listed in the write up of Ruin was 100% of the same speed at which it was repaired. Do I have that backwards, and it is simply 100% of the normal regression speed? If so, that is egg on my face. Even the first level of Ruin has always seemed to be a good deal faster than a kick, but perhaps that is simply because it starts immediately as soon as the repairs halt.
'All Generators automatically regress at 100/150/200 % of the normal Regression speed whenever they are not being repaired.'
So at Tier 1, they regress at the same speed as if they were kicked. T2 is 50% more AKA 150%, and T3 is 100% more, AKA double speed, or 200%
So my idea was to make T1 Ruin base kit. Meaning all gens regress as if kicked. And change Ruin to be 125%/150%/200% faster regression. Which means T1 on the perk gets a small buff, but Tiers 2 & 3 on the perk stay exactly as they are now.
Then I stand corrected, and agree with you. For some reason I thought regular regression was slower than Tier-1 Ruin, and I appreciate getting set straight.
Thank you :) Yeah, so did I, and I also thought that kicking applied a base amount of damage before regressing, myself.
I was researching my idea and learned otherwise. I want the idea to be good and not OP. :)
You might have make your suggestion be that base kick Regression got to 150% and so would Tier-1 Ruin (except no kick is required), and then Tier-2 = 175%, and Tier-3 = 200% as I don't think there is enough room for Tier-3 to go beyond 200% without it being utterly over the top.
The issue with Ruin as a counter to genrushing is that Ruin strongly encourages it, not discourages it. If a gen is going to bust when you let it go, you're more likely to keep on it for as long as possible.
Ruin baseline is going to make genrushing worse, and it'd be a very considerable buff to killers.
I'd rather turn the co-op penalty on its head. Currently, survivors are -always- better off splitting up on gens, making them harder to track, making them harder to pressure, and getting the fastest results.
If solo gen speeds were slower than co-op, survivors would be more likely to stick together, meaning that finding a survivor is likely to be more disruptive, since you then have two running away. It also means that gens pop on a more one-by-one basis as opposed to three-at-a-time.
I'd prefer Kicking generators was made more effective, rather than automatic, so that the killer gains a valid action to take instead of losing one.
By all means add in more perks that work similarly to Ruin (but are perhaps a bit weaker so they're not Hexes).
Nah