1 change that could benefit Bloodlust, instead of outright removing it
Bloodlust:
For every 15 seconds a killer spends outside of a chase or not attacking survivors, gain 0.2 m/s movement speed boost, and All effects of bloodlust are lost once the killer enters a chase or attacks. Bloodlust is no longer gained if there is only 1 survivor remaining in the trial. This way, bloodlust is repurposed for aiding killers in traversing the map to find survivors, and doesn't assist them during chases, as well as keeping it from becoming unfair in the game of finding the hatch or patrolling gates against 1 survivor. The way I see it, Gaining bloodlust should be more about the anticipation of drawing blood, and for a killer to go more than 45 seconds in a trial without chasing any survivors, they would be frothing at the mouth to satisfy that itch. This change would also help Trap setting killers like Trapper and Hag to make up for the time they lose setting traps in the beginning of the match by giving them extra movement speed until they start chasing survivors. This also makes the large maps easier for avg-low mobility killers to traverse between far spread out generators.
What this means for Beast of Prey:
This Perk remains the same, but due to the proposed change, it makes the killer go undetectable if they are having trouble locating and chasing survivors, which gives them a slight edge when survivors don't know they are coming, and allows them to initiate a chase easier. This is particularly good for M1 centric killers or killers who move at a lower than average speed.
Overall this proposed change just inverts how you gain bloodlust from gaining it while in a chase, to gaining it while outside of a chase, and allows killers more mobility so they can initiate a chase sooner. Bloodlust used to be a band-aid fix that helped killers eventually defeat broken or infinite loops, but since the majority of those are gone now, and the devs feel safe testing shutting off bloodlust, there still remains a problem the game has always had and still overlooked: Early game Gen Pressure. On small maps this isn't a problem, but on medium to large maps, especially with low mobility killers, it's really difficult to apply gen pressure in the early game when it takes 30 seconds to get from one end of the map to the other without encountering a single survivor. With this change, that wouldn't be as much of an issue, and would allow the low mobility killers a healthier amount of time management to get the game rolling along.
What do you guys think? Is this an idea in the right direction for bloodlust or will it cause problems I haven't considered?
Comments
I like the idea. My only doubt is how it should interact with abilities, because if bloodlust could be gained when using them high mobility killers would be even better at that, but if powers deactivated bloodlust some killers (like Pig) would be penalized.
It doesn't sound too bad, except for the fact that killers could easily abuse this. How you ask? Well, by simply looking down or around as to not start a chase with a survivor while still gaining distance on them.
Not necessarily, High mobility killers have a knack for using their mobility to find survivors sooner than the average M1 standard-low mobility killers. Think about it, how many Billy's, Nurses, Spirits, or Blights have a hard time applying early game gen pressure, or initiating a chase? On top of that, Even if they do gain bloodlust, It's gone as soon as they either initiate a chase or attempt an attack, so they don't gain any further benefit from it towards their mobility.
They still lose it once they start a chase or hit a survivor, and lets be honest, if a killer tries to abuse it in a chase by looking down or away from the survivor to end the chase, they've just extended said chase by 15 seconds if they want to gain that .2 m/s edge, which is a horrible waste of time for killers, since most can down a survivor with a follow up hit in less time than that.
Killers are all about time management. In the case of old legion, the Deep Wounds timer ticking down was a threat because they could shorten the timer per hit, and just wait for the survivor to go down, but this change is the opposite of that. It stops as soon as the killer initiates a chase or attempts an attack, they don't even have to hit the survivor to lose it, After which, if they try to abuse it by taking their eyes off of the target and following scratch marks, they still have to wait 15 seconds to gain the speed boost which is immediately lost the moment they look at the survivor. I honestly don't see how this can be abused, especially if the survivor sees the killer trying to pull this stunt and drops a pallet on them while their back is turned or they're looking at the floor.
Problem with this here it doesn't help with setup till after 15-30 seconds into the game, at this point there are atleast 1-2 gens at minimum 50% through their cycle maybe less depending. then suddenly if they aren't seeing anything in a while, then get into a chase they drop from say 5.2 m/s to 4.6 ms (assuming 115% killer) and thus they are slower that expected. and allow survivors to gain even that much more ground. the problem is not the speed at which the player is moving at but in looping which is the absolute means to keep the killer at bay for a long period of time becomes the one way that the players know they will be able to let the gens get done faster because the killers can't catch up as they did before. this change as it stands does nothing for the killer till mid game and then it's not that good, and as someone said it'd be exploitable by people learning how to moon walk their killer like legion players did originally to keep the mend meter dropping DURING a chase.
I felt bloodlust should stack whenever survivors do things to the killer that prevents the killer from catching them. To indicate that the survivors are angering the killer for a more realistic feeling. For example stunning the killers, or making their lunges miss on purpose. Each successful attack or use of their power would lower Bloodlust by 1 tier. Losing the chase makes the killer lose Bloodlust altogether.
Meaning when cocky survivors run killers into jungle gyms all day the killer would grow more faster (angry) as you stun them with pallets, and make their lunges miss.
As survivor you want to escape chases. Not purposely have the killer chase after you, or because the SWF seeks to troll/bully the killer. Such toxic behavior should have consequences. The consequence would be giving the killer the speed to catch you unless you can escape the chase.
As survivor this means if you can manage to escape the chase every time AND keep a killer in a particular area then that means you’re actually good at the game. You’re in control as you keep making the killer lose their Bloodlust for you. 🤷🏽♂️
But without any kind of movement speed increase, how are Killer's going to counter survivors abusing long/long loops. Also how are killer's going to even have a fair playing field on maps where the loops are all close together?
Remember how legion used to chase you when he was released? The same thing will happen with bloodlust
though there are interesting ideas in this, currently loosing chase is counted as dropping line of sight from the killer for 5 seconds. this is too short of a period to "LOOSE" bloodlust as well. also "use of killer power makes the killer loose bloodlust" (I understand you said levels of blood lust) makes trapper and hag's power useless to combat loops. same with nurse and ghost face's power... michael's power use also becomes useless ... honestly all killer's powers become useless in a chase at that point. no more shocks for the doctor, no more hatchets for the huntress.... etc. Now maybe doc's aoe static blast could knock him out of blood lust but again it doesn't seem thematically right. Look at most horror movie killers (which is the genre DBD is made upon) and when they hit a person and they keep moving they get angrier and angrier. so any hit to loose tiers of bloodlust isn't thematically right either.
still interesting ideas.
Again, I feel I should re-iterate why there's no comparison between this change and "Old Legions" mechanics:
Old legion could strike a survivor twice with DW, and shorten the timer to 10 seconds, of which still ticked down while a survivor was moving and not in a chase. Basically, Old legion could ensure the survivor would be downed in 10 seconds while moonwalk-chasing a survivor whether they struck them down or let DW do it.
With this change to bloodlust, For a killer to try and abuse it in a chase, the killer would have to avoid looking at a survivor for 15 seconds while chasing them for the meager reward of a 0.2 m/s movement speed boost that goes away as soon as they either see the survivor or attempt an attack. Any killer trying to abuse this in a chase, instead of simply chasing and attacking the survivor in less than 15 seconds, is an idiot.
Unlike with old legion, this doesn't guarantee a down, and trying to abuse it only results in losing sight of your target, leaving yourself open to be pallet stunned, and extending the chase by 15 seconds; a Chase which otherwise could've been won in much less time by simply keeping your eye on the target, and mind-gaming them efficiently.
This in no way compares to Old Legions game mechanics, and won't reward killers in a chase.
You do realize that there are thing like scratch marks, bloodstains and sound in a game right? You'd have to be an idiot not to use it. And how would they extend it by 15 seconds if they already have bloodlust when coming up on a survivor? The movement speed increase is already enough throw off a survivor and make them drop a pallet early or get free hit.
Or for every 5 seconds out of chase you lose a stack. So the bloodlust grows progressively weaker the longer you don’t pursue the person “angering” you. The idea is to tactically take advantage of being stunned in the same way the Enduring Spirit Fury combo works. You purposely take that hit when Spirit Fury is ready to land a decisive blow.
For Myers you usually don’t attack when you stare anyway. You would have to time your stares more carefully, and make sure to build Bloodlust for when you are ready to proc Evil Within III. Normally during EW III players will try to loop and pallet stun you anyway. Doing so would speed Myers up, and combined with PWYF that would make him (And other killers) insanely fast when pursuing the obsession. Meaning you don’t want to ever be the obsession in this case anymore. Nurse uses her power to get around so Bloodlust is nonexistent. Trapper doesn’t need much Bloodlust either since he makes you step on his traps. If you were to purposefully build speed by being stunned the speed boosts could pressure survivors to run into traps more often. The Hag typically uses her traps to teleport around so she’s good without it. Demo can warp. Oni goes berserk. Hillybilly is NASCAR. Huntress and DeathSlinger are ranged killers so there’s not much need.
Bloodlust already has very little use which is why it’s being tested. It would only be viable on killers that already suck at map pressure like Ghost Face (Exposed), Pig, Clown, and Myers (During Evil Within). While you’re chasing people around the gens are getting done. Speeding these killers up allows them to potentially end the chase quicker. Which allows them to check gens sooner. This is all theory though. 😆
thing is a CHASE is started when the survivor runs away from you, not when you move towards a survivor. so they can run by you, veer off, chase started then they get escaped, chase drops and you have to start all over again. that's what I'm talking about. and I've used myer's power in a chase to find someone that had just ducked away since it's pretty much across the map if you can see across the map! but it's true myers generally doesn't do much till atleast EW2.
I'm also not saying it shouldn't be changed, but it should be something a bit more of a killer side vice rely on if the survivors are around and go in to just photo bomb the killer to drop their movement. there is a great deal to work with and none of use have any real ideas of what to do though i will say there are some good ideas but there needs to be work to make it a good mechanic. and something the survivors aren't able to just bop in and then leave. there have been times I've been walking around and suddenly without knowing it i'm in a chase and then it's gone. I didn't even see a survivor!