The road to starting the match with the gates open

Lowbei

“Survivors shouldnt feel safe in front of the killer” - devs

(the required disclaimer: ive got 1800hrs and been rank1 on both sides at the end of the season dozens of times)

knowing that looping is a problem, why are we nerfing bloodlust?

Bloodlust vs a skilled survivor is already nearly useless, since after looping him for long enough to get enough bloodlust to catch me, i can just drop the pallet and force em to lose bloodlust when he breaks it, then its off to the next pallet.

what seems extremely obvious to me, a survivor main, is that survivors raged and review bombed after the last patch, and the devs solution was to cave to one of the items on the survivor main checklist on the road to starting the match with the gates open. press 3 to twerk at the exit gate.

the point of bloodlust, was that the devs say the map assets need to be fixed to prevent looping, yet i see no map fixes in the notes, just a nerf that will cause even more “being safe in front of the killer.”

This is what happens when devs arrogantly assume that they know the gameplay better than the players, and make decisions based on their own rank 15ish experience. The obvious solution is to have a small group of the most experienced players (not streamers), on both sides, review your potential decisions. The near universal opinion of your veteran players, was that the last patch was the first step in the right direction in a long time... only for you to then immediately sabotage yourselves by caving to a tiny 500ish player review bomb. Well, since it worked, next time they will bomb you much harder.

NMCKE

DeadByFlashlight said:

@Legacy_Zealot said:

@Lowbei said:
“Survivors shouldnt feel safe in front of the killer” - devs

(the required disclaimer: ive got 1800hrs and been rank1 on both sides at the end of the season dozens of times)

knowing that looping is a problem, why are we nerfing bloodlust?

Bloodlust vs a skilled survivor is already nearly useless, since after looping him for long enough to get enough bloodlust to catch me, i can just drop the pallet and force em to lose bloodlust when he breaks it, then its off to the next pallet.

what seems extremely obvious to me, a survivor main, is that survivors raged and review bombed after the last patch, and the devs solution was to cave to one of the items on the survivor main checklist on the road to starting the match with the gates open. press 3 to twerk at the exit gate.

the point of bloodlust, was that the devs say the map assets need to be fixed to prevent looping, yet i see no map fixes in the notes, just a nerf that will cause even more “being safe in front of the killer.”

This is what happens when devs arrogantly assume that they know the gameplay better than the players, and make decisions based on their own rank 15ish experience. The obvious solution is to have a small group of the most experienced players (not streamers), on both sides, review your potential decisions. The near universal opinion of your veteran players, was that the last patch was the first step in the right direction in a long time... only for you to then immediately sabotage yourselves by caving to a tiny 500ish player review bomb. Well, since it worked, next time they will bomb you much harder.

We have seen that when Cote played the game as hag he did not know the gameplay better than us. It really frustrates me that people think they can develop a game without playing it for themselves in the real environment with real players. A couple hours a night for a week will show you all the problems with this game.

They build this game around the casual level. The only problems occur when people actually try hard, the game never was built for this

@DeadByFlashlight Sad truth my friend!

FrenziedRoach

No map fixes eh?

I guess you missed the part where certain longer loops have been shortened, and the fact that the landmarks have all been tweaked yet again.

I'm sure more are coming, but you can't sit there and act like no map changes have been made.

NMCKE

FrenziedRoach said:

No map fixes eh?

I guess you missed the part where certain longer loops have been shortened, and the fact that the landmarks have all been tweaked yet again.

I'm sure more are coming, but you can't sit there and act like no map changes have been made.

It's definitely getting better, I'm not talking about that! I'm referring to the hook changes, I didn't agree with that!

FrenziedRoach

@Nickenzie said:
It's definitely getting better, I'm not talking about that! I'm referring to the hook changes, I didn't agree with that!

I suspect the increased number of hooks was in preparation for rebuffing sabotage which was discussed recently.

NMCKE

FrenziedRoach said:

@Nickenzie said:
It's definitely getting better, I'm not talking about that! I'm referring to the hook changes, I didn't agree with that!

I suspect the increased number of hooks was in preparation for rebuffing sabotage which was discussed recently.

I'm actually excited for next few changes!

KingB

I wouldn't mind looping if the survivors had more objectives or something to slow game down.

HellDescent

Imo I think you shouldn't lose bloodlust when breaking a pallet, it was an unnecessary change due to developers not wanting to invest time and money into fixing safe/unsafe loops and balancing pallet, window and wall placement - a band aid so to speak.

Lowbei

HellDescent said:

Imo I think you shouldn't lose bloodlust when breaking a pallet, it was an unnecessary change due to developers not wanting to invest time and money into fixing safe/unsafe loops and balancing pallet, window and wall placement - a band aid so to speak.

yeah i dont think bloodlust should reset on pallet break. i can loop a killer for ages on a pallet, then when his bloodlust reaches 2 and he gets close, drop the pallet and make him lose it, then its on to the next one.

”survivors shouldnt feel safe in front of the killer” - devs 2017

DeadByFlashlight

@Lowbei said:
DeadByFlashlight said:

@Legacy_Zealot said:

 @Lowbei said:

“Survivors shouldnt feel safe in front of the killer” - devs

(the required disclaimer: ive got 1800hrs and been rank1 on both sides at the end of the season dozens of times)

knowing that looping is a problem, why are we nerfing bloodlust?

Bloodlust vs a skilled survivor is already nearly useless, since after looping him for long enough to get enough bloodlust to catch me, i can just drop the pallet and force em to lose bloodlust when he breaks it, then its off to the next pallet.

what seems extremely obvious to me, a survivor main, is that survivors raged and review bombed after the last patch, and the devs solution was to cave to one of the items on the survivor main checklist on the road to starting the match with the gates open. press 3 to twerk at the exit gate.

the point of bloodlust, was that the devs say the map assets need to be fixed to prevent looping, yet i see no map fixes in the notes, just a nerf that will cause even more “being safe in front of the killer.”

This is what happens when devs arrogantly assume that they know the gameplay better than the players, and make decisions based on their own rank 15ish experience. The obvious solution is to have a small group of the most experienced players (not streamers), on both sides, review your potential decisions. The near universal opinion of your veteran players, was that the last patch was the first step in the right direction in a long time... only for you to then immediately sabotage yourselves by caving to a tiny 500ish player review bomb. Well, since it worked, next time they will bomb you much harder.

We have seen that when Cote played the game as hag he did not know the gameplay better than us. It really frustrates me that people think they can develop a game without playing it for themselves in the real environment with real players. A couple hours a night for a week will show you all the problems with this game.

They build this game around the casual level. The only problems occur when people actually try hard, the game never was built for this

the game wasnt built for gamers, but casuals instead?

no

Gamers are the whole group that is playing DBD. Casual and both competitive players are part of the gamer group. Ofc the game was built for gamers

I only said that the game was built around the casual level, when players act competitively, this is when the game breaks

DeadByFlashlight

@FrenziedRoach said:
No map fixes eh?

I guess you missed the part where certain longer loops have been shortened, and the fact that the landmarks have all been tweaked yet again.

I'm sure more are coming, but you can't sit there and act like no map changes have been made.

Did you play haddonfield since the "map fixes"?

DeadByFlashlight

@FrenziedRoach said:

@Nickenzie said:
It's definitely getting better, I'm not talking about that! I'm referring to the hook changes, I didn't agree with that!

I suspect the increased number of hooks was in preparation for rebuffing sabotage which was discussed recently.

Buffing sabotage and nerfing its only counter (picking up a slugged guy will become THREE TIMES EASIER) yes three times, i.e. 300% (i dont even know how they consider such changes) will just lead to very weird games.

Justicar

@thesuicidefox said:

@Lowbei said:
thesuicidefox said:

@Lowbei said:

what seems extremely obvious to me, a survivor main, is that survivors raged and review bombed after the last patch, and the devs solution was to cave to one of the items on the survivor main checklist on the road to starting the match with the gates open. press 3 to twerk at the exit gate.

Except they had talked about nerfing bloodlust several times before. This was just the first time they actually showed us what they plan to do. Before it was just "we are looking into ways to change bloodlust".

If you people really think review bombs did anything in just FEW WEEKS you have no clue how game dev works.

theyve “talked about nerfing” every ability in the game in the last couple years, so thats not really a valid argument here, and you are clearly very naive if you think the bloodlust change was just randomly added right after the review bomb.

And you are clearly naive if you think they managed to do all that design work (prototype, design, playtest, etc.) of the bloodlust nerf in just a 2 weeks after the review bomb. Newsflash, designs processes take a lot longer than that. Have you ever worked in game dev? I have, and if you did you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Really just think about how much time it took the devs to get out changes to anything. There is no such thing as a 2 week turnaround.

Somebody's never heard of Agile development. While the average Sprint cycle is 30 days, 2-week Sprints are also very common.

Lowbei

DeadByFlashlight said:

@FrenziedRoach said:
No map fixes eh?

I guess you missed the part where certain longer loops have been shortened, and the fact that the landmarks have all been tweaked yet again.

I'm sure more are coming, but you can't sit there and act like no map changes have been made.

Did you play haddonfield since the "map fixes"?

i think theyre great!

redsopine1

Again more about looping just bring in a killer and map changes that allows the killer to block these areas off like pushing junk.piles over in MacMillan and auto haven allowing a killer to slow burn the corn fields on MacMillan have the cars explode in lampkin spring wood have flame geyser's when using Freddy allow the hag to flood the swamp maps with a offering slowly the survivors down considerably as well as slugging them means they drown unless helped that's the majority of maps that have mini to large loops that can be

ShrimpTwiggs

Looks like this post is back from the dead.

redsopine1

ShrimpTwiggs said:

Looks like this post is back from the dead.

Sorry had a draft i never posted spamming me

NMCKE

ShrimpTwiggs said:

Looks like this post is back from the dead.

Ooo, indeed!

fcc2014

Gates open to start the game......Soon tm????

Terrortot

thesuicidefox said:

Wait I almost forgot;

You need bloodlust to catch survivors?

Duh, 2 pallet loop, bloodlust activates, drop pallet. Killer has to break pallet and lose bloodlust. That is exactly how a "chase" works. You absolutely need bloodlust.

sixty4half

thesuicidefox said:

@Lowbei said:
thesuicidefox said:

@Lowbei said:

what seems extremely obvious to me, a survivor main, is that survivors raged and review bombed after the last patch, and the devs solution was to cave to one of the items on the survivor main checklist on the road to starting the match with the gates open. press 3 to twerk at the exit gate.

Except they had talked about nerfing bloodlust several times before. This was just the first time they actually showed us what they plan to do. Before it was just "we are looking into ways to change bloodlust".

If you people really think review bombs did anything in just FEW WEEKS you have no clue how game dev works.

theyve “talked about nerfing” every ability in the game in the last couple years, so thats not really a valid argument here, and you are clearly very naive if you think the bloodlust change was just randomly added right after the review bomb.

And you are clearly naive if you think they managed to do all that design work (prototype, design, playtest, etc.) of the bloodlust nerf in just a 2 weeks after the review bomb. Newsflash, designs processes take a lot longer than that. Have you ever worked in game dev? I have, and if you did you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Really just think about how much time it took the devs to get out changes to anything. There is no such thing as a 2 week turnaround.

How quickly did they nerf The Nightmare into the ground after release?  Maybe not 2 weeks.  Whatever the time was, I'll put money on that time frame for their reversal if/when they ever do release a DS change

Lowbei

while doing a killer daily last night, a survivor (who died) told me there should be 3 exit gates.

DarkWo1f997

Lowbei said:

while doing a killer daily last night, a survivor (who died) told me there should be 3 exit gates.

And a hatch next to every generator

PhantomMask20763

Why did someone rez this thread?

Lowbei

PhantomMask20763 said:

Why did someone rez this thread?

because its still relevant

PhantomMask20763

@Lowbei said:
PhantomMask20763 said:

Why did someone rez this thread?

because its still relevant

I see, well I'll just leave it up to you since I have nothing to say on the matter, see you in the next thread.

Seanzu

@Lowbei said:
while doing a killer daily last night, a survivor (who died) told me there should be 3 exit gates.

Rank 20 survivors tend to say stupid stuff, wait until they get a few more hours kiddo.

Lowbei

SenzuDuck said:

@Lowbei said:
while doing a killer daily last night, a survivor (who died) told me there should be 3 exit gates.

Rank 20 survivors tend to say stupid stuff, wait until they get a few more hours kiddo.

he was rank4, try to keep your personal butthurt at me off this thread, ty  

NMCKE

Lowbei said:

SenzuDuck said:

@Lowbei said:
while doing a killer daily last night, a survivor (who died) told me there should be 3 exit gates.

Rank 20 survivors tend to say stupid stuff, wait until they get a few more hours kiddo.

he was rank4, try to keep your personal butthurt at me off this thread, ty  

Again, you gotta ignore some people @Lowbei he's not worth your time!

Lowbei

Nickenzie said:

Lowbei said:

SenzuDuck said:

@Lowbei said:
while doing a killer daily last night, a survivor (who died) told me there should be 3 exit gates.

Rank 20 survivors tend to say stupid stuff, wait until they get a few more hours kiddo.

he was rank4, try to keep your personal butthurt at me off this thread, ty  

Again, you gotta ignore some people @Lowbei he's not worth your time!

youre right.

NMCKE

Anyways, how are the maps @Lowbei? In my opinion, BL should be removed when the maps are completely balanced. Balanced meaning that a single survivor can't loop killers for a while when both players are equally skilled. Let's say no more than 1 minute?

"Eh, not many killers need BL3 anyways and you hardly ever reach BL3 anyways!"

If BL3 was so rare then why nerf it? I hear that statement a lot from fog travelers.

brokedownpalace

sixty4half said:

thesuicidefox said:

@Lowbei said:
thesuicidefox said:

@Lowbei said:

what seems extremely obvious to me, a survivor main, is that survivors raged and review bombed after the last patch, and the devs solution was to cave to one of the items on the survivor main checklist on the road to starting the match with the gates open. press 3 to twerk at the exit gate.

Except they had talked about nerfing bloodlust several times before. This was just the first time they actually showed us what they plan to do. Before it was just "we are looking into ways to change bloodlust".

If you people really think review bombs did anything in just FEW WEEKS you have no clue how game dev works.

theyve “talked about nerfing” every ability in the game in the last couple years, so thats not really a valid argument here, and you are clearly very naive if you think the bloodlust change was just randomly added right after the review bomb.

And you are clearly naive if you think they managed to do all that design work (prototype, design, playtest, etc.) of the bloodlust nerf in just a 2 weeks after the review bomb. Newsflash, designs processes take a lot longer than that. Have you ever worked in game dev? I have, and if you did you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Really just think about how much time it took the devs to get out changes to anything. There is no such thing as a 2 week turnaround.

How quickly did they nerf The Nightmare into the ground after release?  Maybe not 2 weeks.  Whatever the time was, I'll put money on that time frame for their reversal if/when they ever do release a DS change

Nice revisionist history. Freddy was never good. The nerfs made him slightly worse.

Lowbei

Nickenzie said:

Anyways, how are the maps @Lowbei? In my opinion, BL should be removed when the maps are completely balanced. Balanced meaning that a single survivor can't loop killers for a while when both players are equally skilled. Let's say no more than 1 minute?

"Eh, not many killers need BL3 anyways and you hardly ever reach BL3 anyways!"

If BL3 was so rare then why nerf it? I hear that statement a lot from fog travelers.

i think bl is fine as the only time it ever kicks in is during loops, which was its intention. them nerfing it was dumb. i doubt maps will ever be completely rid of loopable areas tbh