Killer has never been easier

I don't get all the killers who crutch on ruin being in such an outrage. There was only really a handful of killers it was needed on to be competitive, and even those you can 4k at red ranks without it. The best killers had already realize corrupt intervention was better in most cases.

In the meantime, almost every single patch in the past 1-2 years has been slowly but surely gutting survivors. Some of the killers are still incredibly overpowered and easy to play (freddy / hag come to mind), combined with the dedicated servers making no pallet or window truly safe anymore. Go for the pallet stun? Maybe he hits you, maybe he doesn't, who knows what will happen anymore? The new maps have pallets that are designed for good latency. Every unsafe pallet you need to stun the killer to really make use of, and going for stuns on dedicated servers is risky as hell.

All the new maps coming out are just absolute slaughtering grounds. Hawkins comes to mind, but the sanctum of wrath is also terrible. You will get maybe 6-7 pallets to use on the entire map, and an overpowered character like freddy can still just snare-lust you at literally any tile because the next safe pallet is usually still going to be 2 hits away.

I don't get the devs logic. They will prioritize doctor because "He is frustrating to play against" when there's still a ton of completely BS killers who are way more powerful and oppressive to play against. Take legion, if he sees you, you are injured. Sure, a good survivor can loop him for a while, depending on the map. But then you get him on Sanctum of Wrath or Shelter Woods, and drop 2 pallets and from then on that entire side of the map is a dead zone. I don't think he is overpowered, but he sees you, you are injured. That is way more annoying than doctor. "Oh no, the M1 killers know where I am!" is literally his entire kit.

You can be absolutely terrible at killer in this game and still down even the best of survivors eventually these days. Survivors are almost forced to run the same boring 3-4 perks because facecamping is so easy to do for cheap kills.

So personally, I welcome the ruin nerfs. And that is as a killer main, who is sad how easy and skilless the devs have let killer become.

Comments

  • @Feyd said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/981618#Comment_981618

    First off, those "toxic" methods are already used in the overwhelming majority of games. Otherwise BT and DS wouldn't be meta. There would be no point in taking perks to counter crappy behavior if said crappy behavior wasn't commonplace.

    Secondly, have you ever stopped to consider that if all four survivors escape that quickly they were just simply better than you? If you think it's just the game and gen rush is a problem, then all survivor complaints about OP killers and add-ons giving them 4k's in less than five minutes suddenly have merit as well. Be careful what you wish for.

    I'd like to see you prove that claim with data rather than anecdote. Furthermore, your implication that Survivors only take BT and DS because killers are toxic is absurd. I've been DS'd many a time adhering to these rules Survivors make based on what they do and don't like. I've seen people DS underperforming killers as a Survivor many a time. Don't point fingers and claim Killers are toxic as a rule and then pretend Survivors aren't. No one will take you seriously.

    In regard to your second paragraph, you're willfully blind and ignorant if you think gen progression rates at high ranks are even remotely reasonable. In fact, comments like yours are why killers will become even more toxic than ever and will stay that way: Instead of acknowledging that the early game is rigged against Killer you just insinuate they are bad.

    I've got news for you: You're in for a rude awakening when the new Post-Ruin meta settles in. If Killers have to win in less than five to seven minutes consistently Survivors are going to get the most brutal methods Killers can devise and no one will hold back. Two things prevented this before: Ruin and courtesy. One is gone and the other has been forsaken by people like you. Enjoy the consequences.

  • @DeadArsenal said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/985399#Comment_985399

    I'd like to see you prove that claim with data rather than anecdote. Furthermore, your implication that Survivors only take BT and DS because killers are toxic is absurd. I've been DS'd many a time adhering to these rules Survivors make based on what they do and don't like. I've seen people DS underperforming killers as a Survivor many a time. Don't point fingers and claim Killers are toxic as a rule and then pretend Survivors aren't. No one will take you seriously.

    In regard to your second paragraph, you're willfully blind and ignorant if you think gen progression rates at high ranks are even remotely reasonable. In fact, comments like yours are why killers will become even more toxic than ever and will stay that way: Instead of acknowledging that the early game is rigged against Killer you just insinuate they are bad.

    I've got news for you: You're in for a rude awakening when the new Post-Ruin meta settles in. If Killers have to win in less than five to seven minutes consistently Survivors are going to get the most brutal methods Killers can devise and no one will hold back. Two things prevented this before: Ruin and courtesy. One is gone and the other has been forsaken by people like you. Enjoy the consequences.

    Again, threatening to be more toxic is not a threat. I'm used to it. Yes, that's anecdotal. I never claimed it wasn't.

    Second, *AS KILLER*, I don't have a problem playing nice and I don't use ruin. I mainly play Doc, so I'm not some god tier killer. I more often get 12 hooks than I get 4 man escapes. You do not need to get 4 kills every game. I've had 0k games where I still pipped.

  • @Feyd said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/985864#Comment_985864

    Again, threatening to be more toxic is not a threat. I'm used to it. Yes, that's anecdotal. I never claimed it wasn't.

    Second, *AS KILLER*, I don't have a problem playing nice and I don't use ruin. I mainly play Doc, so I'm not some god tier killer. I more often get 12 hooks than I get 4 man escapes. You do not need to get 4 kills every game. I've had 0k games where I still pipped.

    I'm not making a threat. I'm telling you how it's going to be. It doesn't matter what I do. I never even had Ruin as a teachable. But do remember that high rank meta trickles down. Low tier players always emulate high tier players. If high tier play is merciless and devoid of courtesy then low tier will be as well.

  • @DeadArsenal said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/985876#Comment_985876

    I'm not making a threat. I'm telling you how it's going to be. It doesn't matter what I do. I never even had Ruin as a teachable. But do remember that high rank meta trickles down. Low tier players always emulate high tier players. If high tier play is merciless and devoid of courtesy then low tier will be as well.

    And again, I'm just telling you that's how it already is. And I'm red ranked so the trickle down comment is irrelevant.

  • @Feyd said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/985886#Comment_985886

    And again, I'm just telling you that's how it already is. And I'm red ranked so the trickle down comment is irrelevant.

    The only reason you think it's "irrelevant" is because you don't care about new players or people who don't play that often. It's extremely relevant because now that killers absolutely MUST play as if they have the absolute minimum amount of time to win no matter what that's exactly what they'll do. When new people start playing killer they'll learn from that as an example. Those are part of the consequences I'm talking about. Nobody wins here. Not red ranks, not new players, and certainly not you or me.

  • @[Deleted User] said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/983229#Comment_983229

    Please, stop making excuses already.

    I don't run toolboxes as survivor in my matches, and generators were still getting complete in about 6 and a half minutes on average.

    Even if I don't run toolboxes (which by the way, *A LOT OF PEOPLE DO*), what's to stop someone else from running a toolbox with a BNP? Or Prove Thyself, or anything else to speed up the game?

    It doesn't even matter if they were running toolboxes with a BNP or not because after the Ruin nerf hits, nobody will even have to. Nerf will do more damage than any toolbox or BNP will ever do.

    Just because most people don't, doesn't mean people can't. You don't balance around the average -- you balance around the problem.

    I would have thought 3 years of this ######### going on would have been enough evidence that something with the core structure of the game is seriously wrong but no, people still want to make excuses and refuse to address the wrongs.

    Seriously that video was literally showed the problems with gen times.

    What made it worse was the fact that a lot of green rank killers faced top rank survivors.....

    I think killers will derank to yellow ranks to actually have somewhat of a fun time, and I wouldn't blame them either.

  • @DeadArsenal said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/985894#Comment_985894

    The only reason you think it's "irrelevant" is because you don't care about new players or people who don't play that often. It's extremely relevant because now that killers absolutely MUST play as if they have the absolute minimum amount of time to win no matter what that's exactly what they'll do. When new people start playing killer they'll learn from that as an example. Those are part of the consequences I'm talking about. Nobody wins here. Not red ranks, not new players, and certainly not you or me.

    Playing killer against newbies even as one is not hard. If you can patrol gens, you can 4k. Low rank survivors go down faster than a Kardashian.

  • @Seanzu said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/983206#Comment_983206

    A survivor that is running toolboxes & BNPs every game with his friends, which 95% of the rest of the people playing aren't.

    Stop making excuses, the game is about to enter a 2nd Dark times, and its sad to see such people attempt to defend this.

    The pattern here is really funny too, survivors attempted to claim the game was fine during the 1st Dark Times, and are now attempting to do the same here.

  • Just saying I've played killer and Survivor pretty much the same amount the last month or two. I was rank 12 on both 2 months ago after taking a break.

    Now I'm rank 3 survivor and rank 7 killer. As a casual I can feel the ease that survivor is compared to killer.

    I don't pip when I deserve pips as killer, I pip when I do hardly anything as survivor.

  • @Feyd said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/985907#Comment_985907

    Playing killer against newbies even as one is not hard. If you can patrol gens, you can 4k. Low rank survivors go down faster than a Kardashian.

    So, knowing that, you don't see a problem with those killers learning from merciless high level race against time meta? Low rank play becomes that much easier for killers and that much harder for survivors. If you were new and you got torn to shreds and/or mori'd within a few minutes of starting many of your earliest matches how long would you stick around?

    But that's not even the worst part. All of these previously "toxic" methods become the status quo for everyone. Everyone ruthlessly exploits every advantage they can get. Everyone hates everyone else. Hell, I bet Survivor sandbagging will even go up just because people want to live slightly longer than everyone else to squeeze a few more bloodpoints out of the ever-shorter round.

  • @Apple2o said:

    I don't get all the killers who crutch on ruin being in such an outrage. There was only really a handful of killers it was needed on to be competitive, and even those you can 4k at red ranks without it. The best killers had already realize corrupt intervention was better in most cases.

    In the meantime, almost every single patch in the past 1-2 years has been slowly but surely gutting survivors. Some of the killers are still incredibly overpowered and easy to play (freddy / hag come to mind), combined with the dedicated servers making no pallet or window truly safe anymore. Go for the pallet stun? Maybe he hits you, maybe he doesn't, who knows what will happen anymore? The new maps have pallets that are designed for good latency. Every unsafe pallet you need to stun the killer to really make use of, and going for stuns on dedicated servers is risky as hell.

    All the new maps coming out are just absolute slaughtering grounds. Hawkins comes to mind, but the sanctum of wrath is also terrible. You will get maybe 6-7 pallets to use on the entire map, and an overpowered character like freddy can still just snare-lust you at literally any tile because the next safe pallet is usually still going to be 2 hits away.

    I don't get the devs logic. They will prioritize doctor because "He is frustrating to play against" when there's still a ton of completely BS killers who are way more powerful and oppressive to play against. Take legion, if he sees you, you are injured. Sure, a good survivor can loop him for a while, depending on the map. But then you get him on Sanctum of Wrath or Shelter Woods, and drop 2 pallets and from then on that entire side of the map is a dead zone. I don't think he is overpowered, but he sees you, you are injured. That is way more annoying than doctor. "Oh no, the M1 killers know where I am!" is literally his entire kit.

    You can be absolutely terrible at killer in this game and still down even the best of survivors eventually these days. Survivors are almost forced to run the same boring 3-4 perks because facecamping is so easy to do for cheap kills.

    So personally, I welcome the ruin nerfs. And that is as a killer main, who is sad how easy and skilless the devs have let killer become.

    This is obviously a survivor main in disguise

  • @Feyd said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/985425#Comment_985425

    I've been playing doc using no ruin for months. Still typically 4k unless I get really outplayed in a Chase. Accept the fact that there are people better than you from time to time. Take your loss and move on the the next game.

    Also, my friends and I run into a tunneler pretty much every game with camping being so common that nearly every unhook requires BT. Not everyone's experience is the same, but threatening us with "we'll just be toxic jerks" doesn't work since that's pretty much all I see anyway.

    Stream it record it, i dont believe you one bit. Enlighten everyone how to be a godly killer with doc. 15 games at least, 12 have to be 4ks all red rank matches ofc.

  • How is that proof of anything. You could type "proof" in chat and I'd take that as evidence. as it stands that doesn't prove anything.

  • @konchok said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/993855#Comment_993855

    How is that proof of anything. You could type "proof" in chat and I'd take that as evidence. as it stands that doesn't prove anything.

    .....what? lmao

  • @Mister_xD said:

    i have to agree: killer is easier than ever.

    that doesnt have to mean anything though. looking at how unbalanced everything was back in the day, the game would not be alive now if killer experience wasnt improved drastically.

    instead of comparing the current killer experience with the "Dark Times" - as some call the early years of DbD, why not compare killer experience with survivor experience?

    if you did that, you would have realized the difference between playing killer and survivor - namely that the killer has a LOT more pressure to deal with that the survivors. survivors are still the easier role to play (which was confirmed by the devs, as they want survivor to be more of a casual mode) and survivors, despite of what many say, still hold the game in their hands.

    its survivors who dictate how long the round will take. its their playstyles that change how every single game plays out and all killers can really do about that is to see what survivors do and act accordingly.

    a prime example for this would be looping:

    the survivor dictates the rout they run, the killer only follows. if the survivor screws up at one point, the killer can punish him for that - unless the survivor brings one of the many second chance perks ofc, which eradicates their mistake. in theory, if a survivor team was to play completely flawless with a killer who plays completely flawless, the survivors would end the round with a 4 man escape, as gens would be done incredibly efficiently and the killer would be unable to catch a survivor in the time given to him before the game ends.

    this is what i got from my killer and survivor experience so far:

    the hits i get as killer are usually when 1) i catch them out in the open and they have no plan where they want to run off to; 2) they go for unsave hookrescues; 3) they make a mistake in their looping.

    and as a survivor i usually die when 1) my team is playing very inefficiently (i play solo survivor a lot. in my last game i did 3 gens on my own (3 gens were completed in total) rescued many (3 or 4) players from a hook (safely) and went down once due to me misjudging the distance i could run around a loop. i got out via hatch though - lucky me); 2) i screw up on a loop; 3) i misjudged the killers capability of finding me (i am more of a stealth player).

    in the end my experience from both sides says, that - unless the killer brings their strongest possible loadout - survivors dont ever have to go down. by the time the ressources survivors have to waste a killers time are used up - when the survivors know how to efficiently use them - the game is over. ive had games where the survivors didnt even know how to efficiently use a pallet and still stalled me for 3 gens just by instantly throwing safe pallets down and holding 'W'. and this is exactly the scenario many killers find themselves in, which is why they bring ruin to slow down the gen speed.

    and i havent even started talking about survivors second chance perks...

    though seeing how long this post is im gonne stop now xD

    TL;DR:

    survivor is a lot easier to play than killer, even though killer is "easier than ever" and survivor is "harder than ever".

    play some high rank killer games without ruin and see how it goes for you.

    it took me over a year of training to be able to play without the perk and there are still many games where i just dont stand a chance at all, since gens get completed so much faster than i could ever hook the survivors, which is a serious problem.

    killer may be easier than ever, but that doesnt mean the game is balanced.

    PS: in case you wonder why killers are so angry atm, thats because the devs just nerfed the #1 early game slow down perk without acknowledging the issue why many used it. this is also not comparable to many of the latest survivor nerfs, such as DS, insta heals or BNP, as none of these removed things were needed for survivors to survive - yes ruin is also not needed, but without ruin you have a tremendously harder game. you can still survive very well without any of these, now removed, crutches though. the games dont get significantly harder without them, they were just an extra.

    You forgot to add 4) dedicated window/pallet hits. Once it's getting fixed it'll be even worse for killer/easier for survivor

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