About DS
Lmao such a trash clutch perk.
Literally got to end game hooked 3 people and lost all my work because one person ran borrowed time and they all just run hooked each other at the door and all my work goes down the drain and survivors say the game is favored towards killer what a joke lmao.
But yet we still felt the need to nerf oni into the ground. Haha this game is so hilariously one sided
Comments
But at the same time, NOED could be the same. DS is for a survivor's one shot at escaping, NOED is the killers one shot at downing them. And, DS is only usable once, where NOED is constant until destroyed. You can't expect Survivors to be left completely defenceless,they need someway to escape. Though, the scenario you had is a horrible one. I've had it many times, and it is annoying to encounter, so don't get me wrong, I'm not defending DS here, just stating that Survivors need a way to at least have a chance to escape beyond wiggle
Survivors run exactly those perks to prevent killers from building pressure in the endgame. It's a strategy and you can counter it by, for example, slugging or trying to get a few DS out early game. Or just kill all of them before the gens are done.
Lol expect them to be defenseless oh cause godloops in the middle of maps, crazy junglegym and t/L wall loops tied together is helpless, foh lol
Their chance to escape is called play good, not have crutch perks save the day.
I would be a lot less annoyed by the crap balance if the SINGLE FING OBJECTIVE that survivors have to do wasn't so damn easy lol. Its pathetically ridiculous how incredibly easy it is to do gens even with slow down perks.
Can't slug when you're by the dang door, slugging is only viable if you have enough distance. No Ed is countered by simple cleansing a totem that take what... 8 seconds 10 to cleanse lol oh and their spawns a terrible do know how many games I've had where my hexes spawn right by a gen or by a survivor or out in the open. I'd argue that's it's more to be in a bad spot than a good one AT LEAST half the time. Probably more than that from what I've seen
If survivors can have these crutch perks then there should be no perks attached to totems.
I have to agree on that one. The amount of times I've literally searched for about 30 seconds after the match begins and boom. 3 Gens just go off from nowhere. So I do think that the whole Gen repair system is a little flawed at this point. And the looping, it is annoying to all hell. I guess I take back the defenseless part then, since they ain't TOO defenseless. But, what can we expect after 4 years? I don't see these infinites and godloops being fixed anytime soon, which sucks because it's making playing killer boring these days, and survivor is a sweatfest for them to get that 4k
Imagine NOED only applying on four hits. The equivalent to a perk, that's one time use.
It's just very weird to me that a game that is asymetrical the power role does NOT feel like it's the ONE against the four lol.
Survivors are not afraid of killers at all. One mess up from a survivor ITS ALL GOOD You get 4 more chances (extra hit, Ds, bt, dead hard, adrenaline,)
One mess up from killer and you got an extra 1-3 minute chase depending on how good the survivor is. That's basically 3 Gens done in one chase with a team that's playing smart.
I know what people say pressure the gens, yeah can't pressure gens on the huge maps, and unless your playing a stealth killer you're not sneaking up on anyone. You also sacrifice anywork that you made on the previous survivor
Not sure where you're going with your statement elaborate for me.
Decisive Strike. Deliverance. Unbreakable.
Even Borrowed Time was one time use before the deep wound change.
Survivor perks got downsides too and instead of binding strong killer perks to a time limit or some other limitation they decided to introduce totems.
I would be fine with the totems if they were actually well hidden see my early post.
In their current state it's not even a gamble, it's almost guaranteed that will be in a terrible spot, I RARELY ever have a hex totem last longer than a minute and I know most of the time the survivors aren't even looking for them because IM NOT EVEN LOOKING FOR THEM when I find them the majority of the time
That's a totem spot/map design problem. I can agree, that some totem spots are just incredibly bad.
Some... Lmao if my hexs didn't get destroyed in the first minute on the regular I'd agree SOME are incredibly bad. But they do so I'm gonna say MOST.
I LITERALLY just played a game where my totem spawned ALL THE WAY ACROSS THE MAP, next to a generator next to a survivor lol on the new map no less which if I'm not mistaken is the smallest map right now and I STILL couldn't even make it over to even check the totem I literally got there AS he broke it lol.
I only use ruin for early slowdown and rely on other ways to pressure gens. Even devour hope gets cleansed like 95% of my games before even getting used so...
That's my point totem perks an effing joke right now. You literally just made my point for me.
They should just remove all insta down hex totems and devour/noed and all other perks just be perks. That can't be cleansed.
The difference between NOED and DS though is that NOED has counterplay, which is cleansing. I once downed a person, she got unhooked while I downed and killed 2 other people, found her and grabbed her out of a locker, she then DS'd me and got the hatch. If DS simply ended once someone was hooked then It would be a fine perk, but at the moment it has barely any counterplay and it's a complete "get out of jail free" perk.
Exactly, slugging isn't counter play, that's like saying not chasing is counter play. Lol and hopping in locker to force the DS just proves that all the more.
You didn't lose because of BT. You lost the match because you got to endgame with too many people still alive and well. If you didn't manage to thin the herd or make everybody dead on next hook, then you should expect to lose most of the time when endgame time comes.
Lol spoken like a true non killer, I got 7 hooks that's
Almost every person hooked twice. Now I could have guaranteed some kills by tunneling but I try to make the game fun. But why should I make the game fun of the game is designed to screw killers I'm the first place. THIS is why killers tunnel lmao but y'all want to complain when we do it.
Just as oblivious as the devs. That's why they got completely bullied when they tried to play killer against their player base back before the flashlight and pallet nerf. But they love their survivors so much that even some public humiliation wasn't enough to make them see how unbalanced their game is.
The killer is supposed to be the power role, but he's not. Plain and simple.
Oh also no one is talking about but right now
I play both, so I'm a true non killer like I'm a true non survivor. Still the one who thinks they're a 'true' killer but who couldn't kill a fish in a barrell is you.
You said you had 7 hooks, but you also said you did 3 hooks endgame.
So, if you had 7 hooks in total, you had a whopping 4 hooks before endgame. In that case, the point would still stand. You didn't lose because of BT, you lost because you sucked throughout the match.
If you had 7 hooks before endgame, then someone would have been dead with 3 additional hooks and 10 total. In that case, you would have sucked at math and as a liar.
Truth stings, but it'll set you free.
More game practice, less forum whining.
Free tip: your problem is in that '1-3 min chase'. You're either bad at finishing chases or at leaving bad chases. Whiny bad player. Case in point.
F hook chasing killers. You probably just use bbq for the stacks.
Yeah no, if you're going against good survivors there's literally no reason you can't make a chase last at LEAST A MINUTE LOL literally all you ha EA to do is put a pallet down and run to the next pallet and if you get a loop or 2 even better.
Someone must not play this game lol
Actually I don't like BBQ literally all you need to do is go to gens and you find survivors tracking perks are mostly a waste the only good thing about BBQ is that you know if someone is near your recent hook or not
This thread should probably be closed. You are just insulting people and starting arguments
I don't see why you think hooking 3 people should mean you win ? What is this logic even. It is pretty normal the last person to unhook them. At best you shoul've gone for the person who unhooked the first one. Or just leave anyone you hit on the ground for a minute. There is no way all the hooks were at the door so they can't really just slug out in a minute. Lots of things you can do, just be smart
Sometimes there will be games that you don't get a 4k. Sometimes it will be because of one perk. Do you know how many games there are where that one perk doesn't come into play? Maybe try to have fun playing the game and not let something you can't control ruin it for you?
I don't care about getting a 4k every time, I just don't like the fact that killers get way more punishment from perks than any survivor gets from ANY of the killers perks. You can't even counter play many of the survivor perks, again slugging is not countering.
Hard to enjoy a game when it leans so heavily to one side.
Don't play it if you don't enjoy it.
just remember without killers you have no game, and wait times are significantly longer as a survivor than as a killer (at least on xbox can't speak for other consoles)which tells me the majority of killers aren't happy with the state of the game. But I'd be willing to bet it's similar
If the gates are opened you’ve pretty much failed your objective.
@Sairek
The gates are open, one or more survivors are already going to escape aka they won.
If you play killer you have a full understanding of this. At that point you can only do so much to redeem yourself.
@Sairek
I think you missed the part where I said they could redeem themselves (killers).
You depend on mistakes from survivors to win, not because you were a god.
I mean y'all can keep saying get good but on console at least it's very obvious killers are losing interest the ones still playing are those of us who are willing to put up with the non sense and took time to learn the simple game
There's some instances in end-game where you can't prevent the DS if they are about to crawl out of the door, but in every other situation, you can literally just wait out DS. Assume every survivor runs it. You literally just counter it by not tunneling. It's not hard.
Not tunneling isn't a counter, DS is a counter to tunneling, which whatever fine, but the amount of times I've had survivors go for an unsafe unhook and I get him then the person he unhooked is crazy, why should I have to slug him because his team mate made a crap play. Killers a punished much more significantly for a single mistake than survivors are.
1 mistake can anywhere from an extra 10-30 seconds for less severe mistakes that's almost half a gens worth of progress you can only chase one survivor at a time. So that's 3 Gens potentially almost half done for a MINOR mistake maybe a LITTLE less IF your lucky.
But a major mistake and you're looking at upwards of 40-70% for up to 3 other gens completed for one mistake. What happens if survivors make a mistake well aside from the fact they get 2 hooks they also have perks that negate their mistakes even more DS, adrenaline, any exhaustion perk, if you're running all 3 od this you're essentially looking at a MINIMUM OF 6 crutches to a survivors bad play. 2 hooks 3 exhaustions first one and 2 for each successive hook and DS because even if you slug that's a whole 60 seconds you have to leave them alone which unless you literally just sit on top of them means they get one more free recive(that's not counting recovery of exhaustion if they manage to lose killer which I have no problem with because that means they played well)
Plus you got survivors who will literally come back and purposefully get downed because there DS is still active
Which is normally not an issue but then you get seal team toxic where everyone is running the same character and outfit so now you got to keep track of the name that was hooked how long it's been since they were unhooked.
Killers get what. Noed if they're lucky and the totem wasn't cleansed before end game, devour if you're lucky (I rarely ever get past 2 tokens before it's cleansed) killers have zero perks to make up for minor or major mistakes that are actually RELIABLE.
why should I have to slug him because his team mate made a crap play
If you take the bait and pick up the survivor with DS, then obviously his team mate didn't make a crap play. You just fell for it. Just leave the person slugged, and then the person has made a crap play and you're at a huge advantage.
And yes, if killer's weren't punished as heavily for mistakes then everybody would get 4ks and be rank 1. You go up in rank by making less mistakes each game.
DS is not a reliable perk. It does nothing if the killer waits it out. I can't remember the last time I got DS'd. Adrenaline is not a reliable perk. Most games it does nothing. You either die before the gens are done, or you are already at full hp when the gens are done.
Enduring seems like a pretty dang reliable perk for the killer making mistakes. Bamboozle, Pop, Spirit Fury, Brutal Strength, etc, etc, etc, all seem like perks that consistently help the killer recover from mistakes. Every stalling and regression perk in the game helps the killer recover from mistakes.
Wrong on almost every account. As I already stated slugging is NOT a counter to DS for the reasons I already stated not repeating myself and you clearly understand this because you purposefully ignored what was said
Enduring is not a perk for mistakes, respecting pallets at red ranks leads to more wasted time looping because by the time you realize they aren't dropping the pallet they automatically get an extra loop unless you've already gotten bloodlust and sometimes on bigger loops even bloodlust 1 doesn't make up for that. So that's not a mistake that a killer has made.
Vaulting a window as killer isn't a mistake have you not seen how many loops literally require you to vault to keep chase lol. The few times that it IS a mistake it does nothing for you because literally the survivor can just run to the next loop a lot of good that bamboozle just did for you lol.
Again spirit fury doesn't help with recover from mistakes for the same reason enduring doesn't it just makes the most optimal play SLIGHTLY more optimal still have to eat 2 loops before it even helps and depending on the size of the loop that can be a lot of wasted time.
Brutal strength even if I granted that eating a pallet was a bad play 90% of the time it's not. Literally does nothing for a mistake you made. It helps you get through a pallet faster that you have no control over when it gets dropped, so whether you avoid it or not it doesn't help with a mistake you made.(just so we are clear not saying it doesn't help but it literally does nothing for mistakes)
Stalling perks don't help you recover from mistakes lol. They help slow down the game and are arguably some of the worst perks ruin the strongest stall perk (if it lasts) is still a crap stall perk high ranks can literally consistently hit great skill checks and even if they didn't they still have to get a skill check to even deal with the effects and let's not get into the crap totem spawns.
Pop is meh it's got a nice amount of regression BUT you have to get a hook then you have to make find the gen that's got the most work done. That doesn't help recover from mistakes that rewards you (barely) for playing well lol.
something that would help recover from a MISTAKE would be something that increases your speed after a missed attack, increased lunge range the ONLY thing that helps with recover from mistakes is bloodlust. But that's pretty much negates at high rank because the most optimal way to play is force pallet drops and even if you didn't at long loops you have to break the pallet anyway which resets your bloodlust. So congrats the ONE mechanic that helps you recover from a mistake is useless in red rank lol.
Perks for killer by and large are just there to make your play slightly more optimal they don't help you recover from mistakes. One perk that I can say does actually help with a killer mistake is the one where you recover faster from a missed attack
Not tunneling is a counter to DS. Slugging is a way to not tunnel. Sure their teammate can come pick them up, and that means there is 2 people not doing gens.
If you get pallet stunned without getting a hit, that means you've made a mistake. You either estimated the time incorrectly, or predicted that they wouldn't throw the pallet. That isn't something that is subjective. That's an objective fact. Sure, it's safer to eat the pallet to guarantee they throw it, but you could have predicted the throw and not gotten hit by it. It's riskier, but you haven't made the mistake of getting stunned.
I think you are looking at being 'rewarded' and 'recover from mistakes' as 2 different things, when you should be looking at them as the same. Stalling perks let you slow down the game, which is allowing you more room to make mistakes. For instance, you swing at a survivor running towards a window, but he fakes the vault and you don't get a hit. Because you're running ruin, that mistake has less of an impact on the game. The other gens were all progressed by 2% for that missed swing instead of by 7%. A perk that slows down the game does the same exact thing as a perk that helps you recover from mistakes.
Unrelenting is a perk that directly helps killers recover from mistakes. I don't think you can argue with that.
But anyways, back to the purpose of this post, stop tunneling and you're good. Stop complaining about a perk that you can just avoid by being conscious and aware of going on, and by not being a dick.
I guess you missed the part where the vast majority of times I get hit by da has nothing to do with tunneling amd everything to do with a crap save. Aka I killed the savior and STILL caught the person on hook.
Slugging is not a counter, it prevent me from getting a whole hook state for 60 seconds and unless I sit on top of him I'm forced to go to gens and LOOK for a survivor hopefully
They got 60 seconds of free time to work on gens longer before he's even at risk of being hooked at even if they wait for 40 that's HALF. Of a gen done 2 if the two remaining survivors stay on gens and coordinate who goes for the revive.
That's FREE gen time with no hook state cost. DS is literally a perk that can not be countered because either way the survivors benefit. Whether you slug or not.
Saying slugging is a counter to DS is like saying abandoning a chase cause they got to a god loop is a counter, no it's still there you've still wasted time up to that point, and now you have abandones a survivor that you were chasing. That's not a counter.
Yes, you caught the person who was on hook. Why on earth would you just pick them up and assume they don't have DS? Just leave them there. They are using a perk slot to prevent you from killing them 60 seconds after being unhooked.
Slugging them is doing the same thing as hooking them. They still need a teammate to come pick them up and stop doing gens. Leave them alone. Just go look for other people and let them get picked up. Then you know where 2 people are.
The 60 seconds of free time are not working on gens, they are spent laying on the ground. Better yet, forget about the person you downed who just got off the gen. Just chase other people. Any person who gets unhooked, I literally just pretend they don't exist for 60 seconds unless I can't find anybody else. Always chase the person who did the unhook. If you can down both, why are you even complaining? You have 2 downed people and are most likely going to 4k regardless of what you do. You're in great shape and DS isn't going to stop that. Leave the other person alone and wait for them to get picked up and now you have waited out the DS timer and know where 2 people are. Chase whichever one you want.
FREE HEALTH STATE I can't make it any more clear than that so what they're not working on gens they can get most of the healing done on their own so at an absolutely MAXIMUM a survivor has to spend 3 seconds reviving them yeah they may not be doing a gen but they aren't losing a health state either and the other survivors if they are playing smart can still work a gen it benefits the survivors not matter what you do. Whether it's early game or late game. So what if I'm "winning" it is literally 100% beneficial for them no matter how you deal with it. Slug or pick them up slug well now they don't lose a health state no one has to come get them for at least 30 to 40 seconds, eat the DS well you can either chase or just say screw it and look for someone else that's gonna completely depend where that DS happened.
Your problem is you don't care because IH IM winning right now. (Theoretically) I'd argue that you really only achieved anything if they lost a health state on the hook. It's like saying because you hit everyone youre winning. You're not, hook health state is the ONLY thing that matters for killer. Until you get a hook health state you have NOT made progress on killing them because no matter how many times you hit them unless they get hooked they have the same amount of health states they dont progressively lose it. Which would be fine if you didn't have to constantly juggle survivors to try and keep up map pressure and deal with perks that prevent you from actually progressing your objective (health state hooks)
I can tell were probably not going to be on the same page and that's fine. I can deal with bullcrap lol but not a lot of people can I bring it up because I like to play survivor frequently as well and it's hard to do that when I'm waiting 15, 20, or 30 minutes. I don't know what the wait times o. PC are or the other consoles but the Xbox survivor ques are terrible I have a feeling it's comparable at least to the other consoles.
As a survivor main I'm in the minority with my opinion of DS. For me the only time it is useful is if the gate is open and you can use it to buy enough time to escape. Using DS any earlier than that and you can almost guarantee being tunneled. I considered it a must have until I realized every time I used it the killer would tunnel me mercilessly. So for me it's one of those risky perks. It can be a life saver if you don't need it until the gates are open. If you need it before then it's a likely death sentence.
@DarthRane It's a frustrating perk to play against. I agree. I was just trying to give you the other side of it. I personally stopped running it because I would only get the chance to use it once every 10 games. I hit rank 1 survivor for the first time this season on PC, and killers just tend to ignore you for 60 seconds after the unhook. I like having the ability to get off the hook, and if the killer decides to chase me, I hop into a locker right in front of them and they just leave me alone and go after another target because they assume I have DS.
I'm rank 3 killer right now, and I just find I get more bloodpoints and have more fun in matches if I just pretend the people that get unhooked don't exist for 60 seconds. That way Borrowed Time and DS don't do anything, and most survivors are running both of them these days.
And since I play both roles pretty evenly, I want to be nice to the survivors and not tunnel the person who got unhooked. Survivor queues are ~10 minutes on PC as well, and I don't want to tunnel someone to force them back into playing queue simulator.
See I don't care either way, if I get slugged I tell my team how long I have if he picks me up well then I run more loops on the killer. It's just too strong, and is literally always beneficial to the survivor regardless of how the killer plays it slug or not, and if you have unbreakable you can potentially get 2 free health states but that's why I choose to eat the DS so I can just get it out of the way. Cause slugging isn't a counter to it.
There is one thing you said that is probably the reason it isn't nearly as useful to me. Despite much effort and practice I can't seem to get good enough at looping to make it a viable strategy for me. I've become really good at being stealthy, but if I need to loop a killer I may as well have an option pop up onscreen that asks if I'd like to just be transported to the nearest hook.
You don't see the problem with that? They just leave you in the locker to "counter" ds... That's worse than slugging even if you don't directly USE the perk you just got use out of it, and now if you okay like you DO have it they can't know so if the leave you alone to "counter" it well now they left you alone for no reason. That's why I say there is no counter. Every situation for DS is beneficial for the survivor.
An annoying perk is borrowed time or adrenaline (god adrenaline is annoying lol) adrenaline only works if it gets to end game BT only helps if they did it in your terror radius, DS benefits you no matter how the killer decides to tackle it, slug, eat the DS, or the in the situation you just mentioned and I honestly forgot about , abandoning someone cause they jumped in a locker.
That's the difference between annoying and zero counter play.
Sigh.
Lol that's funny but I understand and you're right if you can't loop then it honestly probably won't be as useful cause they can redown you quickly.
But if you can loop and he eats the DS unless you're really far away from any tiles you can extend a chase even longer. So to me it's great no matter how they handle it ALMOST every time. The only MINOR downside is if you do get tunneled well you probably aren't pipping because you can't do other objectives lol. But Idc about pips on survivor
They can call my bluff and pull me out of the locker. It add's more depth to the game. The killer can take the risk if they want. Or, maybe they were paying attention to previous chases with me and know all 4 perks I'm running and know that I can't possibly have DS.
They are inherently taking the risk of chasing me after I just got unhooked. That is the killer's mistake, knowing that DS exists. They know they are taking a risk by chasing me. They can eliminate that risk by chasing somebody else. There is no counter-play if you choose to chase the person who was unhooked. The only counter-play is changing targets. And I think that is good for the game. Nobody likes getting tunneled.
But again that's like saying abandoning a chase cause survivor got to a god loop or is by a god loop is counter play. That's not counter play, you aren't outsmarting or playing them it's literally the opposite it's giving up/cutting your losses.
It's like saying cause you lost 500 bucks gambling out of 1k you outplayed the casino
No you didn't you just decided not to to give them ALL your money but they still got half of it lol