Dark17Style7
Dark17Style7
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@TheycallmeLix said:
Nerf healing and medkits and our favorite perks, but yeah camping and tunneling is still in the game and hasn’t been done anything to it.. sometimes I wonder if you devs ever play your own game. Guess it will be a easy 4k for every Killer from now on since you nerf a lot of things we used to have.
It's true about tunnels, unfortunately there hasn't been a fix for this problem yet. I think some killers will take advantage of this on the other hand as for the medkit and healing I think it was necessary.
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@Coffe_e said:
I like that you guys are changing things now, don't get me wrong, but with this change in your mindset for mid-chapters, there are going to be some growing pains. Keep in mind that changing this much will have hits and misses, so please don't get discouraged by the push-back against these changes, because some of the reasons for it have merit. I want to go over each change and provide some structured feedback on what potential implications these changes could have. We don't necessarily have these to test yet, but numbers wise we can still see the impact they'll have on the game itself.
Firstly, I'd like to highlight every good change planned in this patch that needs no edits:
- The Blood web changes are perfect, thank you so much for those.
- The Visual terror radius is REALLY nice, im glad you guys finally ported that over from mobile.
- The Gas Heaven and Blood Lodge changes sound REALLY nice, those car walls were always frustrating to go around as both survivor and killer alike, and you understanding the problems they had with stealth killers is really good. We'll have to wait and see for these changes though, since we haven't been given any reference images for how the maps will look.
- Both the Circle of Healing and Medkit speed changes are REALLY nice to hear about. The altruistic healing speed wasn't really important to be nerfed for medkits, but the self-heals and addon changes are going to be great moving forward.
- Gearhead's perk change is going to make it a pretty fun aura perk to use, definitely a step up from before.
- Overzealous buff is nice, but you may want to keep an eye on it. It doesn't make up the time spent booning a dull or hex unless you do multiple full gens worth of progress, but it still is something that you should be wary of.
- The lightburn changes (excluding Nurse, and MAYBE Artist) are nice to see for Hag and Wraith. The Hag changes make having to get rid of traps not chest or starting-item dependent is great, and Wraith is currently weak enough that Lightburn just kicks him while he's down.
- While the addon changes are minor (excluding Hillbilly, who i'll talk about later), they aren't really that impactful. Glad to see Pig getting something though.
Now, I'd like to go over the changes that have POTENTIAL, but also either need a few tweaks, or need to go in a different direction.
- First up: Pain Resonance. I would either increase the regression if you guys are adamant on it only being usable 4 times, or have some other way to discourage tunneling with it, such as: "Hooking the same survivor twice does not trigger this perk's effects", or "You start with 8 tokens, but hooking the same survivor twice takes away more than one token" That way you get more regression if you play friendly/nice and also when you're going to need it, while you get penalized for tunneling by having the perk do less for the killer.
- Dead Hard: I feel this perk is going in a possible direction that would be good to see. It having an activation condition means that you don't have to worry about the perk in the first chase, and you KNOW when a survivor COULD have Dead Hard, while previously it was a coin toss. I would like you guys to consider pushing it further in the direction of his other perk "We're Gonna Live Forever", and changing it so it activates not only on safe unhooks, but also protection hits and flashlight/pallet saves. This would push it even more into the direction of a supportive perk to reward you for protecting and looking out for your team, rather than just the free chase extender it currently is. Theoretically you could take it even further and have the stack you gain be consumed on use even if you miss it, but it doesn't cost exhaustion. Though this would push it more as a full rework of the perk rather than a tweak.
- Call of Brine: I like that you're considering nerfing the regression speed that it gives to gens, but I would say that you over-nerfed it a little bit. 125% is pretty small in the grand scheme of things, and I would've probably kept it at possibly 135-150%, since the regression speed needs to be reapplied if touched by a survivor. After all, base generator regression speed is equivalent to 1/4th of a single survivor's repair speed.
- Finally, Overcharge: I like that Overcharge now has a larger regression bonus than Call of Brine, but I feel it shouldn't have gone so low since it has a large build up time. 150% Would be good, but I personally feel since it takes time, something higher like 175% would be reasonable. The regression penalty from the skillcheck being nerfed is completely reasonable, and I wouldn't change that.
Finally, the concerning things:
- 24 seconds base-kit for healing WOULD be fine if that was only for SELF healing. It's a problem when it applies to altruistic healing as well. Altruistic healing should ALWAYS be faster than self-healing, to encourage survivors to group up, and waste combined survivor time. If Survivor Self-healing was the only one to have it's base healing time to 24s, that would mean perks that apply mangled, and mangled itself would be a bigger hindrance on self-healing, which would encourage survivors to group up even more. Please consider making 24s heals base-kit ONLY on self-healing, as that would make this healing rework perfect. I would also make sure to adjust Self-care along with this change, as it will be massively hurt by these changes if not also adjusted.
- Nurse Lightburn: This was unclear in the blogpost, but this change either way is a buff to nurse, and a removal of her only counter-play. If the blogpost meant that you just cant lightburn Nurse WHILE she's blinking (While she cant do anything but travel), this wouldn't be that big of a change, but it would still remove an aspect of counter-play with flashbangs from her. If this change meant that you couldn't lightburn her AT ALL, this is a change that should be scrapped since flashlights are currently one of the only ways to actively hinder her power. She's the strongest killer in the game, and shouldn't have counterplay like that removed. Just keeping lightburn as a mechanic for her in specific would be good.
- Hillbilly Changes: Overheat as a mechanic doesn't really do much as a hindrance for Hillbilly yes, but I figure that should be why it gets removed instead of changed. In addition, you are nerfing the addons for Hillbilly that enable an ALTERNATIVE playstyle, which is very popular among Hillbilly players, instead of BUFFING his other addons to enable more build variety. Engravings open up a world of possibilities for Hillbilly players, and should not be nerfed as a result of statistics alone.
Edit: I forgot to put this in before posting this, but I REALLY think that large sweeping changes like these should be handled with care. The fact that you ARE changing things though is very refreshing, and im glad pushing for an era of changing metas with Dead by Daylight is going to pay off. If you keep this up, and listen to the community at the same time, this game will start going in a really good direction, and future changes likely won't be as controversial once you see where Higher-level players and the Community as a whole is coming from. I have high hopes for you guys, and there will be bumps in the road ahead, but keep it together and keep listening!
I totally agree but in my opinion they were not so bad, you changed taking out the hillbilly and nurse aside, those seem bad to me.
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@darkwalk93 said:
Seems to me the most of these killers are becoming way too overpowered to the point where I can't even hide in a box would literally hide in it as soon as they come around and they find me first time? So is it me or that just seems like I'm just losing every match I'm getting into or is there others?
I would like to help you, but there is not much detailed explanation about which Killers specifically and why they are a lot this could even be due to perks that show the killer's aura
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@Geiz said:
I think BHVR do not know what they are doing personally. The idea of nerfing perks and addons for usage is not a smart idea.
PR and DH are nerfed into the ground because they are the most used perks - instead of nerfing numbers or adjusting usage they make these perks too situational or dependent of too many IFs like RNG for PR or like.. 3 conditions to activate a single exhaustion perk when SB has guaranteed value with 0 conditions.
You know what will be next? Once DH and PH are out of most used perks, it will be SB and other killer perk next - which will get nerfed into the ground cause I am pretty sure both sides will start complaining about it. So this is what game balancing seems like?
The truth is it's not even only perks, it is also addons. They're NEVER addressing addons like Blight's Alc Ring but they're always ready to nerf a killer like Hillbilly which is the hardest killer to learn and has 0 reward for it (other than personal) when you could just learn Nurse which is a lot easier than Billy and get 4K easily.
How can you expect people to play other killers if you touch killers that are already bad only to buff useless addons or NERF them (when their playerbase is REALLY small), why don't you buff and rework killers like Freddy and Pig instead of buffing useless addons? You also promised a Twins rework, it has been about 2 years since I've read of it. Every chapter Twins get worse, not to mention you made them unplayable for months.
I won't say this game is dead but the DEVS really do not know what they are doing personally for balancing, the only thing good lately are QoL changes which are always welcome! I love them honestly but I wish this game focused more on reworking and buffing M1 killers and started addressing OP addons from already strong killers.
I really miss the time Freddy was a good killer, now I only play Huntress cause it is fun and playing M1 killers are miserable.
I totally agree I would like a big change that the killer the M1 could be seen and if hillbilly should not be nerfed if not buffed it makes me sad that a game that I loved almost never goes ahead in terms of the perks there will be something to see for me Part I'm convincing that they did the right thing for both sides.
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@philward1953 said:
Okay, so I've played within the "middle ground" in terms of the voice comm debate for a while now. But honestly, I am really starting to slip to the "YES we need them" side.
Firstly, it seems like with the new update, camping might become more and more easy and prominent (I reserve my own take because I have my reservations). Due to this, I think I've been pushed to one side (that was the lynchpin).
There is a sheer lack of communication or communication abilities between survivors. Yes we just got the UI, but that can only do so much in offering information to teammates. The keyword is "information". That, the UI offers. But, in situations where a team needs "coordination" the UI is lacking.
I see a lot of people come up with reasons to why DBD should not have voice comms, and I'm honestly finding them to be pretty null, as non are DBD-centric. A few of them include, but are not limited to:
- Language Barriers (This argument is difficult to support when nearly every other online game on the market has built in voice chat and also connects people across Europe. Also it matters when a game isn't balanced, designed or optimised for people using outside communication. In all other games this also becomes a non factor since both sides are always equal and not using said third party comms is most often a choice. Not so in asymmetrical games.)
- Opportunities for Toxicity (I do believe that if survivors in solo-q were given the tools necessary to assist their teammates, then there would be less toxicity. I really do. Yes, I know that someone might get a match with some dumb screeching kid, but my question is why shouldn't DBD specifically not have voice comms because of this factor? Personally, I feel like the idea of not introducing a voice chat because of "increased toxicity" is cope, as the game's community has already set a toxic image. How would DBD be any more toxic than other multiplayer team-based games? I know if a solo-que survivor could actually have the chance to coordinate with their teammates, then that would mean SOMETHING. They could do SOMETHING. Right now, solo-q survivors are regulated to watching their teammates make dumb decisions that are endlessly infuriating when you know what they could have done better.)
- Balancing (I can't believe people use this as a reason not to have voice comms. Obviously, killers would have to be buffed accordingly if voice comms were to be added. This is also just cope on the killer end of things.)
These are just some arguments at I find to get weaker and weaker every day every single survivor match I play (I probably play 40% killer 60% survivor at this point, used to be 10/90% like a year ago.)
I also see a lot of people say this would be too hard for BHVR, and I think that's pathetic. Yes, DBD is pumped full of spaghetti code, but BHVR has known this for AGES now and has been working to fix it more and more. Some talk about BHVR having to change the infrastructure of the game as if they had to remake it to create voice comms.
There are other ways that BHVR should allow solo-q survivors to gain info such as seeing the perk loadouts/items/addons in the lobby, but I ask again: How will this help players "coordinate"? It will help a little bit, with perks like Deliverance, the Dead Hard rework, Adrenaline, etc. But it will NEVER match the specificity of voice comms.
Just to close, obviously voice comms should not be mandated if they were added, and players should be able to turn them on and off on both sides.
I'm sorry for the rant, but I'm just sick of using the middle ground.
Voice comms would be a really tough add, and it'd take a lot of work, but personally this is one of my most wishlisted features right now. Do I think it'll happen? No, the devs and the community are too scared.
I'm out, gonna go watch my teammate get in a locker.
Edit: It's crazy to see so many survivor mains begging for BHVR to buff Solo-Q so they can have a better time balancing the game and so Solo-Q players can have a better experience actually playing the game, only to freak out when the one thing that would forever bridge the gap is suggested. A UI won't ever be precise enough. I love looking at the weird, contradictory demands of the community.
I disagree almost nobody would use this option it would include me it would be a waste of time also information is already in the game.
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@Nirgendwohin said:
they can't even add a common text chat for all platforms.
I agree with this this would be good for solo q.
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@Batusalen said:
Well, Legion would be one of the most benefited killers with the changes to healing. It would be wise to see how those changes affect him before doing any changes to him.
Personally, I don't think it benefits him too much, that's why if you play as a survivor against The Legion, you can't heal, you have to keep repairing the wounded, as I said it's very easy when it comes to hurting the survivors but occasionally and difficult to get him out take advantage of his power to be able to knock someone down.
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I agree not to nerf it, it is a killer that is not used at all and very weak compared to the other killers like Blight, Nurse Spirit, etc. I would really like to see more Hillbilly in the games.
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Dredge I think it's okay so I faced him and he doesn't seem so strong he only has the shadow he leaves behind him and as for the teleportation you just have to look back to know if he teleports in a locker when he chases you you can also close him lockers and pay attention to the sound in case a locker sounds
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@balanced said:
First of all, I am using a translator.
Behaviour we want a balanced game for both killers and survivors I think we could make a much more balanced and fun game for everyone.
Note: Everything I am going to say is focused on premade and high mmr games.
Currently I think the game is very unbalanced for killers and I explain why.
In high MMR you find many premade games and I think that playing in premade could be considered a perk that gives a lot of information, I give examples:
The killer follows a survivor, that survivor tells the rest of his friends by voice (discord, teamspeak) that the killer is following him.
The rest of the survivors can start making engines, bless totems, make bodyblock or give each other any important information.
I could list many more examples of all the information that a premade game can know against a killer, but I don't think it is necessary to say it.
The question is what can the killer do against this? with this kind of information that the survivors have?
So I think these games are not fair at all, don't you think it would be a good option that if you invite a friend via steam the game detects that it is premade and the killer gets some bonus?
Here are some ideas, although they could be any others:
Add one more engine if it is a premade game instead of 5 put 6.
Another idea I think more balanced could be to lengthen the time needed to make the engines.
It can be any idea, the point is to make a more fair and fun game for killers and survivors.
Now with the arrival of the boon totems things are even more complicated for the killer in high mmr, it was already extremely difficult to win games in high mmr without the boon totems, imagine now...
Conclusion, if the killer has to be aware of the engines, follow the survivors, infinite loops, break pallets, the body block, the flashlights and now also the boon totems I think it's already too much...
I think Dead By Daylight could be a fun game for both sides, the survivors part you are getting it, the killers part you are not.
It feels like you are balancing more on the survivor side and I think a lot of people think this.
The bad thing about giving this feeling is that many killers will stop playing Dead By Daylight or will play as
survivor, then there will be 4 killers left and finding games will be a real hell.
Note: Everything I am saying is based on premade and high mmr games.
Sorry for the English I used a translator.
I agree I like both sides survivor and killer but they are unbalanced sometimes I think of giving up.