Terion
Terion
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- Terion
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its not about the perks being used up instead of gen regression perks (which you also need, i used to have at least 2 gen regression perks and 2 for free choice but if this goes live i have to fill my slots with the same few perks over and over again. No fun at all.) the bigger issiue is what Bully Squads can do with it. No more consequences for trying to hardcore stop the killer from first hook, not anyone can down 4 people under 45 seconds and you either drop survivors or let them wiggle free, there is not enough time to to both hit disturbing body blockers 3 times so you can hook finally, also you have travel time, thats all a few seconds in which they can totally abuse you. I always hard slugg 4k when bully squads think they need to play like that, i dont even let them bleed out, except for the first one i carried because i dont want them to wiggle free by picking em up again.
If you think that is a fun future for killers than you are simply wrong. And its justified to freak out.
Your right about WHY they do it though, just because of that god awful mory system rework and the new endgame scenario they want to implement. So a bad change to justify another bad change. Looking forward to have SoloQ ruined aswell for me because tunneling/camping will increase and there will be no more 60/70 % of the time nurse games but 90. Also the endgame scenario is just a pure sweatfest tournament, i dont see anything positive coming out of this update if it makes it to live.
They shouldve just made yellow mori basekit and remove the mori offerings if moris are that big of an issiue.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3204804#Comment_3204804
The entire reason for the change is to prevent people instantly slugging everyone and winning via Finishing Mori. You're not supposed to be able to down everyone in 45 seconds
yes and because i cant bully, squads will have an Ez game with me.
And yes, and why is it prevented in the first place? without the new mori system there would be no need for basekit UB at all..
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@Seraphor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3205349#Comment_3205349
How about Deliverance? How boring is it for survivors to be left on the hook for a full 60 seconds and then go to stage 2 because their team mates won't rescue them?
deliverance actually would be nerfed with basic UB
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@Seraphor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3204804#Comment_3204804
But you can tunnel two survivors out then slug the other two survivors in 45s. You can end the game with a 4K in 6 hooks, 2 if you camp.
This is the 'adapting' killers will carry out. Have fun!
So you tell me i have to tunnel to win? yes?
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@drakolyr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3203955#Comment_3203955
I take unbreakable, i dont want to be slugged in every game all the time. The new mori mechanic was announced a while back.
yeah but they didnt say they would go towards inbalance again and inflict a mechanic that hurts both sides, they just said the moris will be gone.
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/348248/bhvr-is-going-a-little-too-far
Ub base kit is fine because of the fact that if all four are slugged or hooked/dead at once you auto win the game now with the finisher Mori, so how troll squads would take you to RPD and make you bleed them out in the Library can never happen again because they would auto die as soon as the last person standing gets slugged and I mean you get 45 secs to decide whether a full slug is worth it or you can just hook the survivor then slug if they're nearby , either way if they're all downed they die there's no more crawling to a dead hook zone while slugged and wiggling out everytime
I cant down 4 survivors withing 45 seconds, if youre telling me adapt then you basicly say "get a pro at this game so you have a chance" and if that is the case i rather dont play at all. But the squads with their voice chat for sure can screw a killer with ease. Its not a balanced skill requirement.
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thats why we need to get that stoopid idea out asap. i will certainly test how it is in the PTB as killer but i know alredy i will have a bad time. And i will play the exact bully build anyone is scared of just to understand how easy it is or if there is any counter. Ive been counting how much i slugg people, rn not even close to 45 seconds but bully squads dont have the tools yet.
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@ShinobuSK said:
There will be PTB section for feedback.
Also if you create discussion about PTB things, mods will move it to the feedback anyway
i see, thank you ^^
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@drakolyr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3203298#Comment_3203298
They just announced it. They still need to look at it.
Who said if the changes is coming that the killers who rely on that get changes aswell to compensate?
Slugging is such a boring thing for the receiving end and i think its too old that you cant do anything at all.
well im not going to take anything infinite unbreakable at all. I dont want to have sweaty games all the time when i play killer, it was fine how it is now and then they gonna do something like that completely uncalled for. Also the changes are not even about slugging precisely but because of the new mory mechanic which also noone asked for x-x
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@crogers271 said:
Survivors have to make strategic decisions without communication within a matter of seconds. The logic of this post is that 22 seconds is not enough time for killers to come up with a plan on what to do.
Also: the game shouldn't be balanced around 3/4 SWF unless there is evidence that is the majority of the player base.
handing basekit unbreakable in a game where bully squads exist IS going to increase 4 man swf partys preying on killers. As a resort you will see more tunneling and camping.
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its going to even increase with infinite unbreakable basekit.
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Thrilling tremors is my personal Meta for any killer basicly because it does give info and blocks gens at the same time.
That being said i have still to do a lot of experimenting to find something unique but what i like to do is actually to use Gideon meat plant offering on the dredge, Legion and Freddy (because of dream pallets). I always take the locker aura reading perk from the dredge with me in Gideon. It makes the map that most survivors feel extremely confident with into a deathtrap basicly XD Dredge can jump out of every corner and legion will get that 5 stacks with ease because all is so closed up. And with the probably pallet heavyest maps survivors loose record of which pallets are dream pallets and which dont.
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@drakolyr said:
First of all, its on the PTB, it doesnt come out on the next patch anyway.
And people say survivors are drama queens...
Wait, i just say what nearly every killer said after their buff update and when solo q is even more hell.
Just adapt, its fine. You dont have
dead hardmori anymore. You dont need to rely on that.the issiue aint the mori. The issiue is unbreakable basekit infinitly. And im only ready to adapt to a certain point, if this game wants only top tier skilled killers im happy to be no part of it. I play for fun, i dont want to sweat and before you put me in a certain category, i never camp, i dont tunnel on purpose and i only go for 4k sluggs when i have a certain challenge, im fine with loosing the abillity to 4k slugg while i get its cheap. But im not fine to being prey for bully squads just because i dont want to invest hours and hours in the game to finally have a chance. I want to have fun while playing, not to play while trying to get to have fun.
Dead hard was a diffrent thing aswell, it was hated towards all over the place and both sides didnt like the way it was, actually there is no sides either. I play both killer and soloQ and so do many people. So if the types of killers that just play for fun and dont want to sweat too hard, who play soloQ sometimes too should be scared away this is the way to do. This and not dealing with hackers. As you said its on the PTB but the general direction of the update is just more sweat for both sides, you make slugging harder tunneling and camping will increase.
So yeah, if this game is meant to be a sweatfest tournament rather than a fun party game i guess ive wasted my money.
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oh i didnt forgot. It just adds more reason to maybe drop this game. I guess im not in an MMR situation where i face hackers that much yet but i do want to see changes about that still. Especcially for the streamers. The concernes about that will just get loud again after all the fuss we have right now is settled.
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Im going to use your topics and answer according to them, from a killers point of view.
1: Fun - Laying on the ground is boring. i agree, but whats also boring is having 2 or 3 people trying to block your first hook so you dont get to hook anyone, in those situation hard slugging is a viable and legit punishment. To me it happens more often than being slugged for 4 minutes straight and i play SoloQ aswell.
2: Theme - A piece of advice I received from a Killer main on how to deal with slugging is do something else that's not DBD. Thats a dumb advice, if you get slugged hardcore make sure to at least max out points by recovering, the only reasonable thing to do. And after that if you want to speed things up try crawl towards killer or dont hide if you want it to end. When i go for endgame 4k slug which i only do if i have a certain challenge, it happens super often survivors are hiding somewhere i cant find them. Either they dont like getting slugged which again i can fully understand. But then im surprised they hide in corners and such when slugged. Basekit UB for the last man standing would be a great thing for this, permanent unbreakable is just too much for abuse for bully squads.
3: Strategy - Right now a survivor needs to spend roughly 30 second on the ground and then get tapped by a teammate to be up. Under the proposed changes the survivor needs to spend 45 seconds with no tap. In either situation a teammate can come early to speed up the process + be there to heal. <-- but why would they if they know they're going to pick themselves up anyway? This just destroys the meaning of teamplay which is right now the only way to win. You have 4 v 1 and make it so 4 players dont depend on each other in those situations. SWF can just play and coordinate around it and soloQ will get even more "i try to survive, the other 3 mates are there for... yah, theyre there." SoloQ alredy is hard because people play way too selfish or way too altruistic without even able to coordinate properly. This will just make all of that even worse.
4: Testing - Maybe the proposed numbers will unbalance the game. We'll see, the numbers can always be changed. Concerns about how many seconds it should be should not override discussion about the overall concept. <--- have no single argument against that. My main concern is not the numbers, they will be changed. But the general direction this update will push the game towards, more sweaty, more rushed, faster, more selfish playes, etc. Its just getting more tournament now noone can possibly want that. Thats why its bad for both sides.
(also i forgot to add: Tunneling and camping is a bigger issiue for most survivors i thought, now completely unrelated how i personally think about tunneling but making slugging harder will just push people towards more camping and tunneling, even more as it is rn.)
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@SpaghettiVase said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3202670#Comment_3202670
Honestly may do the same. What got me into this game was my friends wanting to play swf and even though this update will reward swfs super hard im just not interested. I play both roles and i know how absolutely nerve wracking it is as killer to get at least two people on coms playing as strategically obnoxious as possible, doesn’t matter how. Seeing this update info by itself is crushing because I was just starting to enjoy killer again but i can see it becoming a miserable experience with this change that I dont think i can handle anymore.
yeah and my only alternative to killer is soloQ x) which even after the 6.0.1 update still does feel sometimes more chill than killer but just because im not as invested in winning as survivor or because im used to get killed in the matches so it doesnt bother me. And my go-to survivor perks werent meta so the whole DH,DS and stuff didnt affect me either. But if killers get more and more frustrated oh boi. SoloQ is going to suffer even more.
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Killer main here and its not even about the satisfaction having all 4 downed (which really is exciting) but more so dealing with bully squads. Like there has been people denieying my first hook stage which is one of the most viable. Im not a pro at the loops at all, im ok with killer, have found some unique strats even which sometimes work surprisingly well and sometimes not at all. But overall im a casual mind set player, its why i stay away from nurse. I know she can be satisfying and super strong, but her blinks are just too time consuming for me to get into aswell as oni rush. I feel like this just exposes killers like me to bully squads because now the only viable strat against that is well.. slugging. And there is no way you can pressure 3 or all 4 people within 45 seconds, i cant.
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@SpaghettiVase said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3202659#Comment_3202659
I'm sorry but I just got out of the overwatch clown fiesta and every time i see these sweeping game-play changes in any game I groan because I know the devs won't actually listen to feedback aside from basic number tweaking. I genuinely don't wanna bother playing the game anymore.
Honestly if it goes live with any form of unbreakable basekit that is NOT endgame (all survivors hooked, 1 left, cause thats where the changes direct anyway right?) i will just wait for bots to finally come so i can play chill A.I sessions. Sure it will get boring but better have some ai dbd experiences now and then instead of sweatfest tournaments every online session. Youre not forced to play every day after all. So yeah ive alredy got an emergency plan for this x)
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@SpaghettiVase said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3202397#Comment_3202397
I mean considering this update was set for around halloween it isn't that early. Probably too late for them to cut their losses and consider this a bad idea. They need to go back to square one with this crap.
at least let us have some hope left ^^''
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@BrightWolf said:
Given how broken Unbreakable is when paired with other meta perks, I'd say the freak out is kind of warranted. Even more so with the fact that they're removing the ability to green or ebony mori survivors.
To me, these changes just prove that the devs don't play their game and if they do it's certainly NOT at high MMR or as killer.
i mean i also would like to know where they got that "moris used out of spite against certain survivors" from. it sounds like personal stuff. I at least havent heard any complaints about mori and ive been using them alot after the 6th anniversary stream, you'd expect much toxicy towards me if it was took personal but none, noone. Not because of Moris at least.
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@Rovend said:
People need to properly test it and come to their own conclusions.
If you think the unbreakable basekit was not needed, you surely have not been bled out constantly just for griefing, or being slugged to ensure that 4k, which are awful situations that MUST BE ADRESSED.
Said that, i cant speak about the balance of this change until i properly test it in ptb, because many things can appear broken on paper.
There gotta be better ways to counter Slugging situations instead of giving survivors infinite Unbreakable basekit. As a killer im good, im average, i dont do well at loops but i make that lack up with unexpected gameplay or 3 gen tactic if i play with a weaker killer. Im not even someone who always sluggs for 4k, i dont tunnel right off the bat. And i NEVER camp because it bores me to stand around. But i get punished like hell if this goes live because all my abillitys to ensure pressure if i have overconfident squads trying to deny my first hook. You risk getting a 4 man down slug that way, with unbreakable basekit that play has no risk at all. Its gonna happen more and im not going to take it, ill rather play with the bots then when they finally find their way into DBD.
And dont get me started on SoloQ i will get more frustrated killers, i will not be able to make use out of Unbreakable Basekit because killer knows once he realizes its not an SWF he can hook without concern, leaving scenarios where you could crawl to a teammate and get picked up again, punishing a killer for unneccessary slugging, like 0. It will just get more sweaty for anyone but coordinated SWF.
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Its not only bad for killers but for survivors too. You gonna get more frustrated killers, meaning more nurse, more basement bubba, you gonna not beable to make that epic escape in times you could (being over the hatch for few seconds, killer downs you) Unbreakable basekit is a joke to SoloQ. Once the killer realizes its not an SWF, they dont have to worry about anything, they just pick up and hook. Before the 6.0.1 update i have get to escape through gate a couple of times, maybe like a 40/50 percentage rate of the games i played, maybe a tad bit more. After it it gone less, really WAY less. Cause im bad at loops and get cought relatively fast (between 30 seconds and a little over a minute, depends on the killer whos chasing me), because of teammates giving up, because of teammates not doing gens etc. But in a compensation i got to enjoy killer more, having my anyways favored role more relaxed. And now its going to be harder for me on both sides if this update comes live the way they mentioned it. I will have even less escapes and even less fun on killer overall. 😡
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As i remember the only thing in the 6.0.1 called something like the "doom" of dbd was the endurance stacking, which wasnt even intended, it was a side effect ant the perk got deep wound so it doesnt stack. Majority of players was happy and with the wesker DLC playerbase increased. Now i see people complaining left and right, majority is complaining. And this isnt a survivor or killer thing, we all are going to suffer, it will only make the game more sweaty and tournament. Noone can want that. At least i dont.
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Because the MMR system doesnt work properly, either you have ludacris waiting times to get the exactly same people of your skill level or you have games really fast and que up against anyone.
That being said escapes are not guaranteed anyway, killer is the "unstoppable force" to overcome. If you got so far to actually getting the exit games powered you and your team alredy did an extremely good job. You will most likely even probably make more bloodpoints at the end of the match than anyone and still get sacrificed.
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Tbh i think it was too big for killers aswell. They have to remove some pallets otherwise it beats Gideon but i think its fine. And it definitly looks better