LeFennecFox
LeFennecFox
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@Laluzi said:
I took notes on all my 2v8 matches today, and I'm not liking the results.
Playing survivor only (queue times are too brutal for me to try killer), either medic or guide.
Game 1: Blight + Billy. Yamaoka. 8K, 5 gens left. Miserable game. Killers raced around the map and racked constant downs, were always zooming over to cages to harass them and instadown the healer as well as the uncaged person. Killers slugged last 3 survivors for the 8k.
Game 2: Trapper + Deathslinger. Dead Dawg. 2k. Both Trapper and Deathslinger appeared to be skilled with their killers, with good trap placement and accurate/well-timed shots, but it wasn't a combo that had very much map pressure. First death was at one gen left and the other was a gate catch.
Game 3: Spirit + Deathslinger. Campbell's Chapel. 0k. Neither killer player seemed very good at their killer, and they spent a lot of time teaming up together, which allowed gens to fly across the map.
Game 4: Wraith + Deathslinger. Autohaven. 1k. The Wraith player seemed very new and didn't use lunge attacks, so the Deathslinger carried most of the weight that match. Not an especially fair match. Saw a Maria in the lobby and had to pick James so I could follow her around.
Game 5: Trapper + Huntress. Family Residence. 4k. Very balanced match. Killers spent a lot of the early game tag-teaming, which may not have worked out very well for them.
Game 6: Trapper + Huntress. 5k. Autohaven. Was a wild game, everyone started dying at around 2 gens left and 3 survivors powered through the last gens and managed to sneak gates open in the midst of some long chases. Killers would've gotten a 7k if they slugged instead of caged at the end.
Game 7: Wraith + Blight. 8K, 1 gen left. Asylum. Blight was very aggressive about returning to hooks to tunnel, but wasn't nearly as good at it as Billy is. Slugged last 3 to avoid hatch, but this went on for about 3 minutes with Unbreakables and stealthing so they eventually gave up and caged someone, then camped hatches. Major medic abuse this game where two injured medics would tag-team mid-chase and simultaneously activate their abilities to fully heal both of them.
Game 8: Blight + Spirit. 2K. Autohaven. Killers spread hooks and didn't get their first kill until lategame, but did have a lot of 2-hooked survivors for most of the game, so gen speeds were out of control. Constant positive modifiers while solo repairing gens.
Game 9: Huntress + Wraith. 5k. Yamaoka. Got their first kill at 2 gens remaining, which is the same issue – these players would have done better if they'd played meaner. I had a positive repair speed modifier for most of the match.
Game 10: Wraith + Billy: 7k, 1 hatch escape, 4 gens done. Coldwind. Another very unenjoyable match. Less drastic slugging this time, but Billy kept focusing cages and going for one-two punches on the unhooker and the uncaged player, so people went out pretty fast.
Game 11: Wraith + Trapper. 1k. Autohaven. Gens flew; the Trapper spent the first 4 gens setting up traps and the Wraith didn't even get a down until 3 gens done. A lot of Scouts restoring pallets this game, which neither killer dealt well with.
Game 12: Spirit + Huntress. 0k. Yamaoka. The Spirit didn't know what they were doing and got maybe 5 hits all game, so the Huntress was basically forced to solo. Was the first game where I consistently had negative repair speed modifiers.
Game 13: Spirit + Blight. 5k. Dead Dawg. Spread hooks near-perfectly (first death occurred at 15th hook, 1 gen remaining – 6 players 2-hooked and 2 players 1-hooked), but performed better than previous teams due to strong killers with high map presence.
Game 14: Huntress + Trapper. 3k. Mother's Dwelling. The killers weren't very experienced and got totally outmatched – only 7 hook states were achieved before gens got done, and most the ones that followed were from survivors taunting at the gates. The lobby progressively turned into more and more Scoops Ahoy Steves as time went on, which is extremely important, because Steve Squad.
Game 15: Nurse + Trapper. 2k. Campbell's Chapel. The Nurse was quite good– match ended in 17 hook states – but the killers just didn't play mean enough. More medic abuse – last gen was done in Nurse's face with 3 people taking hits, and then 2 medics erased the health states. Offered Trapper a flashlight and a kill at the exit gate but he said no.
Game 16: Deathslinger + Trapper. 2k. Autohaven. Deathslinger was doing a neat Undetectable playstyle with the Shadow role, but this combo just doesn't have enough power to handle the gen speed. Only 8 hook states before gens were done.
Game 17: Spirit + Blight. 0k. Thompson House. Maybe 14ish hooks by endgame, but spread out too evenly, and survivors used their powers too effectively. Blight didn't seem too good at hitting his rushes.
Out of 17 games, 3 were a stomp in the killers' favor, 3 were close games, and 11 were stomps in survivor favor. So far, this has been very survivor sided, but it's worse than just that.
More than anything, 2v8 has been power-crept. And that's antithetical to what made 2v8 fun. While Trapper + Wraith was known to be pretty bad last time, and Huntress was queen, everything was... roughly in the same ballpark. Stacked Guides and SWFs using Escapist in a group were pretty rough, but there wasn't a lot of need for sweating in either direction. People enjoyed the fast, chaotic, and casual games.
Now Medic and Guide have been buffed to enormous efficiency, with rising survivor gen speeds baked in. Which makes the game passively very survivor-sided. But there's two ways to counter that - tunneling/slugging, and meta killers. When killers use either one of these strats, they can tie with survivors and their busted basekit - if they use both, it's a miserable stomp and there's very little survivors can do.
But also, when you look at more meta killers becoming available, the less powerful killer picks are falling off in capability. Billy was previously implemented, but in a heavily nerfed state, and while Nurse is as meta as they come, she's limited by the number of players who are capable of playing her through both the skill floor and the frustration/poor sensory experience. Billy, Blight, and Spirit are all more accessible… and in the current state of 2v8, Trapper, Deathslinger, and even to a lesser extent Wraith are much less playable, because the game just keeps getting harder and faster.
Tl;dr, killers are forced to play meta and they're forced to play mean.
So:
-Guide did not need buffs, full stop.
-Medic buffs are welcomed, but the group 50% flat heal is abusable in pairs and dangerously efficient in a group. This should either be tweaked or take longer to charge, because the only times I didn't always have it when I needed it was when the game was snowballing out of control in the killer's favor.
-The gen speed modifiers benefit survivors even in games they're winning. Gen speed reduction from competed gens is minimal and survivors have 3x the modifier potential. 7 or 8 survivors can still have a positive repair speed modifier on the last gen when this is clearly a survivor-favored gamestate.
-The gen speed modifiers punish killers for spreading hooks. Survivors should not get speed boosts from cage states, it should be strictly from dead survivors. Or better yet, just get rid of the gen speed modifiers entirely. This isn't just rewarding killers for tunneling and slugging, it is actively hurting the ones who don't play in ways survivors traditionally despise. If you don't tunnel, not only do you have more survivors on gens, but they individually get faster repair speeds AND they unlock extra bonus perks that make them even more powerful.
-As such, in every game I played where killers won, killers were tunneling and using at least one high mobility killer. If killers did not make an attempt to tunnel people out early, they usually lost and occasionally drew.
-Even discounting the significant survivor repair boosts, gen speeds per gen completed don't slow down the game in a linear fashion. If 2 gens are done and 3 are being worked on, it's not 10%, 15%, and 20% delay in sequence for those next 3 gens; most of those three gens will be done at a 10% delay, with only the last bits of those gens getting a further speed penalty.
-Billy is probably overpowered, though I will admit 2 games is not a big enough sample size to judge. He's the king of map mobility in outdoor maps, which all of these maps are, and more importantly he's the only killer in this mode who ignores health states. Trapper is still underpowered, and with matches going faster than ever, he can't cope with his early game picking up and setting traps. But Deathslinger is even worse and desperately needs buffs.
Slugging is not viable in the mode due to basekit unbreak & the fact you can hop in lockers to force a hook
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@TonTon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3840238#Comment_3840238
honestly this itll give killers more time at the start to midgame and starts getting fast after a death but the numbers would have to be buffed cause losing a teammate is a major dent in efficiency maybe like 6% boost per death
I can live with that considering atm if you aren't trying to kill someone you end up with games where you have 12 hooks (30% speed buff) x 6-8 survs on top of guide. The comeback mechanic is practically placebo since more survs alive = more gen time even if they only end up getting 10-15% per surv after gen debuff.
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Tunneling is the solution as always. You can spread out hooks and give survs big gen bonuses or straight up remove a player from doing gens while giving them less bonus speed.
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It can be fun, but waiting 15+ mins in queue just for people to be running guide and instapopping gens is miserable.
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@AquaticCitizen said:
Because of the whole "More Hooks = More Gen Speed", a large majority of the matches I've had so far as survivor involve killers never worrying about hooking and instead leaving survivors on the ground to bleed out.
This is absolutely ridiculous. Please for the love of all things hotfix this specific thing out of the game. It leads to the most boring matches imaginable as survivor. You can keep the "More Gens Done = Less Gen Speed", I don't care. Please for the love of all things remove the incentive to slug.
Slugging is quite literally not viable due to the basekit ub power you have & also just jump in a locker and they're forced to hook you lol
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@Sunflower_Mage said:
Activates Reassurance on your first hookstate
Activates Reassurance on your second hookstate
Frees you from hook with Shoulder The Burden
Activates Reassurance on your second second-stage hookstate
Frees you from hookYou're not including the part where me the killer gets them 95% bleedout then hooks 2nd 😀
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Doubt duoing makes it shorter, but 15-20+ mins is the norm. If you play later at night it can get up to 30 mins.
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Honestly I think the better solution is 2v4 and make killers basekit power then buff survs with more hookstates or stronger kits. This would make queue times in general a lot better I'm not sure if people would enjoy the novelty as much without massive maps and 8 survs though.
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Survivor comeback mechanic is very goofy it should be based on deaths instead of hook states and guide basically nullifies killer gen debuff
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If you're even remotely competent at the game you're already at the cap used for matchmaking. 50/50 you can go against newer players or pros
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Franklins still not problematic as survivors bringing styptics, syringes, bnps, and toolboxes that cost 0 perk slot.
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It will either get nerfed some or stay a top perk for 6 months until they randomly kill it
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I don't think basekit UB is the solution just letting people die sooner on the ground. If you're on the ground for over a minute & a half that's more than enough to time to have tunneled them 2 times over so just let the survivor die.
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You have to be very careful with killer instinct there is a reason it's only ever tied to killer powers making it relatively predictable like hiding in lockers vs legion etc.
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You're not being tunneled if DS/OTR deactivate very simple
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It's very simple deathslinger's gun shoots very fast with little windup. Huntress has to wind a hatchet up while slowing down a considerable amount to actually make her hatchet a speed that's hard to dodge. It being bigger also makes it harder to fit them between small gaps.
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They should make malthinkers skull/haddies calendar basekit ATP because I don't he's a killer without using these addons
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It's nice they're actually going back and doing stuff to help out killers they released in terrible states. Would be nice if bugs that happen rather consistently and ruin chases were fixed.
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DBD killrates 100% correlate to how strong that killer is thank you for this information
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Considering how DBD players will stalk your profile and add you to send harassment/death threats on every platform I don't think you should be punished for hiding your name.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3747581#Comment_3747581
If there's one thing we know for a fact it's that taking two perk slots has no bearing on whether a combo is balanced or not.
Otherwise you're directly saying that BU+FtP and FB+BP were also fine, since they also take up two perk slots and the killer 100% controls downs and pickups.
Not even remotely the same thing. BU, FTP, FB, and BGP are all individually strong or decent perks by themselves. Weave Attunement & Franklins are two meh perks with only franklins really worth running individually.
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Yes making 3 random gens regress or giving a "skill" check every 40s if someone is on is obviously too strong!
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@th3 said:
I'm annoyed with blight players abusing his stun bug atm. It's gotten very pervasive every game with a blight just abusing tf out of it.
I reported day 0 of ptb because it happened within 10s of testing out the supposed fix for him looking down after pallet break. It's clear they wanted to shove out the anniversary with new cosmetics over doing bug fixes.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3743110#Comment_3743110
I think double speed was fine, the rest not. Maybe somewhere in between current and old double speed even...
They should just do old crow (6%) basekit and nerf/rework his speed addons that make him inconsistent to verse. Also opens up room to add speed reduction to strong addons w/o them making him unplayable.
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BGP is still amazing for saving players and now you're not overly punished for using it outside of saves. Pallet saves are completely viable and strong without a 200% speed boost for 5s.
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Probably PTSD from blight when he had stuff like c33, alch ring, adren vial, blighted tag, and old double speed. Once killers get a reputation for being op/annoying to vs it never goes away no matter how many changes are made.
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@appleas said:
With the amount of complaining about WA+ Franklins, I'm inclined to believe a lot of people are crutching on items like a 5th perk and some of them are willing to risk a down just to pick up their item to stop the charges from depleting.
There is a reason you consistently see insta heals, styptics, and bnp commodious in lobbies they are so cheap now you can bring in game winning items every match. Same issue for some killers too where they bring overtuned addons.
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I'll take a gg after bad match over no one typing anything. The game feels like you're playing vs ai most of the time with how little people interact and when they do it's rarely positive.
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@Xernoton said:
No. Blight is still a lot stronger. Hillbilly is definitely a very powerful killer and he has an addon (LoPro Chains), that now pushes him too far but Blight is still better. The main difference between Blight and Hillbilly is, that a Blight can always readjust. Billy on the other hand cannot. He misses you and you are safe for a while. Billy is also more predicatable then Blight and needs more set up for his power work in chase.
I see that the "showcase" that Hens did a while ago was brought up in this thread and I find it funny, that the we take this video without even the least bit of salt.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-zw3TipZqU
Not only does the Hillbilly have a stronger loadout, the survivors also play pretty terrible. These are comp players and yet, they don't know that the syn car is incredibly unsafe against the new Hillbilly and try to loop that of all tiles on the map? Pre drop the pallet and leave like you'd do with any other loop (except maybe shack). Or how about the Nea on Thompson House, that walks in a dead zone, so the killer has an easier time back revving her instead of using her Sprint Burst to get away. Survivors in public lobbies play a lot better than that. This looks like paid actors.
If this is the best they can do, then that's embarrassing.
It's not about having ten hour chases it's about dying in the right spots against killers like billy/nurse since you have no guaranteed long chase. Either way billy is just a better killer now that double iri cheese is gone. Blood lodge is a strong map for surv with tons of strong pallets so for billy to 4k1/2 consistently when blight would struggle says a lot.
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Yea as soon as I saw old freely earned masks for auric cells I was disappointed. In reality it's more like $5 if you didn't have auric cells to sit which is absurd for a simple mask.
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One of the largest tournaments for dbd has a free ladder service where you can 1v1 for ranking that has been blowing up. It's very easy to get practice in vs good players so that's probably a factor in you seeing more competent survivors. You need to play surv & killer in these, but if you want to get better that is the place.
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Yea it's BHVR's fault they won't approve/push through the update how dare they release the update on 3 other platforms instead of delaying it for no reason
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For how much people complain about the combo I couldn't find one person using it when I ran object
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Spirit being over billy is criminal & you could argue that he's better than blight especially with double iri nerf
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I just report people that do this it's 100% bannable to do nothing and hide for extended amounts of time as peanits has said before.
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If you're getting destroyed by JohnBHVR21602 with thousands of hours in a swf that's on you
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I reported the bug on PTB like day 0 because it happened by accident when testing the "bug fix" they released for him. They probably fixed it already or have been working on it to ship for the next hotfix. Killswitch is just the most useless feature they've worked on.
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Corrupt Ruin Undying PR for spirit/nurse/billy/blight
Corrupt PR Eruption Pop/Brutal/Bam for most others
You could throw Grim/DMS on as well especially as artist
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@Ewik42 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3737495#Comment_3737495
Look If I had to put this perk in a BAD-GOOD-GREAT scale I would put BT in between bad and good to be honest and I don't believe its a great perk. Great perks in my opinion are perks that can give you good/great benefits on their own. Good perks are perks that give you little/good benefit when paired with other perks or on their own. Bad perks are the ones that give you little/no benefit on their own or with the assist of other perks or on their own. The only thing that can nerf a Great perk is make it situational and I believe that if this is added it will make it a great perk that's very situational.
Giving your teammate 20s of basekit bt/haste without worrying if they have OTR is very strong. 10s of basekit bt in a deadzone means killer can just wait it out. BT gets people more distance & more protection very good for endgame saves and in general.
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BT is still a great perk just overshadowed by others
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It's probably the best gen kick perk left in the game sadly very good on snowball killers like oni
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Yea I don't think deli needs any buffs
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They saw overinflated killrate from the new map forced on us and now an average killer is getting nerfed
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3736002#Comment_3736002
Well they just nerfed ds and I think tunneling increased instantly after that happened 5s was fine only bit too much for m1 killers. 4s would be fine if it disables killer power for short around time so then ds would actually punish S-tier killers. They should definetely give ds 80s timer like otr too that 60s goes too fast and I have to let killer down me often.
If you run the DS timer out you didn't need it or you were doing nothing for 60s.
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Dying light should be buffed/changed instead of nerfing those perks
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@Brightened said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3735056#Comment_3735056
With the way that the game is going, where loops are being shortened and spread out, and killers are getting more abilities instead of one major ability, chases don't last very long for the majority of players.
Just now I had a player end themselves when they got hit with lethal. Immediately puts the other 3 at a major disadvantage.
Killer fault survivor doesn't hide next to a pallet at start of match you're right
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It's not THAT bad, but if you get bad maze tiles it's over not uncommon for it to be 4 lane + LT with 3-4 decent fillers. The killer can just hook towards shack which likes to spawn a lot of borgo junk with no pallets and just proxy the static portal exits. I think that broken pallet which always spawns stops the filler next to shack spawning most of the time. There is 0 reason to ever chase people downstairs.
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This is probably the first exhaustion perk to actually be worth running over generic slowdown and people are upset. You either need to use your exhaustion early or walk more mid chase which you should be doing anyways.
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Please never bring back 100%! People talk about killer perks being free then you had IW to remove an important part of tracking for killers for getting hit. The exhausted part is just dumb they could remove it and keep it 75% or maybe nerf it to like 60%.
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If killers were the same speed of survivors they would never catch you since survivors can hug loops tighter. You would have to giga buff anti loop powers because m1 killers wouldn't be playable.