Anti051
Anti051
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OTR needs to remove player collision while active and deactivate when fully healed by any means. No more nonsense, please.
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@Elan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/451880/im-invincible
Endurance can be obtain in specific ways.
Items - medkit add on (easily counterable)
Perks - if I kick off antitunnel perks that deactivate if you do anything, then… dead hard, made for this, soul guard, we gonna live forever…
What is the problem?
Let's say you down someone under a pallet (Happens a lot if you win the micro game on a tile with an M1 killer), you can't pick the survivor up because you hear other survivors nearby waiting for a pallet or blind save, so you chase them around instead of eating the save. You manage to hit the nearby survivor once, but they pickup the first survivor you'd downed under the pallet, WGLF and MFT grant both survivors invincibility.
So as the killer you're in a lose-lose situation where you're screwed out of your effort via pallet/blind save or endurance perks with decent potential to repeat the exact same scenario at the next tile.
And all because people don't like sitting out on the ground vs sitting out on a hook to activate even more endurance perks that they use mostly to body-block the killer rather than have a barrier against getting caught again immediately off-hook.
That's not fair, bud.
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If gens can be done in 4 minutes, the killer has to be able to do something to stop it. Chaining knockdowns for pressure and gradually hooking in between knocks is one of the only strategies that actually works anymore for the weaker killers and that's only if things like wglf aren't in play to completely counter the strat and turn the killer into a meme.
You can't have alterations made that render weaker killers useless just because you're too stubborn to alter your build.
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"Tunneling" became prominent in response to gen completion speeds.
Gens can be done within 4 minutes from the start of a match, and under such a strict time-crunch it doesn't make sense to get angry at killer players for trying to do something real enough to stop survivors from escaping (especially M1 killers).
You can't treat every killer character like they have the same power level of the nurse, blight or other S-tiers. All things considered from completion speed, 2nd chances, exhaustion perks and how much interconnecting safety there is, it's pretty insane to expect M1 killers to hook all survivors to death in an equitable rotation before all gens are done.
It's even more insane to basically demand plot armor and to force every character on the killer roster into a scenario that very few of them possess the mechanical ability to actually manage past the intermediate skill level. And all just because it doesn't feel like a shoulder rub when you get caught again in a killer's desperate attempt to stop your escape? You have to acknowledge the entire picture, not just your POV as a survivor.
I mean criminy! It's you and 3 other people against one dude, how can you possibly believe that you're in the right trying to act like the way you feel about your personal outcome matters more than what's fair in an asymmetrical PvP situation like DbD?
If you want to address how people feel about getting caught again, you'll also have to address the open door on ludicrous completion speed. It can't be the case that survivor keeps receiving protection boost after protection boost over and over and over again until there's no contest in the gameplay.
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In the least, there does need to be a recourse on blinds, meaning a full blind should have to wear off completely before another can be applied, that's only fair.
The killer should also become harder to blind if they get the scoring event for avoiding a full blind.
Currently, you can get the scoring event for dodging a badly timed blind at a dropped pallet, but then you're just blinded anyway on the pallet break which is just annoying, what's the point of having that scoring event if you don't get a bit of resistance with it as a reward?
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Yeah, only work left to do on the bloodweb is item priority when mass spending and it's perfect.
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DbD is the only pvp game I've ever participated in where one side isn't allowed to defend for the sake of the other side's feelings.
Visualize this for a sec:
- A hockey or soccer game where goalies are only allowed to block a shot on goal 8 times, then they have to sit out for the rest of the match.
- A basketball game where one team is only allowed to block a shot on hoop 8 times.
- A baseball game where one team is only allowed to catch a pop-fly for an out 8 times before they have to let it hit the ground.
- A dodgeball game where one side is only allowed to catch a thrown ball for an out 8 times.
- A game of Counter-Strike where each player on one side is only allowed to headshot a player 8 times before none of their headshots count for the rest of all rounds.
- A fighting game where one player is only allowed to block an attack 8 times before their block button doesn't work anymore.
- A game of chess where one side is only allowed to capture 8 pieces.
All of these ideas are a bunch of completely bogus hand-holding nonsense.
Two killers, Skull Merchant and Singularity turned 3-gen scenarios into an issue; Why does the entire killer roster get hit in the face with the bullshit-catapult in response?
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Agreed, the only thing aim dressing seems to do is commandeer your control, screw up your lunge and leave you feeling scammed.
It's just such an awkward and weird feature whether it's forcing your lunge into a corner when you're trying to swing around one, or trying to target a specific survivor and getting vacuumed onto the one next to them.
If DbD mobile offered an option to turn it off, why can't we do the same thing here?
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Sounds like people just hate when the danger is real.
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Tunneling - A term made up to cope with getting caught again.
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My wishlist after 10k hours of mostly playing Ghostface.
- After 4 successful marked stabs, gain the ability to throw the knife once.
- While crouched and in Night Shroud, the Ghostface will not trigger chase.
- Accrued stalk points do not drop off on injury. (All accrued stalk points drop off when put into the dying state)
- All reveal progress is instantly lost when losing sight of the Ghostface while Night Shroud is active (Current time to reveal is 1.5 seconds).
- Add slight speed burst when revealed.
- Make directional indicators more accurate when in the process of being revealed.
- Cut cooldown of Night Shroud in half on successful marked stab.
- Make effects of current 'Chewed Pen' and 'Lasting Cologne' base kit (Increases reveal time for dying/hooked survivors to 3 seconds).
- New Chewed Pen: Marked targets become blind for the duration of the mark.
- New Lasting Cologne: For 80 seconds, survivors injured while Night Shroud is active take 1 second longer to reveal the Ghostface.
- Cinch Straps: Night Shroud remains active after successful 'Silent Stab' scoring events. (Putting survivors into the dying state ends Night Shroud)
- Marked Map: After performing the damage generator function, survivors within 10 meters of the affected generator will have their locations revealed for 3 seconds upon the next interaction with the affected generator.
- Victim's Detailed Routine: (In addition to it's current effect) For 80 seconds, generators being repaired by marked survivors will be highlighted in Yellow and marked survivors receiving or performing healing will have their locations revealed.
- Night Vision Monocular: (In addition to it's current effect), auras of all survivors within 10 meters of the revealing survivor are shown for 5 seconds.
- Telephoto Lens: (In addition to it's current effect) stalking has no range limit.
- While Night Shroud is active, if a survivor is 'stalkable,' their portrait will animate to indicate they are 'stalkable' (unintended marking can be extremely detrimental).
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The gen speed isn't as much of a problem as map safety. It's because of the amount of interconnecting safety that 3 gens will be done by the end of the first chase.
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They need to fix the fog for sure.
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Survivor hexes or "Boons" should be limited to 3 casts per player.
Killer: Gets one initial Hex cast +1 cast if they slot 'Undying.'
Survivor: Gets unlimited casts requiring the killer to have a special perk to stop them.
Not the coolest thing ever.
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@Zuiphrode said:
There's literally no gameplay reason to do so other than teabagging which is toxic behavior. I'd like for teabagging to just be bannable entirely under the poor sportsmanship report reason but that'll never happen so I'll settle for this.
Would be nice.
All the trashy hazing just adds an extra layer of grime to a bad match and if you're on the fence about the game as a new player, it just makes uninstalling more attractive.
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So you want louder warning bells and glowing projectiles to reduce the threat and make it easier to escape the killer…In an environment where gen speed is still ridiculous, endurance can carry bad players/turn good players into demi-gods, while it's demanded that killers play for hooks as the primary means of victory.
Sounds like a poor suggestion.
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@Xord said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3945979#Comment_3945979
I personally think dead hard is currently a fun troll perk, currently the worst exhaustion perk in the game and there are much better perks that do a similar job, such as blood rush.
Its only strengh is that it became so bad that such few players actually play it now and when they do it can surprise you.
A single successful deadhard happening halfway through the match can kill so much M1 killer pressure that they lose.
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Were there no exhaustion after pressing E, you could just spam it.
So, no.
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Survivor: (Tries to run)
Vader: (Force Chokes survivor to death)
______________________________
Survivor: (Tries to throw pallet)
Vader: (Effortlessly keeps pallet upright with the force)
_______________________________
Survivor: (Vaults Window)
Vader: (Force Pulls survivor back through window, impaling them on lightsaber)
______________________________
Vader: (M1's Survivor)
Survivor: (Loses arm from grievous lightsaber wound, suffers permanent broken status effect for the rest of the short match)
______________________________
The Entity: (Tries to subjugate Darth Vader)
Vader: (Subjugates the Entity and feeds it to Abeloth)
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3932445#Comment_3932445
It is an imbalance issue. I'm coming at this from the killer perspective, so you know it's not driven by anger or annoyance from having to deal with it, and it's pretty plain to see as far as I'm concerned.
If a killer chases someone as soon as they're unhooked, that survivor starts the chase injured, directly next to the killer, and with a good likelihood of not being near resources. It takes no effort or skill for the killer to stack the chase heavily in their favour, and it takes considerable effort and skill to beat them.
On its face, that's pretty obviously unbalanced. I don't see a way around that. Equally, if you rely on leveraging something unbalanced too heavily, you won't know how to play without it, and you'll have a harder time after a certain point.
It's not an imbalance issue because the chances are pretty good that you get to a window or pallet within your 10 seconds of endurance + speed boost, especially if you did the smart thing while on hook and considered where you ought to go next if a teammate performs an unsafe unhook on you.
And even if you don't make it to a pallet or window, so what? You're on a team of 4 people vs 1 and there's a strict time constraint. You can't elevate the way you feel over what's fair in a time-sensitive asymmetrical scenario. You're supposed to understand what you're signing up for before you press the ready button.
You can't have an environment where the survivors are ultra safe, can finish their objective minutes from the start, with only a few killers that can handle it.
How many of these idiot-proof style handholds are going to be installed before DbD transforms from a game into a horror-themed ride? The better question is 'why are people pressuring the devs to do this?'
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3932295#Comment_3932295
I mean… no?
The OP was written from the perspective of "Relying on the easier chase that comes from chasing someone who just got unhooked can be harmful in the long run".
Remember, this isn't a complaint. It's advice, from one killer player to others.
I'll grant that I should've clarified that tunnelling in this context is just that, only chasing survivors who were just unhooked, but otherwise you're presenting the post in a heavily skewed way, and your initial comment still doesn't reflect even that view whatsoever.
Well I'm re-reading it, and it definitely boils down to "taking the path of least resistance is bad, learn better 'skill' instead."
It's misleading advice to try to get killers to "tunnel" less.
The OP was answered with an example and explanation. It's hard to argue that posts like this don't crop up largely because of all the complaints about getting caught again and the crooked, anger-driven insistence that it's an imbalanced issue (in complete ignorance of the time constraint against the killer).
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3932121#Comment_3932121
If it's a response to the post, what's the back half where you talk about entitled survivors all about?
You're doing it here, too, talking about tunnelling complaints. How's that relevant?
Oh, that's a reminder about where the terminology "tunneling" spawned from.
As for the relevance check: The OP was written from the angle of "catching the same survivor consecutively is bad" was it not?
To clarify: The points you're making in the OP aren't actually valid.
1.) The Fundamentals of playing killer are about understanding and executing actions that ultimately stop the survivors from escaping and lead them into death. Nobody's growth as a killer is "stunted" by taking the path of least resistance if the opportunity presents itself. Killers are supposed to exploit the mistakes of survivors and a skilled killer is a master of this.
2.) Hooking the same survivor consecutively is unpopular, but not unbalanced due to the time constraint of generator speeds. Generator completion speeds can be harsh. The time a killer has to make a difference against seasoned survivors is very short, thus tactics like "tunneling" for faster eliminations and "slugging" to create more time and pressure are employed (These tactics started and persist because of fast completion speeds).
With exhaustion perks, inapposite second chances, resource distribution and varied killer power levels, the entire thing is extremely messy, and as such, a consistently comfortable hooking rotation is a pipedream at best.
Even with possible incoming deterrents, there's not much sense in trying to convince killer players to adopt such a bizarre sense of one-way etiquette in an environment where they'll probably lose the game if they do (unless they play an S-tier character).
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3931706#Comment_3931706
I feel perhaps you're responding to the vague idea of tunnelling more than the actual post, here.
Uh, no.
That's definitely a direct response to the OP from the POV of a Ghostface main.
Run around with a knife, legs and nothing else for a week in standard matches and ignore/chase players you find based on hooking order and you might start to understand just how silly and entitled the complaints about "tunneling" really are.
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I've got 2 and a half minutes from the start to make a difference and I'm maining an M1 killer.
It doesn't matter if you're a fresh hook or got off 45 seconds ago, If I find you and have an opportunity to down you in a timely fashion, I'm going to try because I will lose the game if I don't.
Gens fly and I do not possess the power level of the blight or the nurse. I don't have time to care about what order anybody is hooked in.
Trying to spin it as a skill issue is ignorant and it's ridiculous to think that your feelings take precedence over what's fair in an asymmetrical scenario with a strict time constraint.
(Ugly truth disclaimer)
"I just got off the hook! It's someone else's turn! This feels bad for me! I don't care if there isn't time to think about my feelings! Think about them anyway you dirty, sweaty, no-skill loser!!! DEVS! MAKE THIS FEEL BETTER FOR ME! Asym-what? I don't give a s**t! MEEEE!"
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My wishlist after 10k hours of mostly playing Ghostface.
After 4 successful marked stabs, gain the ability to throw the knife once.
While crouched and in Night Shroud, the Ghostface will not trigger chase.
Accrued stalk points do not drop off on injury. (All accrued stalk points drop off when put into the dying state)
All reveal progress is instantly lost when losing sight of the Ghostface while Night Shroud is active (Current time to reveal is 1.5 seconds).
Add slight speed burst when revealed.
Make directional indicators more accurate when in the process of being revealed.
Cut cooldown of Night Shroud in half on successful marked stab.
Make effects of current 'Chewed Pen' and 'Lasting Cologne' base kit (Increases reveal time for dying/hooked survivors to 3 seconds).
New Chewed Pen: Marked targets become blind for the duration of the mark.
New Lasting Cologne: For 80 seconds, survivors injured while Night Shroud is active take 1 second longer to reveal the Ghostface.
Cinch Straps: Night Shroud remains active after successful 'Silent Stab' scoring events. (Putting survivors into the dying state ends Night Shroud)
Marked Map: After performing the damage generator function, survivors within 10 meters of the affected generator will have their locations revealed for 3 seconds upon the next interaction with the affected generator.
Victim's Detailed Routine: (In addition to it's current effect) For 80 seconds, generators being repaired by marked survivors will be highlighted in Yellow and marked survivors receiving or performing healing will have their locations revealed.
Night Vision Monocular: (In addition to it's current effect), auras of all survivors within 10 meters of the revealing survivor are shown for 5 seconds.
Telephoto Lens: (In addition to it's current effect) stalking has no range limit.
While Night Shroud is active, if a survivor is 'stalkable,' their portrait will animate to indicate they are 'stalkable' (unintended marking can be extremely detrimental). -
@Mandy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3927290#Comment_3927290
the difference in this case, is that survivors can do nothing about the being in dying state, however the killer can do a lot to force survivors out of the match.
See this is why I've stopped buying killers and other content, this mentality you guys seem to hold. You care up and down about how the survivor players feel, but barely give a toss about how the killer players feel and just think that it's funny.
Survivors get annoyed? They get game mechanics implemented.
Killers get annoyed? They get an excuse.
Not a cool vibe at all.
Frankly, you guys are years late on a base-game, entity-related mechanic that makes gate griefing a dumb thing to do.
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With the upcoming survivor, the Sloppy Butcher nerf should just be reverted.
After all it was a nerf of desire, not necessity, and now people are running around with 99'd heals like that makes any sense.
"(facepalm) Yes Meg, you have to finish dressing your grievous stab wound or it will, in fact, keep bleeding…"
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I've listened to the Ghostface chase music for over 10k hours, I'd like to have the option of playing my own stuff in the background or just not hearing the chase music for the immersion value.
There have been a couple times in the past when bugs disabled the chase music and we got to taste that experience…it was nice…and no, chases didn't become any easier. You don't need the chase music to muffle sounds either, there are survivor perks for that if it's truly desired.
As far back as I can remember, adjusting the volume of music, sfx, voices, etc. has always been a standard feature in games; so why can we not have that in DbD?
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Something like that would be okay if pallets/windows weren't so interconnected. Right now safeties are so close together and so plentiful that they basically form a safety highway, especially if you know exactly where to run next with WoO. Against the weaker killers, by the time enough of a deadzone is created for it to matter, the gens are already finished with plenty of resources to spare (hence the reason that comp strat is just predrop everything). At the moment, WoO reduces the danger of being chased by a respectable amount and should at least require a perk slot (an activation condition and time limit wouldn't hurt either).
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Everything sounds great except the increase on base completion times, there should be some version of basekit dying light and/or dead lock instead. If the killer is meant to be more powerful as the match goes on, it should just be that way by default, they shouldn't have to equip perks to make that a palpable reality.
There is so much endurance at this point that it can carry you to victory against M1 killers. Struggling to defeat a group of seasoned survivors with M1 just to lose because your hits didn't count is an incredibly shi**y feeling and the least the dev could do if they truly aren't biased is to make it so the killer truly does become more powerful as the match goes on.
Just because something is fine against an S-tier killer, doesn't mean it's fine against the entire killer roster.
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@DeBecker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/443763/killer-is-not-fun
Learn to play killer properly instead of relying solely on gameflaws.
There is no "proper" way to play, it depends on the killer being used, they're not all the same.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3897244#Comment_3897244
Gen regression nerfd into oblivion because survivors didn't like it.
Gen regression nerfed because killers used gen kick and 3 gen meta for a full year and held games hostage with regression perks. It took 3 rounds of perk nerfs, a killer rework, and a new base kit mechanic to get people to stop, and all we've heard since then it's complaints that people want all of it back.
10 seconds extra on hook with next to nothing regression to counter said extra gen progression.
10 extra seconds on hook finally added after over 2 years, since this should've gone live with the extra 10 seconds of gen speed added in 6.1. killers enjoyed 2 years of buffed camping and tunneling thanks to that delay.
Limited gen regression to 8 hits.
Yup. This was the final straw they had to implement to actually kill off the 3gen meta, since nothing else had yet worked. Interestingly, this also came with a free, base kit anti gen tap mechanic as compensation for that change... Where's that in your list?
Increasing aura on certain killers.
Since I assume you mean "terror radius" here, they also reduced the terror radius for stealth killers. Not sure why a consistency patch is included, but if you're looking to stretch it then I suppose having "high mobility" killers with higher TR could be on a list. Could also be seen as a buff to terror radius perks, and is absolutely a buff to the stealth killers. Seems like cherry picking to me.
Hooking that actually gives survivors second chance perks often resulting in a free escape in end game.
You have to be talking about only the base kit BT feature. No other unhook perk works in the end game anymore (as of that same patch actually). This is countered by counting to ten. It also didn't change the effect, since before this everyone ran the perk. It was mandatory. This was a good change unless you hard camped a lot, which tracks for a lot of killers on this forum actually.
Boil over, flip-flop, pallet stun, flashlight stun, flashbang stun, body blocks, sabotage, ds are all available to prevent hooking.
DS had been nerfed since it was actually good at deterring tunneling. They couldn't even make it 5s again because people complained. Everything else in this list has been around for a long time. However, they've added things like starstruck, and awakened awareness, and a huge host of aura perks to help with this. Since we're taking about hook denial, they also made hooks respawn even on sacrifice.
Interacting with the killer also means people aren't on gens.
Then they introduced shoulder the burden.
StB only moves the hook state, announces that it's being used, and then makes the person with the new hook state exposed. The only people who complain about this perk are the ones that don't understand how it works, or completely lack the game sense to counter it.
Fixed these for you.
Gen regression nerfed because killers used gen kick and 3 gen meta for a full year and held games hostage with regression perks. It took 3 rounds of perk nerfs, a killer rework, and a new base kit mechanic to get people to stop, and all we've heard since then it's complaints that people want all of it back.You mean defended generators worth a damn and want to be able to do so again. Talking about it like killers aren't supposed to try to stop you is weird.
10 extra seconds on hook finally added after over 2 years, since this should've gone live with the extra 10 seconds of gen speed added in 6.1. killers enjoyed 2 years of buffed camping and tunneling thanks to that delay.Completion speeds were nutty back then and are still absurd to this day (excluding original BNP, of course).
"Limited gen regression to 8 hits"Yup. This was the final straw they had to implement to actually kill off the 3gen meta, since nothing else had yet worked. Interestingly, this also came with a free, base kit anti gen tap mechanic as compensation for that change... Where's that in your list?You mean to kill off the ability to defend. Again, acting like killers aren't supposed to be able to stop you is weird as hell. Tantamount to saying if a football team is defending too well, they need to be forced to let the other team score a touchdown.
Also, BHVR was initially going to remove instant gen tapping during the beta until somebody decided it was "funny." Dumb story short, it was never supposed to be in the game in the first place.
"
Hooking that actually gives survivors second chance perks often resulting in a free escape in end game."You have to be talking about only the base kit BT feature. No other unhook perk works in the end game anymore (as of that same patch actually). This is countered by counting to ten. It also didn't change the effect, since before this everyone ran the perk. It was mandatory. This was a good change unless you hard camped a lot, which tracks for a lot of killers on this forum actually.You do not always get the opportunity to count to ten…If you have no choice but to hook somebody within 10 seconds distance to a gate in end game, then yes, on unhook, they will in fact receive a free escape guarded by invincibility…and it's complete bullshit.
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@zarr said:
With survivors almost never having anti-tunnel perks, what this mode shows more than anything is that tunnelling is overpowered (from a live balance perspective).
If you are struggling as killer in this mode, I suggest you try tunnelling. Whatever you are doing when the first survivor you hooked gets unhooked, drop it and go back there to chase after that survivor. You will win most of your matches that way as long as you are not completely outmatched skill-wise or mess up big-time.
Tunnelling is already optimal strategy even in the regular mode, and once someone actively employs it it's usually a wake-up call as to how potent killers really are. It completely changes the dynamic of the game, especially of course once in that 3v1.
Seems fine if you consider how fast all gens can be completed, not to mention how badly you're screwed if you get gen-split on a killer that has no mobility. As a killer, you'd better be doing something real to combat the reality of the situation if you expect to beat the survivors. People bellyaching about how the killer deals with them and slapping labels on certain actions like "camping, tunneling and slugging" is the epitome of entitlement.
It's a 4 v 1 scenario, yet people completely disrespect that, adopt a devil-may-care attitude, and act like their "fun" as survivors matters more than what's fair to the killer. The most awkward thing about all this is the company is actually making game developments based on this viral spoiled teenager attitude echoing out of the social media platforms, and to no surprise, the killer role becomes less attractive with every chapter release.
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The sad state of the current DbD game build is that killers can be punished by anti-tunnel features even if they don't tunnel; You can't restrict killers into a hook-only-and-never-tunnel situation unless there are fair shutoff conditions for anti-tunnel features.
Actively trying to "play fair" and never tunnel, only to get punished anyway by "anti-tunnel" features is one of the heaviest catalysts that drive killer mains to embrace slugging. These killers are trying to play around improperly implemented mechanics…So just fix those mechanics to only work when a survivor is truly being targeted by malicious tunnel-vision, THEN place your restrictions.
Forcing killers to eat a wall of undeserved extra chances + further diminishing ways to work around that wall is likely to have a nasty impact on the desire to queue for the killer role.
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@HeroLives said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887382#Comment_3887382
Yeah the idea is to not be swarmed at the hook with the killer around, or even just swarmed at the hook, or swarmed at the hook immediately. In fair play it really only takes one person to save and go give a heal to the person that was unhooked. Killer should have time to be able to have found and take another chase by then probably kick a gen too, with adjusted heal times and gen times/ regression to account for it of course.
But in reference to Mr_K's argument; it wouldn't actually be logical at all that multiple survivors end up on the ground including the unhooked. In fact, it's not a taller order to perform the hook save and get to safety before taking a downing hit.
So DS deactivating if the killer chases, downs and hooks a different survivor is fair since they're not tunneling. The change allows DS to keep its intended function and would help to encourage playing for hooks by addressing something that frankly just feels like a proverbial middle finger, and unjustly punishes killers who are actively trying to "play nice."
As for anti-tunnel perks "not existing;" the idea is to provide a buffer against the act of malicious tunnel-vision, not to make somebody completely immune to being caught again.
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If 2 dive the hook, the first person soaks the first hit and runs off, the second person gets the save and soaks the second hit and it's very likely that everybody gets to a window or pallet before taking a downing hit.
Isn't the play in that scenario to go do gens instead of focusing on the hook save, though?
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887244#Comment_3887244
My main concerns as a killer player are the phase 2 changes. Its a lot of "anti-killer does thing we don't like" and very little "reward the killer for playing the way we want them to play"
Exactly. There ought to be more talk about killers getting punished by anti-tunnel features even when they don't tunnel.
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887358#Comment_3887358
If a survivor is unhooked and DS activates, it needs to deactivate if the killer downs and hooks a completely different survivor because the killer isn't tunneling at that point.
I see this point all the time and wonder if people really don't think this out. If a killer is camping and a group of survivors try going for the save. Isn't it logical that more than one survivor ends up on the ground, including the unhooked? I mean, the very reason the perk exists is destroyed by this.
Wouldn't the group have to mess up pretty badly for that to happen?
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- You can get punished by anti-tunnel perks even when you don't tunnel, that's a pretty major one.
- Being able to weaponize off-the-hook endurance and OTR endurance by body blocking teammates with it instead of using it for the intended purpose of being a buffer against getting tunneled. Removing collision on these features would be more fair.
- OTR invincibility sticks even when you get healed to full, it needs to drop off when becoming fully healed.
- If a survivor is unhooked and DS activates, it needs to deactivate if the killer downs and hooks a completely different survivor because the killer isn't tunneling at that point.
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I don't remember it being any easier to catch survivors when the chase music was shut off due to bugs. Also, after hearing it multiple thousands of times, it'd just be nice to shut it off or be able to play your own tunes in the background without the audio clash.
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3885281#Comment_3885281
Survivors know this because nobody wants to play it and those that do either lose or give up
Yep. Survivors give up en masse these days and instead of acknowledging that survivors have been dealt the short end of the stick, killers STILL try and dismiss it by saying it's an orchestrated attempt to inflate kill rates lol.
Rather than admit the much simpler truth that survivors are just fed up of losing all the time.
It seems more the case that a lot of survivors just have main character syndrome so badly that they're ignoring the format of the game and just giving up when they realize they won't be able to absolutely stomp.
I hit a generator with driver's license yesterday and three people pulled the plug, I hadn't hooked or even stabbed a single person yet.
Check it out:
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2385083333 -
@TheSubstitute said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3886094#Comment_3886094
If, during public matches, you find you need to tunnel and camp to have a chance you're most assuredly not at top MMR.
Thing about that is survivors will get themselves caught again by pure happenstance and call it tunneling.
People get themselves caught again against my ghostface all the time and start spouting off about tunneling in egc when it was really just a lack of situational awareness or pure bad luck. And you have to take whatever you can get on a killer as painfully weak as Ghostface or you'll lose.
Malicious tunnel-vision on somebody who just got unhooked - I can understand wanting to prevent that, but you can't act like getting caught again out of happenstance/bad luck is the same thing as malicious tunnel-vision. At what point does personal responsibility become a factor in the equation (because I thought this was supposed to be a game, not a ride)?
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Hooray…I'm so excited for Ghostface to have even less stopping power!
Eating a wall of endurance with no workaround on an M1 killer is my dream experience 👍️
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@jajay119 said:
faster bleed out = promotes slugging and go next
Some sort of recovery = discourages slugging and encourages return to normal play.
This is the point I raise every time someone suggests bleed out as a solution to slugging.
Thing about "normal" play is that it sucks from the killer perspective.
Being punished by anti-tunnel perks even if you don't tunnel and losing because of it…that's what makes the knockdown playstyle more attractive, you have to put up with less ultra-frustrating bulls**t.
Plus it tends to turn the whole trial into one long chase for the killer, gens don't fly, and you actually feel more like the power role.
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It feels like a lot of people are a little lost in the fog when it comes to what DbD is. You see 'Dead by Daylight' isn't designed to give you a proverbial shoulder rub, the matches are referred to as "trials" for a reason.
You're sort of looking at killer designs like they're horror-themed rides at a carnival when you're meant to view them as different challenges in a game.
The dev's intention is for you to find fun in trying to overcome the challenge that each killer brings to the table.
So word to the wise - Walking into a dbd trial with the expectation of receiving a prepackaged rollercoaster-style "fun" experience is a great way to set yourself up for disappointment. Instead, walk into your next trial with the realistic expectation that you'll face a challenge that will test your knowledge, cunning and resourcefulness.
Respect and keep in mind that the game is a challenge, and you'll be able to have more fun with it.
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There's honestly nothing you can do to actually stop a group that doesn't mess around and focuses gens, they don't even need progression speed builds for ludicrous completion rates. You're especially screwed if you get put into a gen-split scenario. Best thing you can try to do is roam the 3 gens closest together and float to the fourth closest one on occasion, but then the anti-3 gen system kicks in and disables regression after you've put up too much of a fight, in essence, forcing you to let the other team score a goal.
It's frankly the most biased thing I've ever seen from a developer in a PvP game.
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There are things in the game that make participation insanely annoying and stupid like gen-trap spam, chain blinds, free escapes, general map safety, etc. and tweaking/reworking stuff like that would be good.
It wouldn't be good to reinforce and further enable the I-give-up mentality which is already spreading like wildfire.
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Mobile DbD had the option to turn it off, why the option isn't officially available to other platforms is a mystery. It's been an issue for quite awhile now and I'm not sure if it just isn't a priority or they secretly ignore it to purposely mess up killer plays for a laugh.
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@kit_mason said:
3 genning sucks to play against. Killers like Singularity, even pre-buff, were far too adept at it and still are even with the kick limit in play. Removing it returns stall metas to the forefront, which aren't fun to play against now and wouldnt be if Eruption was brought back in. Sure, other unfun strats continue to exist, but why bring back this unfun strat just because they haven't gotten around to the other ones yet (and may not have clean solutions for the others at any point?)
And re. prerunning, it's a part of a survivor's toolkit. If you're not applying enough pressure, then the loss is deserved, especially if you're running heavy slowdown setups.
How much fun do you think it is to lose because you were forced to let the opposing team score?
- If you get into a gen-split scenario as the killer, you're up s**t creek without a paddle.
- If you get into a 3-gen scenario as a survivor, you get a special system that disables gen defense.
I've never seen such a snooty display of bias in a pvp game before, and all because one side didn't find it "fun" that the other side was putting up a fight…It's ridiculous.