Vishlumbra
Vishlumbra
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”Teach players how to counter them effectively”
You guys don’t play the game. You keep making changes that destroy the game. Pro tip: Don’t show your staff in your videos, the arrogance they all transmit kill any will to believe in you guys.
If people play well, 90% of the killer roster is worthless. Shouldn’t survivors aspire to be better? Idk wild idea. -
Hi, Sadako main here. Yes there are many, many posts regarding all her bugs, issues and such.
What’s happening here is that now that they pushing this failure of a patch, that effectively kills any freedom to play with different styles, they will have to visit every single killer that’s not Blight and Nurse and adjust them, sad part it’s that they all will become similar, since there’s no room to play how players want and more like survivors want killers to play.
Personally I would just love to see her fixed, give her some buffs and in general, allow players to queue without these changes in public matches. If the patch comes out as it is, the game will die.
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Didn’t you hear? Killers are deeeeead.
Need collaborations with fluffy cartoons, Pooh for example, now the killer handles flowers and honey to survivors, who, at the end of the match, sacrifice him to the entity. -
@terumisan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3993648#Comment_3993648
funny part in these normal comp matches the nurse still tunnels and slugs because they can't really win otherwise
I know man, I just can’t believe they pushing this mess of a patch. They get so many base kit perks that they can all run efficiency perks, gens are going to go even faster and every survivor will use repair boxes.
They are killing any possibility of freedom to play the game with the terrible existing balance. Most killers are weak and forgotten for YEARS. They basically saying: play how we want you to play, forget about our killer roster and just play the same 3 killers over and over again, that is if you want to win. They basically want to make the killer role an entertainment, they removing depth etc.
I don’t know what they were thinking. -
I had hope because they began sponsoring competitive, clearly they still have no clue, even after seeing how the game has to be played for killers to have good results.
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I don’t think they even play in general. This is the single stupidest patch I have ever seen in DBD history.
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Everyone is panicking because BHR has proven they have no idea how the game is played.
New meta: 4 survivors playing the same one with the same cosmetic. All of them with repair boxes, finish a game in 4 minutes while mocking the killer. Sounds fun. My god.
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Like I said biased and imposible to get into survivors thick skull.
This patch effectively kills Sadako, Trapper, and basically every weak killer out there. (Who represent 90% of the whole killer roster).The patch destroys lore, playstyle and any reward for actually playing well as killer.
Us as players and killer mains, after thousands of hours playing the game (unlike BH) we developed as a community a way to handle the current balance of the game, we realized that a tactic is to slug, a tactic is to tunnel a player. Why? Is not because we want to be evil or annoy survivors, it’s because otherwise there is no competition and no thrill and no progress. We need to aspire to win and be efficient, not just mess around and play around as a npc to entertain survivors, assuring they escape every game.
How many second chances exist right now? How many pallets are there? Perks that allow you to stand up, not get tunneled, healing faster or just repair at an incredible speed. It’s posible now to heal a survivor fully in 5 seconds.
Btw, in competitive killers are not “banned” because they are strong, it’s because in some formats teams pick and decide which they playing. For example Nurse is not handicapped in any way, just allows survivors to use any perk and item. Namely a normal match.I don’t even care anymore, there’s not a single example of something implemented by BH and being well received or even viable. They need to hire real players and actually learn to listen. I’m shocked that after finally sponsoring competitive and seeing how those matches go, they didn’t get at least a bit deterred from all these changes.
Im out. Keep saying to yourself this is a healthy move. Duh
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Clearly you haven’t played killer enough then. Once you leave the comfort zone mmr things become rough. Anyone who plays killer enough can testify for this.
Talking to survivors or forum players is a waste of time, that’s why I direct my criticism directly to BH.DBD: The “horror game” where the most iconic killers play by a rule book, get penalized for killing so survivors don’t feel bad.
Changing a winning formula is most of the time a dumb move. Game needs balance. 95% of the killer roster needs buffs and they keep implementing nerfs that factually make the mid / low level killers unplayable. This is like changing the flavor of coke. Historically dumb move.
Fact: Good survivors have everything to win every match. This is not a debate. Proven by:
1- Competitive. Every match is played the same way. Face camp and tunnel is needed even with top tier killers.
2- In pro play they have to implement nerfs to survivors so killers have a chance unless they are playing nurse or blight.
3- 90-95% of the killers are considered weak and more like a novelty with a lower tier power compared to the S tier killers. Game is not balanced correctly.
4- Survivors lose games when their team is just chilling, messing around or new to the game. If all 3 survivors are playing to their objective while the fourth is getting chased, they will complete 3 gens in the first 2 minutes of a game. There’s a plethora of second chance perks and now they get base kit overpowered perks allowing even more efficiency.
5- BH doesn’t play their own game. The laziness is astonishing. A huge metal bar during the whole walking dead patch proves they didn’t play a single game before release, creating the worst patch to ever go live with game breaking bugs.
6- Adding the “remove this rules” in custom games proves they know that when survivors play with half a brain cell it would kill competitive.Really this is not a healthy update. It’s a mess guided by feelings instead of what’s possible to achieve, without a sense of progress, players quit. My god.
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DBD the “horror game” where feelings guide the developers and the most iconic horror killers play by a rule book so players who play survivor don’t feel bad about themselves.
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@cogsturning said:
90 seconds for a good chase? What?? That's a bad chase.
What are the 14 perks exactly?
You don't have to get 6 hooks before a kill. The penalty is if you hook someone twice in a row and you cause them to die before you've hit the 6 hooks. They're trying to prevent the type of early-game tunneling that dooms survivors immediately.
90 seconds is actually a fast down. I think you forgetting that you need to hit them twice, body blocks, plethora of pallets, perks, etc. Btw now every survivor can just use repair boxes every game.
Every match against a decent mid level survivors you lose 2-3 gens after first chase. So realistically you think any killer is capable of 5 20 seconds downs before he looses every single gen?
No notifications for killer, no information whatsoever. Really, the point of the game is to have certain degree of challenge, basically this patch guarantees a win every game and with good (not even pro survivors) there’s absolutely no chance to win.
Just reading that we can remove this bs patch in custom games is basically accepting that you know that this is too much.
Like I said, sure, is gonna be fun for survivors for a while, that is if there are enough killers mains that are willing to deal with all these effects and rules. After, you will lose most of the new player cause of boredom. As a company you are trying to appeal to new players instead to your established player base that knows how to play and been around for years. Nice going.
Pro tip: existing costumers are more important. 80% of your business comes from 20% of your clients and those know these changes are as dumb as it gets. -
If you hook a survivor before 4 gens are done, the killer is paralyzed for 5 minutes.
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A year ago I almost got banned because I said that what we would be better with NPC killers. It feels like that the goal is having a killer just trying to be a worthless mockery for the survivors while they hold a button.
News flash: the only minimal depth your game has are killers. You are murdering everything that made you successful. Guess you are focused on failing.
Just by accepting that you can remove these bs in private matches you are accepting these updates are game breaking. Really, remove the win or lose. Just reward everyone and make everyone quit within a month. When you don’t care to get or need to get better, the game gets boring fast. My god. Never seen a company trying to kill their game so bad.
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It’s getting funny but not funny for players who actually strive to get better.
I mean, adding an option to remove all this bs in private matches proves they realize that in the hands of good players, no killer has any possibility. It’s just comical how they refuse to play their own game.
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@iOverSpray said:
You're gonna get put on that non civil list. How dare you call the game what it is?
Exactly, man. They even DM’d me last year threatening to ban me just because I brought up balance issues. They’re far gone at this point… cough Blizzard vibes.
I don’t understand how people can even defend this patch, really.
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If it were just a visual bug or a single item, I wouldn’t care. The problem is everything else that came with this patch:
- Chases often don’t even start.
- Visual bugs are everywhere.
- Xenomorph can see pallet auras like Freddy.
- Spirit has become practically worthless same as Singularity.
- Sound effects are completely messed up. Heard Michone or Daryl?
- Spamable fog now disorients players and is PERPETUAL.
- Clown…
- Houndmaster dog.
- Quality of voice acting.
And that’s just a fraction of the issues.
This is on top of the Walking Dead patch being pitifully unstable, with bugs that never should have made it to live servers. What’s the excuse? In theory, they delayed content to improve quality—but this is the result.
Then there’s the competitive problem: when a league is forced to implement its own nerfs just to give one side a chance, that’s a clear sign the balance is broken.
This isn’t about one item or a visual bug—it’s about a game that’s falling apart, run by a team that either doesn’t test properly or doesn’t play their game.
WHAT IS THE EXCUSE TO LAUNCH THIS?
GREED. Done. Im out.
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It is, thats why I quit, aint free tho.
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Chucky nerf basically made me stop playing.
SM was a kill switch, with no priority to actually fix her.
Xenomorph is perhaps the worst nerf I have ever seen in this game. No the tail was not imposible to dodge, was actually hard to use. That opinion comes from more survivor mains that want useless killers. The 15 seconds waiting time paired with 2 flame per second instead of 25 sealed the deal. He is a goner. Maybe in 2 years or so they will realize they are gutting the game by being survivor biased. -
it doesn’t matter, you need to run the 4 meta perks or lose all gens in 5 minutes. That’s how BH wants it to be.
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For me the excitement died a month ago. I used to play daily and somehow I have 6 hours played in 30 days now. It’s something about the updates. The killer nerfs are annoying and broke my will to keep playing. Mainly Chucky and Xenomorph.
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1 - I am referring to the numerous posts about anxiety. I’m old enough to just don’t care and drop the game if it’s annoying.
2 - Every successful world phenomenon’s game pay attention to what’s possible to achieve at top skill. Most forum is survivor biased. Most adjustments are survivor based… I mean. 2 vs 8 anyone?
3- Going from 3 to 40 seconds or 6 to 80 don’t you think it’s a bit extreme? Considering there are stronger killers out there. That’s just bad game design or lack of game sense.
4- The mentality is clear. Don’t think I need to dig deeper. Have fun and just lose some games, that’s unrewarding to players trying to become better. Killers have a way stepper learning curve to become good just to become worthless because some people think it’s tough to actually learn how they work and how to counter them. The answer is not nerfing them to the ground while they decide what to do. The game is unbalanced against decent survivors. That’s how it is. Specially since some killers are in need of a buff for years and they still get neglected.
5- It would be in accordance to their design mentality.
6- Every gen regression perk got destroyed. That’s a fact. And still they are the most used perks cause it’s impossible to keep up.
I mentioned the break cause I think I’m not alone on this. A lot of players stopped playing because of bad decisions. I don’t care anymore. I tried and when I had the energy to engage all I asked was: Check why those strategies exist. It’s not like anyone is playing with the mentality of annoying players, it’s what began working due the current state of the game. The strategies emerged from gameplay, not from an evil plot to hurt survivor experience.
And we get to the same. Anti killer mentality and more of accusations of being killer main vs survivor main… lame. I play survivor just as much btw, but yeah, DBD became unplayable for me, it’s not fun anymore because of this lack of understating from their own developers. It’s been one miss after the next. Really, Houndmastee is still plagued with bugs, killers needing buffs for years etc. Like I said, I just recommend giving some type of reward to killers to play to lose. I am done for now, don’t want to keep reading same old stuff. See ya. -
If they would address and balance the game with what’s possible to achieve and don’t factor in community driven perk patches and unnecessary killer nerfs (like chucky) it wouldn’t exist, but since the game is balanced according to popular survivor demands, they will add on base kit unbreakable and give base kit abilities from the 2vs8 event. You know, arcade survivor wins mode.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3858369#Comment_3858369
Oh, I know very much what you mean, as shes my second main ^^
Hope it gets fixed sooner rather than later!
It’s been twice they tried in the last month after a dozen or so patches where the bug was neglected, and still it’s bugged, idk. There’s a streamer who made the video proving she is still bugged. Without the add on, her intermittent invisibility numbered like .987, where supposedly must be 1.2 seconds, with the add on was lower, like .947.
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@radiantHero23 said:
Sadako's been fixed, no?
No. Her intermittent invisibility is still busted and the add on does nothing. It’s been proven multiple times recently, she is still bugged. (Without considering she needs buffs).
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Another community driven emotional nerf. It’s terrible.
Slowly but surely we getting to the point killers are supposed to provide entertainment to survivors while having no real chance of winning unless survivors want to play bad.Chucky has terrible map presence, mediocre stealth that is revealed to survivors, gutted add ons and now crippled chase. He went from A- to D tier. It does feel like a business strategy, Houndmaster is OP for now, when the next chapter hits she will get nerfed, repeat.
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For me it’s been quite chill. I’m killer main but I play survivor about 50% of the time. Had a few sweaty killers but mostly chill ones after tossing them a few snowballs.
As killer I start a bit sweaty but after I get 2 survivors killed I let the other 2 finish gens and escape. -
The intermittent invisibility is still busted, same as the add on.
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@Inosennatoki said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854506#Comment_3854506
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854762#Comment_3854762
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3853937#Comment_3853937
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3853830#Comment_3853830
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854617#Comment_3854617
Lol They didn't kill the killer in the next patch, but they killed the addon instead.
After Chucky and Skull merchant, It is Knotted Rope.
Chucky got nerfed in basically every aspect. Not only add ons. Dracula too.
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I enjoyed most things released this year with a few exceptions.
1- The Chucky nerf was way too much. The rat poison nerf was enough. The slower slice and dice feels really weird paired with a longer CD to his power makes his map presence very bad.
2- Dracula hellfire nerf makes no sense. He was fine, the only thing needed was the Medusa add on nerf and bat form cd.3- Shoulder the Burden is way too strong and widens the gap when used by SWF teams, is basically a win card.
4- Sadako intermittent invisibility is still busted and the add on still does nothing. She could also use a small buff to her condemn mechanic, turning off tvs and carrying tapes must have a downside.
5- Ghostface buffs were a bit, underwhelming.
6- Liked the 2vs8 yet we can all agree survivors were way too strong.7- In general, I wish they could take a deeper look into what’s possible to achieve in game when you have a group of competent survivors and actually balance the game considering that. The non community approved killer strategies emerged due current possibilities survivors have, there’s way too many downsides to hook people and spread those hooks. Add a “try to stop bleeding” option for slugged survivors after 1 min, give them 3, 4% chances to get up or die. You could also add an add on that improves those odds. Buff a bit regression perks for killers so spreading hooks feel a bit more rewarding.
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@Unequalmitten86 said:
Survivor Main here and let me say I absolutely understand tactical slugging and tunneling. I don't get mad about it because I understand it. I get mad when I am on the ground bleeding out with my teammates and getting humped by the killer just because they can. I usually crawl to the nearest hook.
Now as far as MM it's a mess. It seems that I get my Survivor rank in my killer games and it's unbearable. I get loads of toxic play and I only play two games a day of killer if that. I don't understand how one can do a gen by themselves in less than a minute with no gen perks and the sabo squads yuck. I can genuinely understand the slug strategy with who I go up against. But not all games are like that and I never slug I will just let it go.
The main reason I feel is that slugging meta is more popular on the North American servers so that's only a small portion of players. It isn't this widespread problem because only very few players are doing it in the whole community but it will cause that player count drop in that area. My suggestion is make slugging punishable by some means. If the killer allows two people to bleed out for over 2 minutes then lock the ability to play killer only Survivor. Make deer stalker bk after 60 seconds. This can also be for two games in a row not just one, this will separatethe sluggers from the players. There should be no reason to bleed out someone unless the squad is toxic or tactics prevent you from hooking.
I think they should just add a “try to stop bleeding” option while slugged after one minute, you get 3, 4% chances to get up or instantly die. So, no nerfs and no waiting.
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Check any tier list. Ignore the top 3 S+ killers, look into the B or C tiers, randomly select 5 of those, those are the ones getting nerfed. BH wants every killer to play nurse, blight or hillbilly, the rest are just eye candy. Chucky got nerfed in every aspect. Add ons, chase, stealth and map pressure.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854407#Comment_3854407
No one cares to ask WHY slugging became a thing.
Because killers got some pushback on the other methods by which they broke the game, so they're throwing a tantrum.
I think that the game, without survivors just messing around, is incredibly survivor sided, backed with evidence from DBD league, analysis on stats but most of all common sense.
Without the solo queue element where you get new players, players doing challenges or simply messing around, survivors can win every single game. That’s a core design flaw, where you keep patching the game with perks. There are so many chances and perks that hooks give no benefit (which is like part of the main objective of the whole game). If you can finish 3 gens in one chase, something is off.
The issue is people like you, taking a side, defend it till the end and don’t see the bigger picture. Half the roster of killers suck, are underpowered or are basically killed switch waiting for a remake. Also well, you are blaming players, not the game balance and design that created this meta, which is obviously a tantrum, but from your side. I’ll take another week off from forums, I try but it’s just disappointing. Bye.
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Chucky is now Yucky. This is what happens when you nerf based on emotions from survivors mains. Haha. Oh well. See ya in a few years Chuck.
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If you believe the game is killer sided it just means you are a solo survivor player, like me.
The game has core issues with what’s possible to achieve, yet gets balanced by community complaints.
No one is asking why strategies emerge, like slugging. They blame the player instead of the game design.
There are at least 25 weak killers by all standards, a few of them borderline laughable and even 2 completely killed switched waiting for reworks.
Spreading hooks is the worst strategy if you want to win.
There’s a plethora of second chances perks, regression perks are nerfed every patch, chase perks too. Killers good at chase get nerfed then forgotten.Stats are not the end - all. How many games you lost as survivor because of people giving up first hook, being afk, being new or just messing around? And the chances of getting those players is higher due the nature of the 4vs1. Those all add up to the survivor stats. If you get a group of decent, not even swf, just competent survivors with good perks, having DS, Unbreakable, Shoulder the Burden, etc, the game becomes impossible to win as a killer. That’s it. That’s how it is.
So to answer your question, is because the lack of questioning of why gameplay and meta evolves into “not fun strategies”. They just perk patch the flavor of the month strategy, proceed to forget about the nerfs and never actually consider the reason.
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This is a perfect example of the issue with this forums.
No one cares to ask WHY slugging became a thing.
It’s all about the need to nerf killers somehow, without some sort of core mechanics balancing.
Slugging is a thing because they have added so many perks, add ons and items to counter hooks.
There’s a plethora of survivor perks that give second chances, get more health stages, trade hooks etc.
They feel the need to nerf every chase perk and killers good in chase till they become trash.
They made generators fly with perks and op items.They basically nerfed every regression perk till they became “meh” at best.
Then proceed to blame players who enjoy killer with non approved community strats to win.
So instead of asking why, and check what’s possible to achieve with a decent group of survivors, they just label killers as toxic, proceed to create more OP perks to soft patch complaints and keep destroying viable killers.
The full killer roster has 3 strong ones, few decent and a lot completely weak and underpowered, but emotions from survivors are more important than core issues with the game.
Killers are supposed to be a gimmicky npc chasing survivors for their amusement with no possibility to actually win vs survivors with half decent skill.
Community in this forums is always fast on judging the player side, never making accountable the game balance. Strategies emerge from core design, not from players wanting to be “mean”.So yeah OP, they will add base skit unbreakable, along with implementing some buffs like what we saw in 2vs8 and nerf middle of the ground killers till they become weak by all standards. GG.
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I think I understand the sentiment of the post. It’s not really about needing to nerf nurse, is more like butchering decent killers till they become trash and only keeping the big 3 on top.
I mean, BH is survivor emotional complaints guided, they nerfed Myers indirectly, Dracula twice in a row, totally destroyed Chucky, Ghostface meh changes, didn't fix Onryo intermittent invisibility, so on and forth.How it works is, a decent B+ killer, starts doing well, players start perfecting him, then people complain, then gets nerfed into the ground and forgotten for a couple of years. Yucky will be revisited in a couple of years, see ya Chuck.
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Chucky became Yucky. Seems they have to nerf every killer to oblivion.
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He was nerfed into oblivion. Only thing he had going for him was chase; now is gone. Slice and dice is so slow now, both cd and actual speed. Was a good run chuck, see you in a couple years, just like Freddy
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One idea could be introducing a 'friendship' style Mori, where if the game is already lost, the last two survivors could agree to concede the win to the killer, triggering a unique, collaborative finisher. Personally, I view the finishing Mori as Dead by Daylight’s version of a ‘fatality.’ I love its inclusion—it’s a stylish and satisfying conclusion to the match. Whether I’m playing killer or survivor, I think having a cool finisher adds to the game’s charm and intensity.
Also like, showing "mercy" could provide an extra benefit to the killer. Like some Bloodpoints or whatever.
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1- Freddy - Full rework (Which is happening on january no?)
2- Sadako:
Tape Mechanics
- Passive Condemn: Survivors carrying a tape passively gain a stack of Condemn every 30 seconds. This adds pressure without being overwhelming, especially in longer games.
- Tape Destruction on Hit: When Onryo hits a survivor carrying a tape, the tape is destroyed, and the survivor gains a stack of Condemn. This rewards good plays and adds counterplay to tape turn-ins.
- Insertion Penalty: Survivors inserting a tape within Onryo’s terror radius gain a temporary Hindered effect (e.g., -5% movement speed for 6 seconds). This makes turning in tapes in her face riskier.
Manifest/Demanifest Issues
- Manifestation Slowdown: Remove the slowdown while Manifesting. This change ensures smoother gameplay and encourages strategic use of Manifest/Demanifest without punishing the player.
- Lullaby While Demanifested: Remove it entirely, make it non directional or make it conditional.
- Teleportation Sound Cue: Remove the global audio cue for teleports. Survivors should rely on situational awareness rather than a guaranteed warning.
Add-on Adjustments
- Iridescent Videotape: Reduce TV cooldowns significantly and hide TV auras from survivors while equipped. This adds pressure and unpredictability for a high-risk, high-reward playstyle.
- Telephone: Increase Hindered duration to 6–8 seconds and raise the slow to 5–6%. This gives the add-on more relevance in chases.
- Tape Editing Deck: Remove the starting tape mechanic and instead allow auras of survivors turning off TVs to be revealed for 4 seconds. This incentivizes proactive TV play.
- Distorted Photo: Remove the "witness" condition to make the Condemn effect consistent and reliable.
- Ring Drawing: Make it base kit. Survivors interacting with TVs gain a stack of Condemn. This aligns with her intended pressure mechanics.
- Aura Add-ons: Shift aura effects from "on" TVs to "off" TVs and increase the detection range by 50%. This rewards players who use their TVs strategically.
- Remote Control: Integrate this add-on into her base kit. Survivors near TVs during teleportation should gain a stack of Condemn.
Miscellaneous Improvements
- Bug Fix for Intermittent Invisibility: Ensure her intermittent invisibility lasts the intended duration. This would significantly improve her stealth capabilities.
- Condemn Visual Feedback: Add subtle visual/audio cues for survivors with high Condemn stacks (e.g., static effects). This increases immersion and pressure.
Some ideas. Personally I think that at least giving some sort of penalty for delivering tapes and turning off tvs, paired with a better possibility to mind game with manifest and demanisfest would help. Other thing that could help would be giving her an aura reveal basekit, if you want any info perk atm, she has to compromise perks or add ons that are a must almost 99% of the time.
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This post is emblematic of the broader forum discourse: perks or strategies that challenge survivors' accustomed playstyles are labeled "oppressive" or "unfun," often without evaluating the tools survivors already possess to counter these changes.
If anyone believes Hex builds are truly oppressive, I encourage them to consider the current state of the game's killers and their nerfed tools. Survivors must adapt strategies instead of demanding constant balance shifts. The strength of these builds lies not in their power but in survivors' unwillingness to address them logically and efficiently.
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“Killers came up with a strategy to kill, nerf it to the ground, is toxic”
Now they will nerf every hex perk in the game, further buff shoulder the burden somehow, add a buff after cleansing a totem, nerf every killer that is not nurse, billy or blight.
Killers are not supposed to kill, they are here for survivors entertainment only.
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This is the process:
Killers come up with a build to actually kill which has counters if survivors tried a bit
Survivors feel aggravated if they need to do something other than rush gens and being able to finish the match fast, if they can mock the killer in the process, better
Killer perk gets nerfed along with 3 more killers that are c tier at best
The end
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First, you say "you don’t have to tunnel in this game." While technically true, it oversimplifies the situation. Facing a group of competent survivors, even without SWF coordination, can put a killer under immense pressure. Gen speeds, map design, and perks amplify that pressure. Tunneling becomes a natural response—not because killers want to ruin someone’s fun, but because they’re trying to salvage a match where they’re already at a disadvantage.
Toxicity is not the norm. Everyday I encounter really nice people, both sides. Most killers aren’t going into matches to grief survivors, just as most survivors aren’t actively trying to bully killers. The issue is that when survivors mock killers with teabagging, flashlights, or running oppressive or troll builds, it’s rarely called out, often seen as “funny” or part of the game. Meanwhile, any killer strategy seen as “efficient,” like tunneling or slugging, is immediately vilified. This double standard is frustrating.
As for "people taking tournament strategies out of context," the reality is that casual games often feel just as brutal. This is especially true when balance is tilted toward survivor efficiency, whether through SWF coordination or game mechanics. Killers aren’t pulling strategies out of thin air—they’ve been shaped by countless matches where they had no chance unless they played “sweaty.”
If you need evidence, just look at the state of the game. So many killers are in desperate need of help, countless perks have been nerfed into irrelevance, and numerous killers require reworks or have been forgotten altogether. I main Sadako man. Hell, tunneling and slugging don´t even apply to me. Just to fix her intermittent invisibility bug took eight months—and it’s still not resolved.
Perks like Shoulder the Burden only worsen the problem. They incentivize killers to play even sweatier, especially after being steamrolled by one tough group. The frustration isn’t about wanting survivors to lose—it’s about wanting balanced mechanics that allow both sides to have a fair chance without relying on bandaid solutions. If killers are expected to prioritize fun over winning, survivors should be held to the same standard.
Honestly, I think the most toxic part of the game is this forum. I love playing DBD, but the endless cycle of entitled nerf requests here is exhausting. Survivor success heavily depends on teamwork and coordination, yet so much of the discussion ignores this core fact.
I’ve tried in countless posts to highlight the why behind things like tunneling—why it exists and how it’s a response to the current balance. Understanding that would lead to better discussions and, hopefully, better balancing.
At this point, I’m stepping away from the forums. I’ll keep playing and just hope for the best.
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Maybe they should delete every hex perk, I mean, is not convinient cleansing totems. Lets do that.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3847318#Comment_3847318
People say survivor complaints got her nerfed but like if that’s true why hasn’t it removed camping or tunneling? Survivors complain about those things more than anything else and yet here we are.
Because the core issue is that the game is balanced around efficiency, a lot of killers are outdated, there’s a plethora of perks and builds that counter every killer “community approved” strategies and thousands of hours have proven what’s the best path to win. Biggest survivor enemy is his own teammate and their performance as a group, not killers. Everything We complain about slug and tunnel etc, comes from experience and the state of a match when is played at a decent level.
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@Valuetown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3847433#Comment_3847433
Having no counterplay = "crying their eyes out."
Some killers really just want to play a pve game where they 4k every game huh?
What I learned from this forum is that that’s exactly right, but just as much as survivors want an npc that chases them, provides them with entertainment and fun yet they escape every match. It’s a two way street, the only thing is that lately, every complain from survivors has had a repercussion in game, while some killers have been nerfed to the ground and are waiting for a remake for years. Also, perks etc. You get the idea.
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The questions we should standardize in this forum, when someone is asking to nerf a killer are:
Do you play as “X”?
Have you actually dedicated time to play it? How long?You escaped from placement matches with that killer and you realize it has weaknesses? How many matches have you played? As and against.
Are you a survivor main who never plays killer?
Then proceed to have a discussion.
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Tunneling is often seen as "bad" because it disrupts the survivor's experience, but why is that inherently wrong? Is it because it’s "unfun" for the survivor? If that’s the case, should we also start addressing other potentially toxic behaviors, like teabagging, flashlight saves, or perks like Shoulder the Burden? These things can be just as frustrating for killers, but they often go unchecked as part of the game.
The issue with balancing for "fun" or arcade-style experiences is that it leads to situations like the 2v8 mess, where the game lacks depth and meaningful counterplay. If we balance for what's actually possible within the game’s structure—strategies like tunneling becoming necessary for certain killers—we get a more realistic meta.
Games need to be balanced around what's possible to achieve, because the ultimate goal for anyone playing is to improve and feel progression. A balanced game gives both sides the opportunity to grow and refine their skills, making it more rewarding and fun in the long term. When one side is too overpowered or restricted by unfair mechanics, it stifles that growth and undermines the core fun of striving for mastery. Balancing around achievable outcomes ensures that players can always feel challenged, motivated, and rewarded for their efforts.
Ultimately, Shoulder the Burden is a prime example of a perk that has the potential to break the game. While some may defend it based on emotional arguments, the reality is that when a perk can shift the balance so drastically, it shouldn’t exist in its current form. The solution isn’t to just hope people won’t use it, but to recognize the impact it can have on the game and address it accordingly. A fair and balanced game means considering the bigger picture, not just relying on players to "play nice" with game-breaking mechanics.
If you believe Shoulder the Burden is fine as it is, then there's really nothing more to discuss. We clearly have different perspectives, and at this point, I don't feel the need to continue engaging. I am out! Peace.
EDIT:
Shoulder the Burden is essentially a perma-ban in competitive play now, and for good reason—it’s the strongest possible perk for SWF teams. In a 4-person SWF, this perk allows one player to effectively escape being the target of tunneling, forcing the killer to waste a HUGE amount of time and potentially securing the entire team’s survival. It turns the game into a balancing act for the killer, where they can't afford to focus on anyone for too long. (Slugging will be the new core of competitive).
For 4 solo players, the perk also shines because even if you’re not coordinated, it provides a huge advantage in keeping one person from being targeted. The killer now has to account for more potential hooks and can’t easily shut someone down with a quick 3-hook strategy. This leads to more time spent chasing, more survivors getting off hooks, and overall a much more exhausting match for the killer, making it nearly impossible to win in some cases.
If it’s strong enough to be banned in competitive, and can alter the match to this degree even in solo, that’s a clear indication of how overpowered it is. It’s simply not healthy for the game to have perks that can distort the core balance so drastically. The implications are massive, also for solo play, where the perk shifts the balance heavily in the survivors' favor, turning what should be a challenging fight into an uphill battle for the killer.
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@ratcoffee said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3847284#Comment_3847284
And what I'm saying is that Boil Over builds tend to get all sorts of scrutiny (and the community's most common nickname for 4-flashlight builds is "bully squads"), so I'm confused why you would bring them up when talking about survivor builds that don't get scrutiny.
I get what you're saying, and while builds like Boil Over and flashlight squads get their share of scrutiny, the difference is that these tactics are often still treated as just part of the game, sometimes even seen as "fun" or "memes." On the other hand, perks like Shoulder the Burden are patched in response to complaints about tunneling, and they're potentially game-breaking, but they don't seem to be getting the same level of scrutiny. The balance is skewed, and I think it's worth considering whether these "anti-fun" survivor tactics are equally being looked at from the perspective of fairness.
EDIT:
Do you both think Shoulder the Burden is just fine as it is? If so, then I suppose we’re at an impasse, because I can clearly see the potential implications it has on balance, while it seems like you don’t.