the ghoul experience at high mmr is awful
ghoul was already overrated as ######### before the nerf, but now he's literally just barely has a power. He's just an m1 killer with catchup, that's what he's always been… doesn't matter if he can get the first hit easier, because he is just a basic m1 killer after :/
sure some might say he's good at catching up to survivors and securing another m1 but if the survivor knows pallet spawns (which 90% of higher mmr survivors do) then this is already never going to happen unless your forced to break all the pallets (which is why brutal is so good on him, bc he literally has no chase power)
i mean god dam even legion is better than this, you can activate his power anytime and don't go on a 15 second cooldown everytime you break a pallet, it's easier to injure multiple people at once and killer instinct gives good info. hell he can even down people with his power if you get lucky. idk man this killer is just pathetic rn
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GUYS… BE NICE…
The Killer Experience for 95% of the roster at High MMR is awful. Only a handful can survive up there, that's why you only see Nurse, Blight, Wesker, Spirit, and maybe a rare Singularity or Kaneki up there… and that's why the phrase "Good Survivors" means nothing. Because Good Survivors always end up super hard stuck at High MMR anyway, that's why you hardly ever truly run into a team that the 95% of the Roster really can't handle.
"But Good Survivors" is a pernicious myth of a phrase used to pretend that anyone weaker than the top several Killers (so the majority of everyone in the game) can't be good because well, they aren't Blight, Nurse, Kaneki, Wesker, Spirit, or Singularity. I mean it's so bad that I have seen people claim things about how Killers like Dracula aren't strong against "Good Survivors" (HE HAS EVERYTHING IN ONE KIT HOW IS THAT NOT STRONG?) and Killers like Artist are bad now against "Good Survivors" because they can just hop in lockers to remove the birds. Yeah.
When we're really out here saying Killers like Dracula, Twins, and friggin' ARTIST can struggle against "Good Survivors"? It's time to seriously re-evaluate what balance is and how often we actually see those good Survs. Because odds are it's not very much. If it were, Killers would not hold a 60% success rate overall - something even Trapper achieves.
Yes he deserves buffs at least.
Oh no, Ghoul has to actually put effort in order to win now, however will a killer with amazing map mobility, enraged vaulting speed, a free first hit, and 2 addons that effectively let him play with 6 perks manage
/s
As is the meta in top mmr, grab quad slowdown and hardtunnel someone that isn't the obsession in hopes that they don't have Decisive Strike.
But in terms of playing Kaneki against good survivors, then know that you shouldn't be breaking pallets that can be outplayed wiht M1, or with your power. You won't have the time to break every pallet on the map against good survivors. Kaneki can outplay some strong/god loops with his enraged vault, but others he'll have to break, figure out which loops are which before you mindlessly break every pallet. His enraged vault is his chase power. As is his leaps on some tiles, but not all of them.
Kaneki is far from being weak. Yes he will now have to break pallets at times and that will bring his power into a short cooldown, but that doesn't mean he is weak. His ability to get injures is already strong. Then there is his abiltiy to get from one point on the map to another within seconds, giving him huge map pressure.
Lastly, his ability to catch up to injured survivors with his power is indeed still strong. Even the best survivors won't magically have pallets or windows at their disposal wherever they are, especially if you have broken some pallets already.
And if we are talking about highest mmr survivors, we also have to consider the highest mmr killer player playing Kaneki, who surely knows when to chase someone and when to drop chases, based on a survivors position and where pallets are still left. And dropping chases with Kaneki is insanely easy considering his insane mobility.
If anything, he still needs a few small nerfs to really make him fair and balanced. There is a reason why still so many survivor players dislike going against him.
If he just got reverted to his release version, but had Wesker's slow cooldowns on his power, I'd take that. The changes they've done to this killer have just ruined him. "Oh, but 10,000+ hour players can be so strong with him!" Yes, but if you limit what he can do to that specific subset of players, you've essentially killed him. He was great design upon release because players could play him and have access to 90% of his tech, including console players. I keep seeing people say, "He gets the first injure too easily." That is part of his power, as it is with Legion's. If he's just a power crept Legion, then make Legion better. Or just accept that Ghoul gets an easy injure + mobility, and Legion gets an easy injure but has the 5th-Frenzy downing potential. Ghoul can't down with his power; that's the trade-off.
Was the auto-aim on his power a bit ridiculous at the start? Sure. But what does it matter? If you're out-positioned, and he bounds to you and you're right there, he is supposed to get that injure on you. Arguing otherwise is saying the same thing that's justified against other mobility killers like Hillbilly and ranged killers like Huntress, "Oh, I know the killer made a perfect play, after survivor made a mistake. But the survivor should still have a chance to dodge (and get away for free), up until the very last second." And that's what this game has become. Fov techs and auto-aim to walls and pallets are still a thing, because the survivor-handholding aim and hitbox that these killers have is terrible. You should have got the hit or the down, but the devs say, "No. The survivors should still be able to trump you."
Pretty sure those who do great with current kaneki can do lot better with any other better mobility killers
That's pretty patronizing. I thought his points were valid, especially when the killer role is struggling* to find strength and variety. There have been times when I've played Ghoul and thought to myself "I'd rather play Legion." Legion doesn't lose access to his power, which is the point of picking the killer, just for doing basic game functions like kicking pallets. Ghoul was played over Legion by far because he had greater potential* to be strong and win. But after this torrent of nerfs against him, and now with MORE anti-camp and -tunnel to come? I really don't know anymore.
He'll have to break pallets at times, which makes him a 115% M1, and if the survivors keep getting to pallets, which they will because he has no catch-up ability after breaking pallets, then he stays that way. I don't even have to explain why that's unviable. You can break 80% of a map's pallets, and it doesn't matter because the match is basically over at that point. If the survivors run to a dead zone over and over to give easy downs, then that's on them.
If Ghoul is as strong as you say he is, then he shouldn't have to drop chases to beat survivors. He would just keep chasing and get them, right? And dropping chases is never the easy thing to do. You've already spent time chasing the survivor, and have probably just used your power, so it's on cooldown as you're traversing the map. Assuming you do have your power, traversing the map with it means you don't have it when starting your next chase, giving the survivors a free big start on you.
Saying he needs more nerfS is insane. He may* need 1 nerf, which has to do with his kidnap tech (I think they call it that?). Because this is the counterplay I've been preaching all along: If he's going to bound in front of you and cut you off, you should be able to position your body in front of where he wants to go, so that he can't do that. The problem is that sometimes you do that, and he still blocks you off, because it's almost like he warps through you slightly, or slides past you like you're covered in butter, yet then has a huge body blocking hitbox, and downs you. I would make it to where his hitbox during his bounds and while not bounding is consistently big, at least in regards to colliding with the survivors' bodies (and simultaneously don't apply it to colliding with the environment. They've done this with Victor's pounce, and the opposite with Wesker's dash). Or fix whatever "high velocity overrules survivor hitbox" thing is going on. It's one of those theories. Again, I'm not certain what causes it. But that's the 1 thing I'd say with him that needs to go.
As soon as i got up to high mmr with xeno he felt pretty useless too. High mmr SWF > killer > soloque.
To say that Kaneki was overrated and just a better Legion is just wildly untrue and Im sure many will agree that still applies after the nerfs. Killers nowadays also dont have trouble finding strength and variety since Id say most of the cast can hold their own in most games. Not every game is a 4 man SWF, nor are they these absolute god gamers who've never seen the sun.
Kaneki having a short cooldown on his power after kicking a pallet is also valid because he has a power that can cover roughly 40 meters in an instant, and you can then hit over small obstacles. The only thing I see Legion doing better than Ken is information, but the positives of everything else basically makes him worthless.
Also to touch on anti camp and anti tunnel, this is a good thing. No one likes to tunnel or camp, they just feel like its necessary depending on the situation. Now imagine a world where it wasnt necessary to do so, itd just be more fun for everyone
What us player imagine: Reward Killers for spreading hooks, making match fun for everyone.
What BHVR is doing: Eliminates tunnel/camp into the ground with zero compensation for Killers.
Mark my word, with these Devs, 99.9% it's gonna be like this.
right,
Ghouls is good where he is. Learn to play
Would really like to see you playing ghoul at high mmr.
I have actually gone back to Legion myself haha
Pretty sure those great with Kaneki are decent enough at Killer in general to do well even without playing a Mobility Killer.
Breaking pallets indeed makes him an M1 killer for a few seconds. Survivors can make it to more pallets after that but not always. Especially if you have already broken some pallets, you can get even good survivors to not reach more resources in time.
Not to mention that maps nowadays have a good amount of mindgameable pallets as well, which Kaneki doesn't have to break to get a hit at.
Also, dropping chase with Ghoul is arguably pretty easy, because of how fast he can get from one point to another, and how easy it is for him to injure survivors. Kaneki has map pressure like few other killers.
His kidnap tech definitely needs to be fixed, but I believe he might need two more small nerfs until he is in a perfectly balanced state.
Little is going to change if they just reward killers for spreading hooks. There will still be enough killer players that will tunnel and camp because of how easy it is to do. Tunneling and camping need to be nerfed in impactful ways, it's the only way.
I am of course not against a few killer improvements as compensation, but in my opinion killers have already been seeing more and more improvements over the last year, making tunneling and camping not that necessary anymore, even against good survivors. I never tunnel or camp and do fairly well in my killer matches.