[Trickster Rework]

-Unlimited knives

-Opening lockers gives him 15s of main event

Comments

  • Well if your intention is to make Trickster absolutely broken then yeah, thats a good way to do it.

  • Giving him unlimited knives discourages skill. Just spray spray spray spray spray, no need to aim because theres no consequences. Huntress I could maybe understand, because she is super punished for missing each one. But not trickster.

    The main event rework sounds clunky and unfair too. You didnt provide any cooldown or limitations on how much he could proc it. Just open a locker, and you can activate main event within 15 seconds. Right now main event rewards landing your knives with a burst of lethality, this rework would take away that design philosophy and replace it with something worse imo.

    My trickster rework idea goes like this:

    • Is now 4.6m/s
    • Main event is no longer time gated to activate but takes longer to charge, like 20% more
    • Now takes 5 knives to down instead of 6
  • No, just no!

    I agree with @nars way of a Trickster rework (or rather QoL change). It sounds way better from a balance standpoint.

    I would also add if you need one less blade to injure/down a survivor, then the base throw rate has to be slightly toned down as well to offset some annoyance.

  • ...well it would certainly make him better I'll give you that

  • Damn, machine gun Trickster?

    It's some time since I have seen something this broken.

  • @nars said:

    Giving him unlimited knives discourages skill. Just spray spray spray spray spray, no need to aim because theres no consequences. Huntress I could maybe understand, because she is super punished for missing each one. But not trickster.

    The main event rework sounds clunky and unfair too. You didnt provide any cooldown or limitations on how much he could proc it. Just open a locker, and you can activate main event within 15 seconds. Right now main event rewards landing your knives with a burst of lethality, this rework would take away that design philosophy and replace it with something worse imo.

    My trickster rework idea goes like this:

    • Is now 4.6m/s
    • Main event is no longer time gated to activate but takes longer to charge, like 20% more
    • Now takes 5 knives to down instead of 6

    being 4.6 m/s discourages you from using knives. after all, why bother shooting 6 knives for an injure if m1 is just as good? yes recovery is short for knives but... not worth it if it takes longer. In the end, they need keep buffing throwing mode statistics to improve trickster. that is kinda why all ranged killer are 110% m/s. I believe one the reasons was to encourage using the ability. now if only BVHR made abilities worth using it... /shrug.

  • @nars said:

    Giving him unlimited knives discourages skill. Just spray spray spray spray spray, no need to aim because theres no consequences. Huntress I could maybe understand, because she is super punished for missing each one. But not trickster.

    The main event rework sounds clunky and unfair too. You didnt provide any cooldown or limitations on how much he could proc it. Just open a locker, and you can activate main event within 15 seconds. Right now main event rewards landing your knives with a burst of lethality, this rework would take away that design philosophy and replace it with something worse imo.

    My trickster rework idea goes like this:

    • Is now 4.6m/s
    • Main event is no longer time gated to activate but takes longer to charge, like 20% more
    • Now takes 5 knives to down instead of 6

    Not played him myself, but watching others play him, the 30s activation window on Main Event always seemed pretty harsh to me... the number of times I saw people desperately looking for someone to use Main Event on and spending it throwing knives at the air makes him look... pretty frustrating to play :/

    Also feel his kunai hits never looked great... it's like slowly chipping someone down, so you never get a nice satisfying meaty chunk when you hit someone.

    I'd like it more if he had a throw rate at ~0.4, but threw 3 kunai at a time in a narrow fan. If you hit dead centre, you'll get all 3 to hit, good shots will get you get 2 hits, clips only get 1. If nothing else, it'd be a cool add on, but when you get that 3 hit meat shot, it'd feel satisfying AF.

    Combine that with your Main Event suggestion, you'd feel like you have some cool variety to your gameplay.

  • @Devil_hit11 said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3480028#Comment_3480028

    being 4.6 m/s discourages you from using knives. after all, why bother shooting 6 knives for an injure if m1 is just as good? yes recovery is short for knives but... not worth it if it takes longer. In the end, they need keep buffing throwing mode statistics to improve trickster. that is kinda why all ranged killer are 110% m/s. I believe one the reasons was to encourage using the ability. now if only BVHR made abilities worth using it... /shrug.

    He isnt truly a ranged killer. Slinger and huntress can actually snipe consistently with skill, trickster cant. its unreasonable to expect him to be effective at the same ranges as huntress and slinger. hes more of an extended melee antilooper than a ranged killer. He needs 4.6m/s to actually chase well, because he needs to get multiple opportunities to land knives while huntress and slinger just need one. So him being 4.6m/s opens more scenarios like that and gives him decent mobility.

  • @nars said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3480175#Comment_3480175

    He isnt truly a ranged killer. Slinger and huntress can actually snipe consistently with skill, trickster cant. its unreasonable to expect him to be effective at the same ranges as huntress and slinger. hes more of an extended melee antilooper than a ranged killer. He needs 4.6m/s to actually chase well, because he needs to get multiple opportunities to land knives while huntress and slinger just need one. So him being 4.6m/s opens more scenarios like that and gives him decent mobility.

    hes more of an extended melee antilooper than a ranged killer.

    extended melee anti-loop.. hmm I think that's more slinger right? he has to reel you in and m1? I think I disagree. he is as much of range killer as huntress is. I just think that the drawback of needing more hits and drawback of needing longer window of opportunities means that between other range killers. he spends more time in throwing mode compare to other two. this means that he stays at 96%->92% m/s making him much easier to LOS. The more hits also means he takes longer of windows of opportunity to get the injury which compounds problem further. when I've played against tricksters as survivor, some of them use those trick-blades. the bouncing type blades to try hit you behind corners but in my experience when using them, the bounces look so random that I don't see much of pattern with them. they're not that hard to outplay if you know what to expect as survivor. some have suggest trick-blades being base-kit. I think if trick-blades had like homing-type effect and more predictable bounce then I could see trick-blades maybe being good to improve his strength.

    I think his range is disproportionate worse then other two killers because the more knives you throw, the slower you become so you kinda get punished for hitting knives and missing knives. You know, the idea of being double-punished. For example, if you start throwing knives at 16 meters, by the time you get an injury, the survivor swaying side to side will be at 20 meters gaining distance. that is why the effective range for him is something like 10 meters which almost m1 distance because you have to take into account the m/s loss from throwing knives as you injure survivors. I think the reason you think his range is not good is because of this problem that he has in his kit. It is like his artificial range is reduced if that makes any sense to the point that it is almost only effective in m1 range. I am not exactly trickster main though. that is just something I noticed when I was learning trickster at basic-intermediate level when playing him.