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My wish list on basekit change

C3Tooth C3Tooth
in Feedback and Suggestions

Spawn placement:

  • Survivors spawn at 2 Gates, 2 at each Gate.
  • Killer spawns at minimum 50m away from each Gate, able to see Gate aura
  • Killer with power bar starts with power cooldown


Killer basekit:

  • Corrupted Intervention 30sec basekit
  • After hook a survivor, the least hook survivors shows their aura for 4sec. So if the first survivor hooked, the other 3' aura show...
  • New mechanic: special totems. Killers have 3 basekit totems around the map (different from Hag's totems). After 5 Gens done, special totems activated. This is to add more objective for survivors, that they can skip and rush Gen if losing, or cleanse totems to weaken Killers in end game.

1 of them gain Killers 1% speed + number of survivor alive (if 4 alive, Killers gain 5% speed), remove speed from Noed

1 of them gain Killers 4sec on Gate + number of survivor alive x2 (if 4 alive, Killers gain 12sec on Gate)

1 of them gain Killers 0sec on survivors' aura + number of survivor alive x2 (if 1 alive, shows 0sec aura, if 4 alive, shows 8sec aura)


Survivor basekit:

  • DS 3sec basekit, activate on both hook. DS perk increase to 5sec. DS disable if healthy.
  • Gain simple command chat stamps: Im going for unhooking ; Im going for killer's objective....
  • 4 survivors have 75% Gen strength efficient instead of 100% strength, 3 survivors alive have 135%, 2 survivors have 200%
  • After hooked, Entity shows up and spawn survivor to another hook (like PH's cage), disable when 5 Gens done


Gen:

  • Gen time decreased to 80sec
  • Increase the Gen spawn to 8
  • The number of Gen required to open Gates is 2 + number of alive survivors

4 alive requires 6 Gens, 2 alive requires 4 Gens. This is to let Killer consider either last hook a survivor at 5 Gen done and power gate, or slug them and keep pressure.



My ideas are just to make the Gens dont go too fast, and its harder to tunneling and camping, or less reason to tunnel because it benefits survivors.

Comments

  • ShroudedGhostFace ShroudedGhostFace

    You want me to start the match as Ghostface with my power on cooldown? That sounds terrible, so that’s a big no from me.

    30 seconds of Corrupt isn’t going to do much for weaker killers but will break the game for strong killers like Nurse, Blight, or Spirit.

    DS doesn’t need to be basekit, it just needs to be buffed. If DS is basekit, a slug meta will probably happen.

    Some of your ideas are cool and could make for some really interesting gameplay but there’s a lot of them I disagree with.

  • C3Tooth C3Tooth

    @ShroudedGhostFace said:

    You want me to start the match as Ghostface with my power on cooldown? That sounds terrible, so that’s a big no from me.

    30 seconds of Corrupt isn’t going to do much for weaker killers but will break the game for strong killers like Nurse, Blight, or Spirit.

    DS doesn’t need to be basekit, it just needs to be buffed. If DS is basekit, a slug meta will probably happen.

    Some of your ideas are cool and could make for some really interesting gameplay but there’s a lot of them I disagree with.

    The only thing survivors get in my idea is DS and it isnt a good idea…

  • ShroudedGhostFace ShroudedGhostFace

    @C3Tooth said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3414296#Comment_3414296

    The only thing survivors get in my idea is DS and it isnt a good idea…

    You said you want to have 80 second gens and teleporting hooks, what do you mean the DS is the only thing survivors would get? Lmao.

    To combat tunneling, why not basekit OTR or basekit Guardian? I think Unbreakable should probably be buffed too. Your teleporting hook idea is really interesting, I wonder how much of an impact it would have

  • C3Tooth C3Tooth

    @ehe said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/374050/my-wish-list-on-basekit-change

    Most of this is alright with me, except a few things.

    • killer gate spawn mechanic would make it too easy to pinpoint killer location
    • the hook teleport just makes the game more annoying for the killer. I get its to nerf camping entirely, but sometimes camping is all you can do (endgame, all gens done everyones alive etc). We shouldnt remove a strat just because its being abused.
    • 8 gens is too much for plenty to patrol
    • The 2+alive survs punishes killer for winning, even if not tunneling.
    • Basekit DS? Absolutely not. Anti tunnel or not, thats absurd. DS is already a free second chance against non uber mobile killers with the only counterplay being to not pick (which is good, combats tunnel). This on every survivor? On every hook? just no.
    • Surv chat stamps - too much info, and unneeded. SoloQ might be pain but removing the lack of info the games built on isnt a good idea.
    • Killer power bar insta cooldown - Blight has to wait like, 16 full seconds just to play his killer. poor ghostie too, and all the other long cooldown killers. Theres a reason only killers like sadako and dredge have this feature, bc the game would be too easy at the start otherwise.
    • Surv auras after hooks - theres not really a point to this. Tunnelers will tunnel, and people who dont still won't. Kind of punishes the survivors playing the best, by having their location revealed because their teammate lost chase.
    • Gen time decrease combined with a near total lack of regression perks, no thanks.
    • Special totems really don't do much and just complicate the game for no real purpose. Should just be a perk.

    You read so many thing wrong. so...many...thing...wrong.

    I mean, I dont even want to point out what's wrong and how wrong it is.

  • C3Tooth C3Tooth

    @ShroudedGhostFace said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3414340#Comment_3414340

    You said you want to have 80 second gens and teleporting hooks, what do you mean the DS is the only thing survivors would get? Lmao.

    To combat tunneling, why not basekit OTR or basekit Guardian? I think Unbreakable should probably be buffed too. Your teleporting hook idea is really interesting, I wonder how much of an impact it would have

    You said you want to have 80 second gens and teleporting hooks, what do you mean the DS is the only thing survivors would get? Lmao.

    Let me retype for you, again, read slowly:

    • Gen time decreased to 80sec
    • Increase the Gen spawn to 8

    4 alive requires 6 Gens -4 alive requires 6 Gens -4 alive requires 6 Gens

    Im not good at math, but 90x5 is definitely < 80x6


    To combat tunneling, why not basekit OTR or basekit Guardian? I think Unbreakable should probably be buffed too. Your teleporting hook idea is really interesting, I wonder how much of an impact it would have

    OTR can be disable with hit off hook. Its already a thing with basekit BT.

    • After hooked, Entity shows up and spawn survivor to another hook (like PH's cage), disable when 5 Gens done

    Disable when 5 Gens done -Disable when 5 Gens done -Disable when 5 Gens done. Edit: it should be disable when Gates are powered.

  • Emeal Emeal

    There is no way we can get all of these within years. and I hate these suggestions on tunneling/ Camping.

    It just makes Tunneling too hard as a strategy.

    We should push bHVR hard on one of your ideas tho, I think the most important rn is

    • Gain simple command chat stamps: Im going for unhooking ; Im going for killer's objective....

    Survivors need this 100% even if SoloQ don't need more help. Its QoL which is still needed for Survivor.

  • C3Tooth C3Tooth

    @Emeal said:

    There is no way we can get all of these within years. and I hate these suggestions on tunneling/ Camping.

    It just makes Tunneling too hard as a strategy.

    We should push bHVR hard on one of your ideas tho, I think the most important rn is

    • Gain simple command chat stamps: Im going for unhooking ; Im going for killer's objective....

    Survivors need this 100% even if SoloQ don't need more help. Its QoL which is still needed for Survivor.

    My point is to completely remove Gen rush, tunneling, camping. And certain they would only soften it, not removing.

    Im not asking for any of these to happens, only to tell my ideas.

  • Emeal Emeal

    @C3Tooth said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3414504#Comment_3414504

    My point is to completely remove Gen rush, tunneling, camping. And certain they would only soften it, not removing.

    Im not asking for any of these to happens, only to tell my ideas.

    I know, Im telling you why I think they are bad ideas cause they limit the freedom of ways the Killer can play by actively preventing or putting in little mechanics to actively make those strategies harder to do. I don't want to only play one way or have made the "official good way" the only viable strategy.

    The way I would fix tunneling/ Camping is with new mechanics, turning those things into gameplay with counter play options.

    @Emeal said:

    In this thread its all about the concept of adding new gameplay to stale undesired gameplay outcomes.

    So its a tale as old as this game, that Camping and Tunneling is less desirable to interact with. But I think we can all agree that if we look at the game as it is, its sorta the most logically standoff we can end up having with the game as it is now. If a Killer sets it in his mind they want a specific Survivors dead, they can Camp/ Tunnel /Repeat, Survivors are on the bad side of that, there isn't much gameplay around it. I think this is bad.

    So with this thread I want to hear your creativity to think of ways we can level to playing field between Survivors and Killers in a Camping situation with adding Gameplay elements around Camping and Tunneling.

    Now a Gameplay Element is a thing that a player does something with, Example: flashlights it takes skill to use and you can blind the Killer and save your friend. Ofc not without risk. A thing that isn't a gameplay Element is like PyramidHead's cages, which can relocate should PH get too close to them, This isn't a Gameplay element (its an automatic system) because nothing is played in doing it, he just walks in and it happens, no counter play from Survivors.

    For the sake of this thread, We will assume bHVR can create a system of detection that can check if a Killer is Face Camping and check if a Killer is tunneling a recently unhooked Survivor. Now we can design new Gameplay Elements that can give proper, not passive counter play to Face Camping and Tunneling.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Here are MY Ideas on how bHVR could implement gameplay to counter Camping/Tunneling, but someone more keen could probably do better.

    THE KILLER TACKLE

    So the system is in effect, the Bubba is detected as FaceCamping this should unlock a Survivor mode called "desperate action" while in this mode I think the other Survivors should be able to tackle the Killer to stun them and cause a Power cooldown of X seconds. Ofc. the Killer might hit you, which would be bad, but an attack can be baited out and then tackle the Killer. This should allow for plenty of counter play.

    These desperate actions are for the other Survivors, not the Target.

    Now desperate actions with one other Survivor alone trying to save their teammate would not be very effective, likely you would leave wounded. That would be a regular trade, like normal. But two other Survivors could do it, allowing for two stuns. Two stuns would allow the unhooked to run the farthest, three max for a face camping situation if all three survivors join in. So the more Survivors who join, the more painful it will be for the Killer to FaceCamp.

    KILLER BLOCKING

    So the system is in effect, the Wraith is detected as being a Tunneler. What this means is that we can put another "desperate action" so why not something that makes it easier to body block the Killer, spread your arms and block the Killers path so the targeted survivor can escape easier. This would work by pressing a button when looping near a Killer that is chasing a tunneled and the survivors will face the killer and extend their arms making their hit box to the Killer bigger.

    If this can only be done near the Killer, It wont look like you are asserting your dominance in front of the Killer.

    https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/8L32XZM9JFS6/image.png

    Cool Cosmetic Jeff.

    I also think Survivors should have the ability to throw items at the Killer as a "desperate action" if they are tunneling. But this post is getting long already, if you think its worth hearing let me know.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Common Critiques of this approach I have gotten:

    Why add such an elaborate System to fix FaceCamping, lol just do an automatic solution that forces it. Dont waste bHVR's time with development, Just force the Killer away/ our or ban from FaceCamping.

    1. This game is a game and that means we are supposed to play the scenario. This also means we should be allowed counter play, My Philosophy here is that this should be the way of dealing with the issue.
    2. I respect the Killer's part of this game, if they chose to try FaceCamping I think we as players should respect their choice. They have agency and they have made their mind up that is commendable, It is fine if they want to dig the heels in and hold the game, but that does not mean Survivors should have no counterplay or that all the cards should be in the Killer's Hand. This is why I think bHVR should do this.
    3. I believe in the setting, the Slasher Horror setting this game is trying to emulate. The classic movie situation of a victim trying to escape the Killer, blood, sweat and tears. I believe Survivors can get killed by not outsmarting the Killer and the Killer can kill them based on agreed upon rules of the game, but things should happen naturally in this Slasher Theme, not by fake hand holding systems.

    An Automatic Solution to FaceCamping and Tunneling is not a play, it does not respect the Killer's choice/agency or the Survivor's mistakes with the rules and its very fake and hand-holding, I don't feel like it feels like it is in theme with what I believe the Game is trying to emulate. This is why my Suggestion is the way it is.

    This is so OP for Survivors, you are making them so Strong.

    This may be true, but if so bHVR can buff Killers again. I believe this game would be better served by more gameplay, more options for its players in the long run than not giving Survivors adequate counter gameplay.

    Thanks for reading this.

    At least that sounds way better to me, than limiting choice and agency.

  • BlightedDolphin BlightedDolphin

    Interesting ideas but this would just encourage killers to slug and not kill anyone to keep the gen penalty up.

  • C3Tooth C3Tooth

    @Emeal said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3414517#Comment_3414517

    I know, Im telling you why I think they are bad ideas cause they limit the freedom of ways the Killer can play by actively preventing or putting in little mechanics to actively make those strategies harder to do. I don't want to only play one way or have made the "official good way" the only viable strategy.

    The way I would fix tunneling/ Camping is with new mechanics, turning those things into gameplay with counter play options.

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/373619/bhvr-should-solve-camping-and-tunneling-by-adding-counterplay-gameplay-elements-to-the-game

    At least that sounds way better to me, than limiting choice and agency.

    I understand you're aiming to make tunneling to have more counter to make the game interacting, but it would only work on SWF, I play Solo only and doubt teammates can coordinate tackle killer to save me.

    @BlightedDolphin said:

    Interesting ideas but this would just encourage killers to slug and not kill anyone to keep the gen penalty up.

    I've thought of that, but the number can be changed.

    To be fair, if killer is already 8 hooks and 5 Gen done, they can last hook someone (assume Gate powered only after finish sacrificing which takes time), with basekit BBQ, Killer can easily find another survivor to make chase, slug and go for the 3rd one (assume base Totem that show survivors' aura after Gates powered).

    My ideas would never waste killers' time in finding survivors, ever. Keep them start new chase instantly.

  • DaddyMyers_Mori DaddyMyers_Mori

    I like spawn system, it would basically fix random "genrush".

    Corrupt and totem are not needed and would make game harder for new players, which is not good.


    -DS works only if killer doesn't know about it, so not good.

    -I would like to see command system.

    -I talked before why it's bad idea, lazy to do it again.

    -bad idea, removes lot of pressure. Survivors would often insta unhook, which sucks. What's point of basement? There is better fix for camping.

    Gen changes make it really overcomplicated. They can do them up to 200% faster and need less of them? It doesn't make sense for lore at all.


    So basically: spawn + commands yes

    Camping different fix

    Rest is bad

  • Emeal Emeal

    @C3Tooth said:

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3414519#Comment_3414519

    I understand you're aiming to make tunneling to have more counter to make the game interacting, but it would only work on SWF, I play Solo only and doubt teammates can coordinate tackle killer to save me.

    https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3415251#Comment_3415251

    I've thought of that, but the number can be changed.

    To be fair, if killer is already 8 hooks and 5 Gen done, they can last hook someone (assume Gate powered only after finish sacrificing which takes time), with basekit BBQ, Killer can easily find another survivor to make chase, slug and go for the 3rd one (assume base Totem that show survivors' aura after Gates powered).

    My ideas would never waste killers' time in finding survivors, ever. Keep them start new chase instantly.

     I play Solo only and doubt teammates can coordinate tackle killer to save me.

    I agree, soloQ could do with some work in teaching survivors when to unhook and when to not.

    Like how basekit borrowed time just encourages survivors to rip the killer off the hook regardless of where the Killer is.

    its a mess right now.

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