Evidently Very Controversial. Should Killers Be Able to See Survivors in Lobby?
EDIT: Apologies for the fact that the post title no longer accurately reflects the point it's making, but I felt it would be too confusing to change it.
So this was a bit of a hot topic in this discussion
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/84270/weaponizing-dcs-a-long-term-worry#latest
and it got me thinking, maybe we ought to talk about whether it's fair for killers to be able to see survivors in the lobby and adapt their loadout make decisions accordingly. Using this information, killers are able to decide whether they want to dodge the lobby or not. All survivors have to work with is the killer's ping, which is why it's not uncommon for a survivor to get into a match, find out the killer and their build, and, being now equipped with a similar level of information to what the killer had back in the lobby, decide they don't want to play the game and disconnects.
Let me be clear: I am not condoning dodging games in any way. I think it's unsportsmanlike, and I acknowledge there is a huge difference in terms of consequences for other players between lobby dodging and dc'ing.
But there's a reason why they do it, and perhaps that reason should be addressed.
It seems fair to me that survivors and killers receive the same amount of information from the start. Allowing survivors the same amount of information the killer already has (being able to see the killer in the lobby, essentially) would most likely reduce dcs, since survivors, like killers, would just dodge a lobby they don't like the look of instead (which is not ideal but less harmful than disconnecting ingame). However, and I'm going to put this bit in bold so no one goes off on me for suggesting something so stupid, I agree that that is a ludicrous idea and hardly worth suggesting - so I'm not suggesting it.
What I am suggesting is that perhaps it would be beneficial if the survivors were also hidden from the killer in the lobby. I'm aware it wouldn't do anything to reduce dc's, but it would even out the dodging playing field a bit more so that no one could justify ingame dcs by claiming that they were only doing the survivor equivalent of a killer lobby dodge - which is not an excuse by any means, but I think it is a fair point to be made. If both parties have the same information to begin with, the implicit agreement between them when beginning a game, in my opinion, is more solidly grounded.
EDIT: Leaving that last part in for context, but editing the OP since apparently no one bothers to read the comments on these things anymore.
Upon further discussion in the thread below, I have concluded that although hiding at least some information in the pregame lobby may or may not be beneficial, the concern is not with killers seeing the survivor lineup and preparing accordingly, but with seeing the lineup and dodging the lobby without penalty because they don't want to go against that build. If survivors later reach the same conclusion about the killer based on their build, they have to DC from the game and screw everyone else over, risking a ban at the same time.
The idea I'm proposing now is one which would come into effect once ping (the only legitimate reason to dodge a lobby) is no longer an issue. In this scenario, lobby dodgers and DCers would both be punished by being banned from queuing for a certain amount of time, say 60 seconds to start with, and then the time would increase if they do it more often within a certain time period (24 hours, say). So if you continually dodge lobbies or DC, you would eventually be unable to join the queue again for up to an hour or two.
Additionally, a harsher penalty (risk of ban, similar to DC rules now) would be in place for those whose DC screws other people over significantly. For killers, this means any time after the first minute or so of gameplay, since the game depends on their presence, and them leaving halfway through or towards the end of a game is unfair and a huge waste of time for survivors. For survivors, they would be penalised any time they DC while on a hook, on the ground, or being carried, because these situations (a) are particularly unfair to the killer and (b) tend to be done for strategic reasons to give the team a leg-up or ruin a killer's slugging strategy, which is likewise unfair.
So feel free to comment on these ideas, I'm sure there's stuff I haven't considered, but please, no one wants to read a dozen different people saying the exact same thing about killers needing to prepare in the lobby. It has been said, and understood. No need to beat a dead horse. Let's talk about something new and interesting instead.
Comments
I don't understand your point?
How does seeing someones profile help someone determine whether others are toxic? Killers mostly dodge "SWF" simply if the players load in together. Hiding profiles from the killers does NOTHING except stop killers targeting certain players.
the only one protecting toxicity is you.
You are a lost cause. Just get back to your Ochido marathon.
You can't refute my point so obviously I must watch Ochido, good job on actually being the toxic one.
I did numerous times you just failed to read them.
No you didn't, you didn't give one benefit to seeing profiles and just said it prevents SWF.
When we all know killers dodge SWF based on load times, people who are actually hiding that they're SWF hide their friendslist for extra measure.
and if people put their names to something similar they certainly aren't hiding the fact they're SWF.
Literally 0 benefit to letting killers see profiles other than toxic benefits like hunting someone down by checking if they've changed their names.
imagine pretending you've made relevant points when all you've said is "GO BE AN OCHIDO FANBOY REEEEEEE"
Yet another brag of on sided players. Killers should actually see who is in swf and there should be penalty for dodging.
Why make the game balanced so that killers don't have a reason to dodge when you can simply punish killers for lobby dodging? People who make this suggestion should start to play killer seriously for a while (that doesn't mean occasional matches on yellow ranks).
If killers weren't allowed to dodge lobbies anymore, survivors would start to bring a full loadout of toolboxes or several insta-heals every match. And for a killer, it would not make sense to play these matches. A lot of people would simply stop playing killer, and then the survivor queues would become insanely long and then a big part of the playerbase leaves.
You just call people ochido fanboys or whatever while you yourself say stuff like "most survivors are toxic" and have some sort of hate boner for youtubers/streamers?
You either have an extremely loose definition of the term toxic, or fell for the negativity bias trap hook, line and sinker. Either work on your persecution complex or quit the game for your own good.
There's little point in showing names and profiles. Anyone that's any smart at all will just avoid matching names/cosmetics and make their friends list/profile private if they genuinely want to grief. And that's without bringing up cringy garbage like killers putting people on their "mori list" or survivors putting other survivors on their "sandbag/do not save list" based on their names.
Meh, at most I'd say Killers shouldn't be able to see the profile names and link to their profiles for Survivors. Not a huge deal though.
Only positive of removing seeing the Survivor is those ANNOYING Leatherface players who switch to him when they see a Jake to face camp him "cause I need the cosmetic." Makes you feel punished for not being another Meg/Nea/Claud.
People actually thinking access to names and profiles is necessary..