We're Gonna Throw Forever needs to be changed
Imagine if it worked like BBQ & Chili.
It gives survivors tokens to potentially double their Bloodpoints while gently promoting them to not gen-rush (tunneling equivalent) nor stealth near a gen and simply wait for the Killer to leave (camping equivalent).
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We're Gonne Live Forever - After repairing a generator for at least 3 seconds, it will be highlighted to you with a yellow aura. The generator stays highlighted until fully repaired, or you repair a new generator, or the Killer damages the generator.
- When the Killer damages the generator, your Scratch Marks are hidden for 10 seconds and all generator's auras are revealed to you when they are more than 40 meters from the damaged generator.
- After the first great Skill Check on a generator, gain a 25% stackable bonus to all Bloodpoint gains up to a maximum of 50% / 75% / 100%.
- The bonus Bloodpoints are only awarded post-trial.
Comments
Its fine as it is tbh
As a killer like you, I agree. Let them continue to throw themselves in front of me for Protection Hits; I enjoy the free pressure the survivors put on themselves trying to get stacks.
As a solo survivor, my fellow teammates disagree. They don't enjoy the fact that as soon as they're injured I come running over and wait for them to get downed. They could lead the killer on a chase for another minute just fine while I waste time waiting nearby and not doing gens, but if I don't rush there right away then I could very well miss my chance to get tokens.
When they go down I bodyblock the killer on the way to the hook. They wiggle free thanks to Breakout, and I get hooked with 2 tokens. After being unhooked and healed up, I do it again, but Mettle of Man stops me from going down the 2nd time. We both get away and I have 4 tokens. Then it's a matter of doing as much repairs as I can to get Objective points before the match ends, because 2 x very little Bloodpoints = little Bloodpoints.
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It's all good on paper, but still risky AF to pull off, and even if I do pull it off, I still struggle to get enough Bloodpoints to make the doubling worthwhile. Meanwhile, to my team it looks like I'm pretty much throwing the match.
The Killer gets a ton of Bloodpoints for just playing the game, plus BBQ rewards them double Bloodpoints for just playing the game.
The Survivors get less Bloodpoints (and even far less if camped & tunneled out of the game early), yet WGLF does not give them tokens for doing their objectives and instead makes them throw the match.
I use it a lot on survivor for extra bp for unhooks and i guess unhooking other survivors isnt an objective
Only 1 person can get the unhook. It creates a race against other survivors, and it promotes the Killer camping.
If I got a token for being within 16 meters of the hook when a Survivor is unhooked, then I wouldn't have to use the Breakout build for tokens.
Tbh the only change i think it needs is gaining tokens when you heal survivors
It's a good idea because it really is.
Everyone goes to save only for their own benefit
It is necessary to make it so that they would be charged for the generators
After all, the killer's goal is to hang on the hook, and the survivors have to repair the generators
This perk should have absolutely nothing to do with generators. At all.
Unhooking survivors is as much of an "objective" for the survivors as breaking pallets is an objective for the killer, yet BBQ doesn't work around pallets.
Then BBQ should have nothing to do with hooks. The Killer should have to go out of their way to do something else for tokens
I have no problem running WGLF. Going for unhooks and protection hits doesn't necessarily mean throwing the game.
The fact that you have multiple ways of gaining stacks means you're not forced to do any one specific thing.
I usually just prioritise unhooks (with BT and Kindred) and if I don't have 4 hooks by endgame then I'll try to get the protection hits at the exit gate. Sometimes protection hits just happen in the natural course of the game.
If the killer is camping, that's 2 stacks guaranteed.
Kilers have 2 objectives: hooks and gen defence.
Survivors have 2 objectives: gens and rescuing teammates.
See how they complement each other?
Both BBQ and WGLF deal with primary objectives. The hook related ones.
BBQ discourages camping, it's a healthy perk.
The alternative you suggest would target the gen related objectives.
A killer perk that gives you a stack every time you kick a gen.
A survivor perk that gives you a stack every time you repair a gen.
It doesn't take a genius to realise those actions are significantly easier and less risky than the hook related objectives.
Tbh I thing WGLF is fine as is, promoting altruistic behaviour. It would be nice if it gave a stack for picking up survivors though.
Why would it have nothing to do with hooks? Don't you want the killer to go around and hook EVERYONE instead of camping and tunneling?
Your idea rewards the Survivors for something the KILLER does (kick generators). That doesn't make any sense at all.
Also, We're Gonna Live Forever is a perk about healing. What about doing gens for more bloodpoints has anything to do with healing, or living forever?
Then have WGLF gain a token every time a gen pops. 20% per token, up to 100%. Doesn't matter who finishes the gen. Then it will be like BBQ and double the survivors points for just playing the game.
there are 2 teams of killer and survivor
Why does the villain get double blood points?
And the survivors are only individually
Then let this perk act like an aura !!! Who was within a radius of 40 meters will receive a token
Otherwise, the race begins who will save
What do you mean? All players get their BP bonuses individually.
Killer running BBQ = one player getting up to 100% BP bonus.
Survivor running WGLF = one player getting up to 100% BP bonus.
Generally speaking I’d love for all perks and add-ons that give bloodpoint bonuses to replace those bonuses with game mechanical effects that directly impact the match. The idea of “balancing” perks using bloodpoint bonuses seems counterproductive since many players don’t really care about the boosts, and even the MMR itself doesn’t care at all about bloodpoints. So for example, replace the bp bonus on We’re Gonna Live Forever with, say, a healing speed or gen speed boost or temporary movement speed boost, anything really that actually affects the match itself.
Same goes for all the killer add-ons like Padded Jaws which weaken the killer in exchange for points. Replace those bp boosts with beneficial match effects, like with Padded Jaws maybe he can carry a couple of extra traps and more traps are on the map instead of bloodpoints, or maybe something unique like he can grab a trap out of a locker and a random trap on the map disappears. Anything that helps Trapper in the match itself would be fine.
I think if they made a pass at any perk or add-on that includes bp bonus and replaced that bonus with something to help in the match itself it would be a great way to encourage a wider variety of loadouts and also make it so if a survivor or killer is playing oddly due to one of these perks or add-ons it at least makes sense in terms of balancing the match results.
I absolutely care about the BP, that's the whole reason I use BBQ and WGLF. Don't you take my BP away.
Like I said above, if you want more BP then the solution is ask them to increase the base scoring events and/or offering bonuses. There’s literally no need for a perk to give you that bonus.
But the perk is what we have.
When we get the BP adjustments we can talk about removing them from the perks.
We have 96 survivor perks and growing each patch. The grind is insane.
We need to add more ways to gain BP before we start taking them away.
Again, the feeling you need to grind is more of your mindstate than the game. You could simply be playing with what the bloodweb is offering rather than forcing yourself to get very specific perks or rare add-ons for specific builds.
So like I said, they should take a pass at replacing bloodpoint bonuses on perks and add-ons with effects in matches. If they also feel that they want to “make up the difference” then they can increase scores and offering bp boosts to compensate. There’s literally no need for the boosts to be on perks in the first place.
Why is there no reason for BP bonuses on perks?
It offers you the choice to choose additional bonuses.
Many games have unlockable skills you spend your stat allocations that boost EXP or currency gain. It's the same concept.
The games I can think of where that makes sense are typically RPGs, not multiplayer PvP. And yes, I’m against this sort of bonus as a “balancing mechanism” in other PvP games too.
Again, to be clear, I’m not against bloodpoint bonuses as their own thing, like offerings being mostly bonuses. I’m against bloodpoints being used as a balancing mechanism.
But ultimately you're asking to reduce options just because you don't want to use them.
No, I specifically am not asking for “reduced options” at all. I’m saying replace those bonuses with other bonuses that directly impact the match. If anything that adds more incentive overall to use a wider variety of perks and add-ons that currently are underused.
Guess you like being left on hook
That would be awful tbh
But I like the increased pick-up speed for getting slugs off the ground. That's really handy.
Also, great skill checks are not easy to hit for new players or console players. The people who really need the BP boost are new players, and making the grind more difficult for console players wouldn't be nice, either. Not to mention, skill checks are a completely RNG element; I can repair an entire generator and never get a single skill check.
"Kilers have 2 objectives: hooks and gen defence.
Survivors have 2 objectives: gens and rescuing teammates.
See how they complement each other?
Both BBQ and WGLF deal with primary objectives. The hook related ones.
BBQ discourages camping, it's a healthy perk."
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@Seraphor I agree with the two objectives for both roles, but BBQ rewards the Killer's primary objective, while WGLF only rewards the Survivors' secondary objective. Hooks are not the primary objective for surviors; zero unhooks are required to power the exit gate or get the hatch (or there would be far more AFK Killers who grief this way and take the game hostage).
BBQ discourages camping, I agree, but WGLF encourages it. Only one survivor can get the WGLF token, and only if they're the first to unhook. This turns unhooking into a race, promotes unhook-rushing, and positively reinforces the Killer's camping.
They should move the BP bonus from WGLF to No Mither, where it automatically gives double Bloodpoints to the user, and gives bigger in-game BP bonuses to the Protection scoring events to survviors who protect you.
On average, No Mither users don't last as long as other healthy survivors, so giving them free double XP for "hard mode" should be balanced.
Wrong.
The analogy is that unhooking survivors is the same objective quality as breaking pallets. The Killer does not have to break a single pallet to sacrifice the Survivors, but it sure makes it easier. The Survivors do not have to unhook a single teammate to escape, but it sure make it easier.
I just want BBQ & WGLF to affect equivalent objectives. They should both affect primary objectives (Killer Hooks & Survivor Gens), or they should both affect secondary objectives (Pallet Breaks & Unhooks).
If the Killer doesn't hook, the Survivors don't get any bonus from WGLF. The Killer shouldn't get any bonus if the Survivors don't drop pallets. Equality.
Hooks are just as important for survivors as gen defence is for killers. They're both more than 'secondary' objectives. If you don't unhook survivors you will lose the game, just as quickly as if the killer fails to pressure gens.
A truly secondary objective would be totems.
"This turns unhooking into a race, promotes unhook-rushing, and positively reinforces the Killer's camping."
Only if you play like an idiot.
You can prepare for an unhook, start making your way there before the survivor is picked up, and if you're using Kindred then you pick and choose the unhooks you can make more efficiently and safely.
As I've said, I run WGLF with Kindred, I never need to rush for the hook or make unsafe plays, yet I usually get at least 3 stacks per game. Unhooks will happen.
Maybe you should just stop throwing games for stacks and just think of it as "if i get them, i get them, if i dont, i dont"
Killer main - but when I play survivor, my primary build is a heal/safe unhook build. I mostly put on WGLF for the heal boost, and frankly it's pretty good.
Survivors need incentives to do stuff other than just afk sit on gens, not the other way around. Your idea might as well be a passive Escape Cake. If anything, WGLF should promote getting chased more like getting a token for X amount of seconds in a chase, etc., on top of what it already does.