A simple solution to tunneling
To preface this, I know. It probably won't get noticed by the devs or ever mean much, but its nice to share my ideas when I get annoyed and I am curious to the ideas that everyone else has. Here is my simple solution.
When a survivor is unhooked by another survivor (not unhook themselves or deliverance), they gain a status effect from the hooks for 20 seconds. During this time, if the killer chases them or is within 12 meters of the survivor, the timer is paused. If the survivor is downed, the status effect goes active for 60 seconds.
If the survivor has the status effect remaining and is picked up, the status effect timer is paused. If the survivor has this status effect remaining and is hooked or caged, they will not enter second or third state. They will instead keep their timer at the previous point before they were unhooked, and gain 20 extra seconds of that stage. This cannot overcharge the previous amount (if you get unhooked 3 seconds into the first stage, it doesn't give you an extra 20. It only gives 3).
This goes away if the survivor is fully healed, tries to unhook, heals another survivor, attempts to open an exit gate, cleanse a totem, or repair a generator. This status effect also goes away if the survivor uses a flashlight, key, or map in any way.
Share your thoughts down below. I know perks such as borrowed time sorta do this, and decisive strike counters tunneling, but what if the teammate isn't running borrowed? What if you missed the decisive or get caged? Besides. Both of those perks are just bandaid fixes to the problem that is tunneling.
Yes I just got farmed twice by my teammate from basement (unhooked without BT or We'll make it, didn't heal me, and didn't distract the killer) and was then hooked all 3 times in the span of one minute.
Comments
U do realize ur comments makes u a entitled survivor right?
I mean, maybe I do come off as a little entitled. I was just saying that maybe we should try to find a fix for tunneling instead of introducing dlc perks that bandaid fix tunneling (BT, DS, Unbreakable, Break out, power struggle).
I mean, I know I am not entitled to an escape. But when the killer is able to get all 3 hooks on me in under a minute because my teammate got unsafe hooks and I got punished for it, I think there is a problem that needs to be addressed. Whether that be a counter to tunneling, or a counter to teammates farming you for unsafe unhooks.
And I wanted to hear everyone's ideas in the comments, because there were some aspects I hadn't thought of. Such as punishing the survivor who went for the unsafe unhook, rather than the killer who is playing smart. I care about others input, which is why I have responded to almost every post in here that I think I can add my input too, while trying to see things that can be both fair and effective.
But hey, maybe I am just an entitled, biased survivor main! I mean, I'd have to be to believe that tunneling is detrimental to an individuals fun and the balance of the game.
But I would like to hear your input on this. In all honesty, do you prefer the second chance perks because they add a sorta... Spice and choice to each interaction? You gotta gamble if they have DS, gotta worry about unbreakable if you slug, so on and so forth? Or do you simply not think there is a serious problem, and I am maybe just... On a bad luck streak the past few games?
First off, so as to not get flamed as "entitled" or biased, I play as both survivor AND killer depending on my mood.
Ok now for my suggestion, since no one can agree as far as one side getting a benefit over the other. And it's something that developers could place as a buff/debuff on all HOOKS in general instead of individual survivors/killers. And it's also a real phenomenon with killers fyi.
First, the killer debuff/ survivor benefit:
* Set a debuff on hooks that affect killers that for every second they're camping, their vision slowly "tunnels" or narrows (maybe blurring at the edges or a distancing effect or both?) making it harder to see up to a certain distance
* Make the area of effect (AOE) range expand from the hook at a rate of 1m/sec up to a certain distance (possibly 20-25m). Put a timer on it that's sustained for the period of time the killer was in it's AOE. This timer would then make the AOE shrink back to the hook. This makes the killer have a choice, stay put and hope you can see what's going on or get out of the AOE. Each hook in use has it's own separate timer and AOE.
* If/ when a chase occurs, if the "tunnel vision" is still in effect on the killer from staying in the debuff AOE, it will slowly reverse at a rate of time that correlates to the time they were in the AOE.
* This gives survivors a chance at getting a save and encourages them to want to do so while making those killers who love to face camp re-think their strategy.
* Tweak/ add to "Insidious" Perk an effect that PAUSES "tunnel vision" debuff timer when it's activated. Also tweak/ add to "Object of Obsession" Perk an effect that extends the range of this AOE debuff by 5-10m.
And second, the killer buff/ incentive (which is the fun part) that will make killers WANT to leave the hooks AOE debuff:
* Set a BUFF that activates upon a survivor being unhooked (given the killer has stayed out of the debuff AOE of course). This buff would be an instant 1 level bloodlust speed boost.
* Set a base time for the buff at 20-25 sec. Decrease it for every second within the debuff AOE. Basically, you camp, you lose this speed boost.
* Make this speed boost stack into bloodlust gained during an existing chase for a point boost. In this case, it'll deactivate when the existing chase ends (like bloodlust normally does).
* Nice incentive for the killer not to camp while giving survivors something new to be careful of. Also, would be a good incentive for killers to use perks that reward bloodlust.
In conclusion, this suggestion would open up new gameplay and strategies, still leave camping as a strategy (albeit less rewarding in the end), open up a reason not to camp for killers, and also encourage survivors to save their teammates.
Randoms aren't that consistently bad though. Sure not all bring BT, but some are also amazing with flashlights. You've got to give credit to the good Randoms just as much as the potatoes.
It's good that you're using Dead Hard. It will always be an imperfect perk that saves you or leaves you exhausted on the ground.
BHVR already said Dead Zones are an issue they are addressing. We have to brave the storm until BHVR is finished getting an algorithm put together for release. (It's more common on the updated maps than on Rotten Fields usually, I've had a few too many tepid matches on Shelter Woods myself). Also, "survivor blessed" maps happen too. If Dead Zones were a massive issue we'd have the algorithm out by now.
Tunneling and camping, or proxy camping aren't a problem, at least not a constant problem, if you only judge it for how balanced it is.
The reason why most people think camping and tunneling are a problem, is because it's so unfun to go against. And that indeed is a problem when considering that a game is supposed to be fun to play. So survivors not liking those strategies is indeed a problem.
I know randoms can be wonderful with flashlights. I am actually a killer main playing at rank 2, and have gotten more dumb flashlight saves or spams then I care to admit.
I love survivors who use BT to get saves (when I am playing survivor, obviously.) The problem is when I am playing survivor. A lot of killers have rapid movement and abilities that let them stay away, and then rush back towards you once they see the unhook. So even when borrowed time is being run, a lot of the time the killer can counter it. If the survivor isn't running borrowed time though, the unhooked person gets killed faster. While I do love survivors who run BT (I don't use it, but I also body block killer, take protection hits, and only do safe unhooks and will be willing to trade with the survivor if I mess up), but its not as effective against smart or experienced killers as people think.
I know it can be inconsistent, but I feel its much worse on console. Most of the time I use the perk as the killer swings, I'll get exhausted, start the animation, and then immediately go down. Or I'll press it, then the killer will gain a speedboost with their swing and catch up to hit me still.
I might have gotten the map name wrong, sorry. The map I'm thinking of is the rather small cornfield one with the shack in the middle, and the only loops are on the outside. The entire center of the map (other than shack) is a dead zone, and you either have to stealth, or confuse the killer. When I get that map, I have to "tunnel" gens, because that map just feels so... Against survivor. Same as how with old Ormond, killers would sit up and play their A game because survivors could casually loop them. But thank you for your feedback and input.
I hope I'm not coming off as rude or entitled. I sometimes have that tone when I type
I don't think tunnelling is a problem. It IS a problem for entitled survivor.
But becuz its not a problem, there is no fix for it.
But becuz entitled survivors complain, they give u band-aid fixes.
...
"To get ruin undying, I have to get both hag and blight up to extremely high levels, and then hope I get both in the blood web of my main."
Looks at all killers P3, 2/3rd with all perks, and my main Survivor P3 with all perks.
Uhh. Yeah. It can... uhh.... It is unreasonable...? ... I play this game too freaking much.
I think this is probably the best way to state it.
I think you got the name right. TBH the Donut-Deadzone maps are worth their own discussion. Shelter Woods, Rotten Fields, Mother's Dwelling, and Temple of Purgation can all have problematic tile spawns. (Disturbed Ward consistently has enough ways to break line of sight and a powerful main building in the center). Also, these maps can have some very "survivor blessed" spawns. However I believe the Deadzones for these realms can be very problematic.
Shelter Woods, Mother's Dwelling, and Temple of Purgation are my least favorite maps to play on as survivor. Not because of getting tunneled but because if my teammates don't rush gens.... then the maps will hit a point of no return. These are maps that I know I can abuse while playing as killer too. I don't really see this as a tunneling issue, to me this is a more an issue of how palette-dependent these maps can be (palette-dependent referring to where generators and palettes spawn in relation to the other). The main building for Mother's Dwelling and Temple can have obvious loops to the killer. Quite frequently killers will ignore the main building and attempt to catch survivors in the Deadzone, and it's just not an interesting engagement. It's predictable and usually not an interesting match.
Rotten Fields, and Disturbed Ward, usually have good enough palettes and structures so a survivor can make good loops on the edge of the Donut-Deadzone or if you have a lead on the killer can get to safety. Stealth killers like Pig and Ghost-face can make some smart decisions to punish survivors on these maps, but usually the tiles are strong enough where you can have fun.
Updated Shelter Woods has gotten some really lackluster tiles for survivor lately. I will say it's really annoying to get tunneled on Shelter Woods and all you have is a bunch of T/L walls.
Why not just ask for an insta-teleport to a "random" spot on the map instead? That would be so much more balance friendly. This is not said with sarcasm.
"Tunneling" is also an important part of the game when it comes to killers being powerful when nearby survivors.