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Fair DS nerf

Orion Orion
in Feedback and Suggestions

DS works in too many situations, that's just a fact. Nobody likes being slugged either, that's another fact. With that in mind, I think the following situations should prevent DS from activating:

  • When you've been fully healed. Unless the perk's goal is to punish the killer for trying to hook someone twice within 60 seconds of them being unhooked (for context, a generator takes 80 seconds to do by yourself), there's no reason why a survivor who was unhooked and fully healed should still benefit from DS.
  • When you start working on a generator. Again, you had time to be unhooked and continue your objective without the killer interfering. You've had your second chance, as evidenced by the fact that you're already working toward your objective.
  • When you're grabbed. Too many survivors abuse lockers when they have DS because it forces the killer to either get stunned, or let them go without slugging them (meaning they can just go right back on generators). It's a lose-lose situation for the killer imposed by a single survivor perk, which is inadmissible in an asymmetrical game.
  • If the killer has put another survivor in the dying state. You've already escaped danger; you've had your second chance.
  • Once the gates are powered. I think this would be the ultimate risk/reward balance change for DS, IMO. It'd be a powerful perk at the start, then useless at the end. It'd mirror Adrenaline, which is useless at the start, but powerful at the end.

These changes would still make DS a powerful perk, but less punishing if the killer is playing well.

Comments

  • DelsKibara DelsKibara
    • Yes, mainly because by then you have to REALLY TRY to get your DS to proc for you. No need to waste 2 health states either. You're just wasting you and your teammate's time that both of you could do on generators.
    • On the fence for this one, mainly because the best thing to do when you use DS is to use those 60 seconds for something productive, like generators. I personally wouldn't want that removed. Even when I play Killer.
    • No, I feel like "Tactical Grabs" take a monocume of skill to achieve (Unless you use Lockers). I feel like it should stay.
    • Again, no, the Killer can easily put the unhooker in a dying state. Especially right during their unhook. This would make DS way too situational and have too obvious of a counter.
    • I do agree that it is powerful in the endgame, but to that I say you need to eat those DS stuns early into the game rather than let it fester around the endgame.
  • Orion Orion

    @DelsKibara said:

    • Yes, mainly because by then you have to REALLY TRY to get your DS to proc for you. No need to waste 2 health states either. You're just wasting you and your teammate's time that both of you could do on generators.
    • On the fence for this one, mainly because the best thing to do when you use DS is to use those 60 seconds for something productive, like generators. I personally wouldn't want that removed. Even when I play Killer.
    • No, I feel like "Tactical Grabs" take a monocume of skill to achieve (Unless you use Lockers). I feel like it should stay.
    • Again, no, the Killer can easily put the unhooker in a dying state. Especially right during their unhook. This would make DS way too situational and have too obvious of a counter.
    • I do agree that it is powerful in the endgame, but to that I say you need to eat those DS stuns early into the game rather than let it fester around the endgame.
    • Thing is, if you got back on generators, then you've had your second chance. The killer didn't go for you, you're free to do as you wish.
    • I'm assuming you meant "modicum". Grabs don't take skill from the survivors to accomplish, they depend solely on the killer.
    • In that case, the survivors would be punished for hook rushing. I don't think that's an issue.
    • Eat the stuns early and survivors extend chases by 50% (at least), allowing them to repair more generators and escape. Eat the stuns late and they open the gates and escape. It's catch-22, same as with the grabs.
  • Icery Icery

    @Orion said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1279411#Comment_1279411

    • Thing is, if you got back on generators, then you've had your second chance. The killer didn't go for you, you're free to do as you wish.
    • I'm assuming you meant "modicum". Grabs don't take skill from the survivors to accomplish, they depend solely on the killer.
    • In that case, the survivors would be punished for hook rushing. I don't think that's an issue.
    • Eat the stuns early and survivors extend chases by 50% (at least), allowing them to repair more generators and escape. Eat the stuns late and they open the gates and escape. It's catch-22, same as with the grabs.

    Agreed

  • Aven_Fallen Aven_Fallen
    • "When you're grabbed. Too many survivors abuse lockers when they have DS because it forces the killer to either get stunned, or let them go without slugging them (meaning they can just go right back on generators). It's a lose-lose situation for the killer imposed by a single survivor perk, which is inadmissible in an asymmetrical game."

    Nice. Getting grabbed while vaulting a Window disables my DS. Nice, nice.

    • "If the killer has put another survivor in the dying state. You've already escaped danger; you've had your second chance."

    lol.

    Killer is chasing someone else aka good moment to Unhook. Right after I got unhooked the other Survivor is downed. Killer is now free to tunnel me since he knows that I dont have DS.

  • Orion Orion

    @Aven_Fallen said:

    • "When you're grabbed. Too many survivors abuse lockers when they have DS because it forces the killer to either get stunned, or let them go without slugging them (meaning they can just go right back on generators). It's a lose-lose situation for the killer imposed by a single survivor perk, which is inadmissible in an asymmetrical game."

    Nice. Getting grabbed while vaulting a Window disables my DS. Nice, nice.

    • "If the killer has put another survivor in the dying state. You've already escaped danger; you've had your second chance."

    lol.

    Killer is chasing someone else aka good moment to Unhook. Right after I got unhooked the other Survivor is downed. Killer is now free to tunnel me since he knows that I dont have DS.

    Killer outplays you and grabs you while you're vaulting a window, gets stunned for it anyway. Is that fair?

    You were unhooked and the killer is somewhere else on the map. Even if the killer were to immediately turn around, you already have a chance to hide, be healed, etc.. In other words, you have a second chance. Having to specify such an incredibly unlikely scenario is just proof that this suggestion covers all the scenarios that actually happen.

  • Aven_Fallen Aven_Fallen

    @Orion said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1279456#Comment_1279456

    Killer outplays you and grabs you while you're vaulting a window, gets stunned for it anyway. Is that fair?

    You were unhooked and the killer is somewhere else on the map. Even if the killer were to immediately turn around, you already have a chance to hide, be healed, etc.. In other words, you have a second chance. Having to specify such an incredibly unlikely scenario is just proof that this suggestion covers all the scenarios that actually happen.

    It is not unlikely at all. Of course it is easy to dismiss a counter-argument by saying "it is unlikely". But Killers are crying for safe Unhooks instead of BT-Unhooks. And if the Killer is chasing someone else, this is incredible safe at this point.

    Besides that, IMO the only Nerf DS needs is that it is disabled during Endgame. I can only speak for myself but I rarely get hit by DS and I highly doubt I am the exception.

    But I know - Killers are the victims. :)

  • Orion Orion

    @Aven_Fallen said:

    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1279462#Comment_1279462

    It is not unlikely at all. Of course it is easy to dismiss a counter-argument by saying "it is unlikely". But Killers are crying for save Unhooks instead of BT-Unhooks. And if the Killer is chasing someone else, this is incredible save at this point.

    Besides that, IMO the only Nerf DS needs is that it is disabled during Endgame. I can only speak for myself but I rarely get hit by DS and I highly doubt I am the exception.

    But I know - Killers are the victims. :)

    It's easy to dismiss my counter by just saying "it's not unlikely". You yourself admit that if the killer is chasing someone, then it's a safe unhook, meaning you have your second chance.

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