starpilotsix
starpilotsix
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I play mostly survivor. And I've had my share of getting hit through pallets that I thought I shouldn't have. But (except in cases of really bad lag where I was like 10 feet away when I suddenly got hit) it never really broke immersion in the game. I could always rationalize it as 'the killer happened to reach through right as I stunned' and move on with my life and my game.
But shifting it to the killer's side, to make them see a survivor take damage and cry out in pain and then suddenly be fine, that's just ridiculous, IMHO, and those few times I do play killer and experience it, makes me just want to shut off the game. And similarly when I watch on streams, when sruvivors get hit through pallets it's pretty opaque, but when killers clearly score a hit and nothing happens, your game looks broken. IMHO, that's bad game design. If you can't fix the game you should at least make it so it doesn't LOOK as obviously broken.
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Had this exact thing happen to me. I noted down the map tile, if that helps: 0P_HD133 - Rect_Lab_04
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I like approach 2 the best.
And for those who say it's too strong, it's a perk that activates, maximum, five times, and you have to be near a specific place on the map (the activated generator) for it to help you, IMHO, it should be reasonably strong.
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The problem with Haemorrhage as you've outlined it is that it then maked Bloodhound redundant... what point is making blood marks more visible, if you can just take Sloppy Butcher which makes them take longer to heal AND makes blood marks more visible (because Haemo).
In my own recent "fun buffs for trash perks" post I posited a suggestion the the Haemo status effect makes healing progress degrade when you're not actively healing (much like a 'kicked generator' effect. So if a killer interrupts you mid-heal they can actually undo your progress even if they wind up letting you get away. Even that I think might make Sloppy even more OP and meta than it is (maybe making medkit heals automatically cure Haemo after 2s or something might help counter that, IDK).
Exhaustion I don't think needs a buff, yes, it only affects like 4 perks, but using at least ONE of those perks is super common for survivors. That said, if the only additional benefit is breathing heavy, I can get behind it.
Blindness I kind of like how it is, and honestly worry whatever the 'blindness effect' they use will be headache inducing, considering the dream-world effect and the clown's bottles all kind of bother me if I have to deal with them too often. Plus, it would screw with lockers and their blindness effect (would we need a new "can't see auras" effect?). Even if SWF can defeat the current Blindness, it still has an effect on SWF, they have to spend more time and effort describing where they are.
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@SpyMature said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/889981#Comment_889981
If you cant change the already existing achievements, then can you at least STOP doing the same achievement for every new killer that will suck to try and achieve?
Or are you gonna keep doing the same *as a single player against 4 other players, kill all 4 survivors while using 3 unique perks that are most likely gonna suck and wont be as good as Ruin or PopGTW, oh, and also, you need to get a merciless victory, which means if survivors are gonna be this bad to the point of all 4 of them getting downed at the beginning of the match, you're gonna have to let them wiggle out and extend the match as much as possible for the sake of getting all 4 red emblems, and dont forget that hatch exists, if the last survivor gets out, screw everything you've tried to achieve so far*
Or are you gonna keep sacrificing fun for the sake of consistency?
"Sacrifice fun for the sake of consistency" is practically BHVR's motto. ;) Except, of course, when it's consistency between the level of difficulty of adept achievements between killer and survivor, because that's too much consistency I guess?
But yeah... when you think about it, "Merciless" became a dumb name for it once the emblem system came into play, because often to get a double pip (particularly at higher ranks) you have to play MERCIFULLY. Make sure everyone gets two hooks, make sure not to tunnel (getting hit with DS loses you points), definitely don't Mori, make sure the game lasts long enough that you get enough Chase points, basically give the survivor's a chance, i.e., mercy. Everyone knows that a 4K in the first minute or two of the match, which would probably count as actually BEING a Merciless killer, won't get you that rank, so why keep the name? And at the brown ranks, it's actually possible to get merciless while giving a survivor the hatch... a merciless killer while giving mercy. I've done it because I was scrupulous about making sure every survivor got two hooks before I killed anyone, and gave the last the hatch. (At low-number ranks you usually need that last kill, of course, but the point remains, you can get merciless while being merciful)
Call it Devout Killer maybe, because you're playing the game the Entity wants, drawing out the game. Then, again, you can leave Merciless as a category strictly for 4Ks. If you're merciless and devout, you did an awesome job. If you're merciless and entity is displeased, you didn't give the entity (or the other players) satisfaction of a good game. If you're Devout but not Merciless, you played a great game but one player survived, your heart wasn't in it.
As for the adept achievement... Even if you can only do it on PCs and not consoles, making the killer adepts closer to survivors is still reducing inequality. Currently, all killers (PC and console) are suffering in this regard compared to all survivors. Change it, and console killers may suffer compared to all survivors and PC killers... so you've reduced the amount of people suffering inequality. And, you get to say to those console people "Yeah, sorry, console won't let us change the achievements, you'll have to complain to them we can't do anything about it" (how ridiculous is it that they won't let you have control over your game's achievements? People SHOULD be complaining to them) which is at least ironclad rather than having to tell people "yeah we could reduce inequality but we can't do it for everyone so we're not going to do it at all, because consistency!" And if you ignore the consistency-is-king mantra and just make NEW killer adept achievements 4k-based then the level of people bothered will continue to drop as people (gradually) get the OLD adept achievements the hard way and not have to suffer the inequality anymore on the NEW ones.
But consistency, I guess.
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I don't play much killer, I'm not very good at it for a number of reasons, so I'm usually in the brown ranks. Right now I'm at rank 16. So even though I'm not new by any means, you could almost look at me as what a new user might experience playing killer.
And let me tell you, it is NOT condusive to them sticking around.
Because I've done all my survivor challenges, I've had to play killer to do those challenges, and, also, I do want to try out and learn the Oni, right? New killer, exciting.
So let me tell you how my killer games went today.
At LEAST 10 minutes per lobby. One lobby, seemed to be stuck with no more than three people. After about 10 minutes waiting in there (AFTER the 10 minutes to just GET the lobby), I had to get out and get ANOTHER lobby from scratch, waiting another 10 minutes.
Another game, after 10 minutes waiting for a lobby, I get a disconnected-while-loading game.
So, those 10 minutes were completely wasted.
Another game, after 10 minutes waiting for a lobby, I, a rank 16/17 killer, get three purple ranks and a green (in the Yamaoka map which is my god annoyingly dark now), so of course I get destroyed and frustrated. And, you know what, it wasn't just that I got three purple ranks and a green... it's that while I was in the lobby, two people left and two new people joined. That means your matchmaking saw "hmm, a rank 16 killer is in a lobby with two purple ranks" (or one purple and a green) and thought the best way to fill the lobby it was with more purple and green. I know there are brown ranks out there... I keep getting them in my teams as survivor (where I'm purple)!
Another couple games weren't tooo bad, except one lobby was full of flashlight holders, and another, judging by their names, was at least a 3 person SWF. As a rank 16 with some familiarity with the game, I know that I'm probably going to get destroyed... but I can't dodge the lobby or I'll have to wait another 10 minutes.
By the end of my string of killer games (where my one goal was to kill an obsession to get that rift challenge done) I was 100% ready to just find and facecamp my obsession just to get the $!@$!ing challenge DONE (luckily I managed to mori an obsession and simply be a little tunnelly before I made that decision). Similarly with other challenges, at this point trying to farm them sounds like less of a hassle than actually playing the game. That's not fun for me, not fun for the other players, but it's the behavior you're encouraging. I want to get better I didn't feel like I got any practice in on Oni because of on average 20 minutes between actual games until I finally gave up and played survivor for the rest of the day. Having bad games are fine, part of the learning process, but when you have to wait so long between bad games it's incredibly frustrating. Again, think of me like a new player trying to raise in the ranks... let's say that even though I'm new, I WANT to play killer more than survivor. But I get 20 minute average between successful games, and when I do get them, it's often with high rank survivors. Am I going to want to stick around and learn, or am I going to just quit the game? I think a lot are going to go with option #2.
Some simple suggestions:
1) If a game is disconnected while loading, return the killer to the lobby (or return whoever typically has the longer queue times, but... let's face it, these days it's almost ALWAYS the killer), and give them priority as though the game had never filled.
2) If a game has a bad-rank killer, it instantly becomes a bad-rank game, survivors who are already in the lobby can stay but for new survivors bad-rank survivors are prioritized.
3) Fix your three-man-lobby bug. I mean seriously. If there's a lobby with more than 1 person in it and it doesn't fill up completely within 5 mintues, you've done something fundamentally wrong in your matchmaking.
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Loophole: The Adept achievement description says "Merciless Victory."
At the end of the match, the killer ranking says "Merciless Killer." They're similar, but NOT the same, therefore, you don't HAVE to keep them the same.
So define "Merciless Victory" as a 4k, any 4k. Define "Merciless Killer" as achieving that rank on the emblems score. If consoles can't be changed so that the achievement unlocks for anything other than (in pseudocode) MercilessVictory=True, then redefine MercilessVictory=True as being from 4ks, and add a new variable MercilessKiller that applies to all the emblem details.
(I know you probably won't listen and there may well be good reasons why this won't work but I had to say it anyway).
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I'm cool with something like this being on certain signature rooms on maps as a feature (like, say, the Isolation room in Hawkins lab) but nah, not the basement, it's already a dangerous place to save from and risks killers softcamping it... if you can't even hear the killer coming it makes it that much more common.
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@BlueSun said:
I imagine people will disagree, but these are far too difficult in my opinion. I struggled enough with the first set of challenges and now that Phase II is out I am really having a hard time. I doubt I will get them all done and I am a huge fan of the game, I will be very frustrated that I won't be able to finish the lore which I am very interested in.
At my age my reaction time is just too slow. I don't care about escaping and I'm not too concerned with how many points I earn either. I play this just to have fun. Another issue I have which can't really be helped is attempting to play killers for any event or challenge. I prefer to play killer but I honestly don't have a lot of time to play. Queue times are just too long for someone lacking spare time. I would like to point out that this is my favorite game on steam and one of my most played, which is almost 800 hours. I'm sure most people think that isn't a lot of time.
I am just asking if it's at all possible don't make these any harder. Doing anything within a single game is also really too much. I doubt you can adjust Phase II but please for those of us that will never reach Rank 1 in either killer or survivor, lower the tome difficulties please.
I do think there's a potential time bomb of a problem with the archives affecting matchmaking. Let's say an ideal game health has 4 survivor players for every killer player... they may change roles, but when they do, it's more or less consistent to that level. But let's assume a good chunk of them are more or less 'dedicated' to their role and the ratios of those are consistent to each. Now, insert the archives.
Suddenly, all the player base who wants to complete it, has to play both roles. Now, we get 4x the normally dedicated survivors all joining in to do killer challenges (which they're not good at so they'll more likely have to do multiple times). Sure, we also get killer mains joining into survivor with the same problem... but, there's only 1 of them for every 4 of the others, which leaves 3x extra killer players out there.
What's that going to do to the matchmaking? Why, it's going to make killer lobbies take much longer, of course. It's like those old events where they had a 'survivor half' and a 'killer half' and matchmaking took forever because everyone wanted to get their killer half out of the way. Except this isn't just a single event, this is a perpetual event. And the problem reinforces, the more survivors who are playing killer, the longer the wait times... the longer the wait times, the longer that survivor is NOT being an extra survivor player, which makes the wait times EVEN LONGER.
And honestly I don't know how to fix it. The only thing I can think of that might help is to make every challenge 'mirrorable'... that is, every killer challenge has a corresponding survivor challenge, and vice versa. The 'mirror' challenge is more dependent on luck or circumstances you can't directly control (for example, the 'chase someone with Distressing' challenge would be mirrored by 'be chased by a killer with distressing', which can only be completed if you actually get a killer running that perk) but if you WANT to go a dedicated survivor or killer path, you still can.
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Huh, apparently by editing my comment a few too many times the forum bugged out and deleted it? Anyway, I'm just going to repost it.
Hex: Balance of Nature
A hex rooting its power on the conservation of suffering. While the hex totem is active, every healthy survivor who completes a heal action on another survivor in the injured state screams and immediately goes into the injured state themselves. If you are already in the injured state, or heal somebody from the dying state, you do not scream and take no further injury. If you heal yourself using Self-Care or a medkit, you scream and immediately return to the injured state.
The hex totem only lights up after the first survivor is injured. It only notifies survivors of the hex after anyone heals for the first time. When a survivor screams because of this curse, the hex totem's aura glows for 4/3/2 seconds for the screamer if they are within a range of 32m/24m/18m.
"Nature's a vicious struggle, and someone is going to suffer... the only decision is, is it going to be you, or someone else?"
(It's a bit powerful, ensuring at least on survivor is always injured after you hit the first, outside of a few specialty perks, which is why I included the extra 'totem lights up effect'... and also to give an difference to different tiers. In doing some thinking, I'm considering making the medkits ignore this effect, since they're rare enough not to totally destroy it, unless it's a whole team going in with them and then the killer can decide not to use the perk)
Hex: Searchlight
A hex rooting its power on the unrelenting gaze of the panopticon.
The hex totem associated with this perk reveals survivor auras within a 18m radius as long as the totem is up.
Any other totem that is completed reveals the survivor's aura for 10/15/20 seconds (and alerts the survivor to the Hex).
"Nowhere you can go you don't have eyes on you, inmate. Get used to it."
Hex: You Can't Do Anything Right:
A hex drawing its power on frustration.
Every failed skill check while this hex is running makes every survivor's good success zones shrink by 10%/20%/25%. A great result restores 25/20%/20% of the personal success zone size, up to the default non-hexed state. Great zone sizes remain unchanged.
Hex: Extra-Perky
When you select this perk, you choose two extra perks from your list. These perks are loaded onto a Hex Totem when the game starts. If the totem is destroyed, you lose these perks 30/45/60 seconds later.
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@GeneralSpudmuffin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/872609#Comment_872609
Hey, some of these are really good! In fact, I was hoping I could use Searchlight in one of my chapters. It would fit perfectly, and I'll even link your thread so you get credit!
Oh, sure, go right ahead, I'm not precious about these things, they're all for fun. Feel free to change up the wording if it makes it fit better too.
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A few I've made... I'm not going to bother with rarities since perk rarities are meaningless anyway.
Hex: Balance of Nature
A hex rooting its power on the conservation of suffering. While the hex totem is active, every healthy person who completes a heal action on another person in the injured state screams and immediately goes into the injured state themselves. If you are already in the injured state, or heal somebody from the dying state, you do not scream and take no further injury. If you heal yourself using Self-Care or a medkit, you scream and immediately return to the injured state.
The hex totem only lights up after the first survivor is injured. It only notifies survivors of the hex after anyone heals for the first time. When a survivor screams because of this curse, the hex totem's aura glows for 3/2/1 seconds for the screamer if they are within a range of 32m/24m/18m.
"Nature's a vicious struggle, and someone is going to suffer... the only decision is, is it going to be you, or someone else?"
(It's a rough one since it means you have to be careful with your healing and it essentially ensures one person is injured until the hex is destroyed (save a few specialty perks and death)... this power is why I included the 'totem's aura lights up' mechanic (and also because it's something that has perk tiers)... edit, I've been doing some thinking and may make it so medkits avoid this effect, at least for self-heals... medkits are rare enough that it doesn't completely destroy the perk (unless the whole team goes in with one, in which case the killer can know and choose not to use this perk))
Hex: Searchlight
A hex rooting its power on the unrelenting gaze of the panopticon.
The hex totem associated with this perk reveals survivor auras within a 18m radius as long as the totem is up.
Any other totem that is completed reveals the survivor's aura for 10/15/20 seconds (and alerts the survivor to the Hex).
"Nowhere you can go you don't have eyes on you, inmate. Get used to it."
Hex: You Can't Do Anything Right:
A hex drawing its power on frustration. Every failed skill check while this hex is running makes every survivor's good success zones shrink by 10%/20%/25%. A great result restores 15%/20/20% of that individual survivor's personal success zone size, up to the default non-hexed state. Great zone sizes remain unchanged.
Hex: Extra-Perky
When you select this perk, you choose two extra perks from your list. These perks are loaded onto a Hex Totem when the game starts. If the totem is destroyed, you lose these perks after 30/45/60 seconds.
(This really means only one extra perk because obviously if you didn't have the Hex you could already choose one of them)
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How about: *All* timed status effects that are negative for the survivor go down x% faster with the range.
It's a simple change, but this opens it up to some new benefits:
Madness: Recovers faster (in situations where it does recover, which I believe is just lockers)
Oblivious: Still makes you oblivious when using demogorgon portals (or in the dream world) the same, but you recover faster (from the portals, not the dream world)
Exposed: The big one. It provides protection from short duration exposed effects like MYC, Haunted Ground, Iron Maiden... but does NOT protect against NOED, Myers/Ghostface powers, because those don't manifest as a timed status effect (the timer is only on the survivor icon or killer power gauge, rather than on the status effect itself)
Undetectable: Wait, isn't that a killer status effect? Yes! But why NOT include killer status effects, if you're within range. I mean, really, this is the only killer status effect that HAS a timer that goes down, but it makes sense for Vigil to apply here. You're standing vigil, standing guard, more alert for the undetectable killers, so you have more shot to see them if their undetectability is very short term. This only, at present, applies to Demogorgon's undetectability after a portal, and maybe some add-on effects, because most of the other big undetectable effects are tied to their killer power gauge rather than being a status effect timer.
It doesn't really change exhausted, or totem based Exposed/Blindness/etc, because again, those are not on timers, but permanent until the totem is destroyed.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/698476#Comment_698476
"Sure it does. She literally teleports, using her special and entirely magical ability, and then hits. A basic attack would be if she just hit."
That's not changing how the attack works. That is changing how the Nurse moves. The Nurse's power is 100% movement based and deals zero damage.
The Pig's ambush attack functions very mechanically different from a basic attack because it has its own specific charge-up time and extended lunge distance.
You're splitting hairs and you know it. The nurse has to charge her blink, and then has to release it, makes an attack, and then suffers from fatigue, completing her blink action. The act all occurs before the blink has finished. It's an attack that's far different from a basic attack. That's why blink hits are a different scoring event than non-blink hits, and why, until they decided specifically to change this aspect of how it worked (and rightly so), it wasn't counted as a basic attack when that started to become a common perk condition. The Wraith has to hold his button to come out of cloak, then gets an automatic speed boost for an attack, that's why "surprise hits" are counted as a different scoring event then hits. Similar (though with a slightly different activation with charge) with Hag and phantasm attacks, and Spirit and her Grudge, they're non-basic attacks that are treated as basic despite having special conditions and often a movement boost attached.
Literally the only reasons the Pig's dash isn't counted is because they decided it doesn't, and maybe because the 'attack' isn't a separate button but completes automatically (something devs could easily change if they so desired, and require a deliberate swing at the end of a dash). And even if the latter is the case, it, too, is just a choice, that THIS similarity/difference from other killers is more important than any others that have been highlighted... the Pig's dash not being considered a basic attack is still, in several ways, inconsistent with every other killer is treated, and so it's not really about mythical consistency at all.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/697216#Comment_697216
Nurse post blink hits being basic attacks is consistent. Blinks don't change how her attack works.
Sure it does. She literally teleports, using her special and entirely magical ability, and then hits. A basic attack would be if she just hit.
Pig? She just crouches and then runs, and if she hits, she hits with the exact same weapon she hits if she's not ambush-dashing. How is that LESS a basic attack than a Nurse, or a Wraith for that matter who jumps out of literal invisibility?
Of course, the real reason the Nurse's post-blink hits aren't considered basic attacks is because it would mean virtually and perk that involves only basic attacks would never be used because she's not fast enough to get non-blink hits except in the rarest circumstances. Wraith? A lot less sense making there because he actually can pull off hits without directly coming out of invisibility. In both cases, they sacrificed consistency among killers (using your special power as part of a hit) for making a better killer.
If you want consistency, be consistent with THAT philosophy and make Pig's dash attacks considered a basic attack, because she's not a strong killer.
Hell, for that matter, if I'm not mistaken (and I'll be honest, I'm not 100% sure I've got all these right, so feel free to point out if I'm wrong), right now, Pig is thoroughly INCONSISTENT: Am I wrong, or does every other killer that has "non-basic attacks" ones where those are only coming from sources OTHER than their main weapon, regardless of whether powers went into using it.. Huntress? Has non-basic attack from a secondary hatchet. Billy/Bubba? Non-basic attack is their chainsaw as opposed to hammer (or other cosmetic weapon). Hag teleport-hits? Basic attack. Nurse teleport-hits? Basic attack. Wraith straight-from-invisibility-hits? Basic attack. Myers/Ghostface Exposed hits? Basic. Demogorgon Shred- Not basic attack, but with the shred you're also using BOTH hands instead of just one. Plague? Not basic attack is a vomit spray instead of her censor.
But Pig? Same weapon as always. Not basic for some reason.
Not consistent at all. At least make Pig's dash a second knife she pulls or something if you're going to justify it.
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@MegsAreEvil said:
Consistency is now called nerf. LOL
Great, so let's be consistent and make Nurse post-blink hits not count as basic attacks again. Right?
Consistency should ALWAYS lose out to what makes a killer better (to play as, or against). And the Pig's dash is pretty weak as it is, her other power has only 4 uses the entire game (and all must be used before gens are powered or they're wasted), so... consciously deciding to let the Dash work as a basic attack seems like it just makes sense to leave her viable. Just like they consciously decided to make Nurse post-blink hits count as a basic attack.
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First one's fine.
As for the second? Nah, keeping track of hooks, on both sides, and more importantly, losing track of them because there's a lot to keep track of, is part of the fun of the game. Make it visible and you're going to get things like survivors who haven't been hooked constantly throwing themselves in front of the killer when a survivor on the last hook is being chased (better for the team as a whole if I lose one hook rather than we all lose one teammate), survivors all leaving the game immediately (or hatch camping or locker hiding or other behaviors appropriate to the current state of the game) when the killer catches someone that they now all know is on their last hook, removing instances where they get close enough to try to make a save that turns out to be unnecessary and thus expose themselves to risk (or blood warden).
Let the game be uncertain.
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A desert-themed map of some sort would be cool, like, rocky-desert rather than dunes of sand which might be hard to work in. But a desert that's mostly open but does have some rock formations to hide in and around and a few small buildings (like it was an old mining camp or something). And, as I've said before, it'd be really cool to have the iconic Vasquez rocks formation known from, among other places, the classic Star Trek episode "Arena", worked into it.
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What about adding the penetration effect to the insta-down, but, nerf the insta-down so it only applies to hits, say, 24m away or farther (the number may be tweaked)?
The idea being the hatchet needs some momentum to be deadly, gaining the Entity's power while it's in flight, otherwise it's just a normal hatchet. But this limits one of the IMHO more annoying trends in IH users, that of just getting close enough where a miss is unlikely, by requiring some minimal skill and adding some outplay potential on survivors, knowing they can't get too far away. At the same time, it allows for good sniping huntresses with long-distance shots to make amazing hits. And, now that the lullaby isn't directional, hearing it when you know IH is in play will put you on edge but won't be an immediate signal of "the huntress is aiming her one-shot my way, must run"
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Really, ANYTHING that incorporates the concept of the Legion being a group would be benefit. Instead, it wound up being the worst waste of an exciting concept since Batman V Superman.
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Because you got caught out in a highly situational play, you want to eviscerate his power and make it so, despite being cloaked, you hear his terror radius.
"Only when he's standing still for too long!" I assume you'll protest, except, then it really wouldn't counter anything in the situation you got owned in, because they can just move back and forth at a part of the basement you can't see.
Here's the thing: If you're playing against the Wraith, you have to be aware that it's possible they might be right near you and you never know it. That's just part of the game. And yes, sometimes they'll do scummy things like use that power to hook camp. It's not against the rules. Again, it's part of the game (though they do suffer for it in Emblem scoring). The perk 'Insidious' exists, and killers can use it to have no terror radius if they stand still. Even if they're in the basement guarding someone. It's not a very powerful perk, nor is the strategy this Wraith used a particularly effective one most of the time (because good teams can quickly work out what they're doing and then it becomes like any other camping killer, they waste their time guarding a hook and accumulating almost no points while generators get popped).
If you think the killer's there, bait the hook and take the hit, or position yourself so he hits the hooked person and you get away in the meantime, or take the hit, run, hope he chases you and someone else can pull off the save while you're away. There are options.
You don't need to nerf the killer and in doing so remove their possibility of doing occasional good play that requires 'stand still' (like guarding a totem or generator the survivors return to a lot).
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Why not give his bottles 'generator damage' abilities? So he doesn't have to actually go to a generator to kick it, but he can just throw his bottle at it from a distance. Maybe not the equivalent of a full kick (at least not without add-ons), but something where it regresses while the gas is in play unless a survivor's actively working on it.
Wouldn't fix him entirely but would give him a LITTLE map pressure.
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@Nos37 said:
@starpilotsix I would have if my gen wasn't in the corner of the map with the only exit pathways being open fields.
My point is that I was not idling to idle; I had little choice.
Then you got pinned in a situation with no escape potential, which, again, bad play. But there's always escape potential, there's always choices. If there's lockers, there's a wall behind them you can use to block the killer's vision while you sneak away. It might not work, but it's a choice.
If you get crows, it's because you're in one hiding spot for too long. If that's because the killer knows you're there and just doesn't know exactly where, too bad.
Guess what, to get crows, you had to occupy the killer's attention for a minute, looking for you. During that time, the rest of your team was presumably free to do other objectives and make it easier for everyone, including you, to survive. Can't ask for more than that for you engaging in a strategy where you literally do nothing. If you led the killer on a chase that lasted a full minute, you'd have done a pretty good job and you'd have had to use actual skill.
Now, imagine a situation with two players who play just like you, with your 'no crows in range of killer' idea. Killer goes back and forth between two generators, knowing the survivors are there, but not exactly where, they use Spine Chill to hide the moment the killer gets close. Game lasts forever because both of them are too afraid to move and no crows appear.
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Maybe you should have done something other than just hiding in a locker in a situation where it was obvious you were in the area?
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I don't know why people even complain, to me, Ruin adds fun variety to the gameplay. Sometimes, you have a second objective you have to do, and in exchange, once it's completed, the killer's less powerful. Sometimes you don't, and the killer has an extra perk. I don't want every game to be the same (and, though it's quite common at higher ranks, it's never universal).
Playing 'find the totem' is generally more fun than just sitting on a generator anyway (particularly when Ruin is in play, which is why I rarely bother to 'power through'... I can, it's just boring).
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So... you want a game with only 10-15 perks?
Because there are only a limited number of game mechanic things you can do that don't fall into the category of "random rule." On the killer side, you could increase attack swing/cooldown, movement speed, generator and/or pallet kicking, and stun resistance. Maybe killer power activation, but as we saw with Tinkerer, that kind of thing is a huge load on Devs and makes some perks not really work with killer powers. But pretty much everything else would fall under your "random rule" complaint.
And survivor? If you fast-vault, you suddenly get a boost of speed! What a random new rule! If the gates open, you get healed if injured! What a random new rule! After unhooking someone, you heal super fast! What a random new rule!
Personally, the wide variety of perks is the main thing that makes the game FUN. Every match is a little different, you can try out weird builds that make you awesome in one rare situation but less effective overall than the average survivor/killer.
Get rid of the variety and it's just a game of who can run around pallets better and I'm bored AF.
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I thought this was going to be about the Locker Perk we all need:
https://twitter.com/NXOnNetflix/status/1164945466405998592/video/1Quick Change:
You slow-enter lockers 15/20/25% faster.
While inside a locker, you can change your character's cosmetics to any you already own.
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Killers should not have to struggle to get a survivor to a hook. They should not have to devote a perk to getting a downed survivor to a hook in normal situations.
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@Milo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/640932#Comment_640932
They will never just give out licensed characters.
Right. BHVR doesn't just keep the money from people who buy it's licensed DLC... a good chunk of that gets kicked back to the license holder. If they decided "hey, free Myers", the license holder would say, "So, I see a hundred thousand people just got the Myers DLC, where's our cut for all of them?"
The owners of the Halloween license don't think "Hey, BHVR's making money off Stranger Things now, so we don't need to charge for ours!"
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@Milo said:
I still don't know why exactly they changed that (other than it matching the text)
It doesn't even, REALLY, match the text, when you look at it.
Achievement text: "Achieve a merciless victory with (killer)"
Double-pipping: Merciless Killer, not merciless victory.
What a 'merciless victory' is has never been defined anywhere as far as I'm aware, which means it's open to interpretation. So, sure, it COULD be a victory where you get Merciless Killer, but it doesn't have to be. They could just as easily define it so that it's "a 4k." It's a minor distinction, but if the only reason for the change is the achievement text, then it's not justification enough.
And making it require a double pip is a silly requirement and should be reverted. Survivors can get the achievement just because a killer is AFKing or memeing (I've got adept survivor achievements more than once just for that).
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In my own post of a bunch of killer perks I'd like to see buffs on (here) I proposed turning it into something like a Devour Hope perk, where the killer tries to perform a 'ritual' that appeases both the Entity's love of pain and of teasing hope, by hooking every survivor in the basement and letting them escape (and not going immediately back to down them or catch the rescuer), each survivor properly hooked in the basement and rescued giving the killer a permanent speed boost until that survivor is dead, and a bonus if all four are achieved. Here's the desc.
Monstrous Shrine:
The Hooks in the Basement are your shrine of devotion to the entity, and completing a complicated ritual there increases your power.
The first time you hook each survivor in the basement, you are granted a token as long as they escape the hook and you do not down either them or their rescuer for 60 seconds.
For every token you have, you get a 2% bonus to your movement speed and 5% bonus to your vault speed as long as that survivor is in the trial. When the survivor leaves or dies, you lose the associated token. If you have 4 tokens when the exit gates are powered, one exit is randomly chosen to be blocked by the entity until a token is lost.
The Basement Hooks are granted the following bonuses while you are more than 48m away:
3/6/9 % faster Entity progression.
5/10/15 % increased difficulty on escape attempts.
3/6/9 % increased penalty to escape fails.
"Then you will know that there is no escape. When hanging in the depths, you face the dark one, and even a rescue is merely a short reprieve."
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@iamzammm said:
Hi,
Am I the only person that thinks struggling on a killer's back is pointless right now? I feel like you could be the fastest person in the world at pressing A+D and still never get off before being hooked, unless any of the other survivors help. Without help however, you are royally screwed and get hooked EVERY TIME. This needs to be addressed because otherwise you may as well just take away the struggle option imo.
You're not meant to wiggle out once the killer's picked you up. Seriously. It's not expected behavior, and if it was, the ENTIRE game would need to be rebalanced because of it, because it would make killers have to work so much harder to get kills.
Wiggling out of a killer's grasp should only happen if:
a) You've got good teamplay on your side (or at least, people who happen to take advantage of a good opportunity)
b) The killer makes a mistake by taking you to a hook that's too far away.
or
c) You get very lucky with how other things shake out (hooks damaged by other survivors dying creating a zone where the killer can't reach another hook in time, etc).
In every other case, you're not intended to get out- you got caught, you SHOULD go on the hook.
So why wiggle at all? What's the point of a mechanic that you're not expected to escape from?
It's a mechanic to make sure the killer doesn't just hook you at the place of their choice, which would often be the basement, since it's the easiest place to defend. Instead, because you wiggle, they have to make sure to get to a hook that's nearby (which can occasionally expose them to good team plays or make them need to take risky moves like running through a pallet that can be dropped on them).
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The only time I've ever seen everybody playing the same killer is... when a new killer is released (or gets a major rework, like Freddy). Nothing to do with the killer being on sale, or for sale, everyone just wants to try out the new killer because it's exciting to try new things. Leatherface goes on sale regularly, he's still a rare killer.
So if what you really want is more variety in who gets played, what you seem to want is not "no killer sales" but "no new killers, no major updates."
I don't think staleness is your problem here.
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Nah. I think that's too much, and survivors often won't learn about it until they've already killed someone by doing generators too well, and griefers might do it deliberately. Though I do think it might be cool to have a purple or red add-on where every generator that pops after the first takes a certain amount of time off the timer. Survivors will have to be observant and if they're not careful they might accidentally kill their teammate.
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Some decent ideas, but I don't want to get rid of the 'see survivor's auras while crouched' add-on (which is one of the few that actually alters a killer's gameplay style in a fun way), or the blindness effect from face mask (because it's one of the few blindness add-ons on any killer that actually lasts long enough that it can occasionally be of some use)
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Please stop with that stupid Term "Gen Rush". The Survivors are doing their Objective, it is not their fault that most of the Killer Players cannot compensate for it.
Just yesterday I watched a German Streamer (Prayer Beads Spirit) I faced. He tunneled a lot (great Fog Whisperer btw., shows the quality that is needed to represent BHVR and this game../s) and was complaining about every DS and BT he ran into. Like, I unhooked 3 people, he saw me all the time and 3 times he ran into BT, instead of just going for me. And complains about Gen Rush, because he loses so much time to chase the people who got BT and DS. A day before I had him with Infinite EW3 Myers. I unhooked someone, and instead of going after me (with EW3, so both people are Oneshot), he went after the other person and got hit by DS. And again, complains about how less time Killers have.
And you want to support those kind of people? Players like that who do everything wrong and complain afterwards about getting genrushed?
With a decent amount of Map Pressure, Gen Rush is harder to do. But I agree that some form of second Objective is something to look for, but not something like "Lets Survivors take double the time without any more balancing".
Anyway, I dont want to get less points for doing Gens. What else should I do? When there is no Totem nearby or I am not getting chased or going for an Unhook? Watching the scenery? Or play Hide and Seek with the other Survivors, while one person is getting chased?
When people use the term "gen rush" they usually aren't saying the players themselves are doing something wrong, they're saying the game is unfortunately designed in such a way that the players can complete their objective too quickly, and usually that it should be changed.
You might not agree with that assessment, you might not agree with the proposed solution (I don't here) but there's no reason to take offense at the term. It's a handy shorthand.
Also, right after complaining about this, you complain about tunnelling. It's funny because you could say almost the exact same thing: "The Killers are doing their Objective, removing players from the game most efficiently. It's not their fault most of the Survivor Players can't compensate for it." Except there's a general acknowledgement that that makes for unfun games for most everyone else, and it should be avoided, and the game has decent structures in place (DS, borrowed time) to make it less worth the killer's while.
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@michaelkhj said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/620846#Comment_620846
yeah! Claudette should be invisible! even running should not leave red marks. Stealth survivors should be stealthy, Claudette should counter BBQ, Nurse's Calling even Whispers.. otherwise theres no point to play Claudette. that's right? hahaha
This is a ridiculous argument and you discredit all your others for having made it (not that they were that strong anyway).
Survivors are meant to be functionally identical, except for perks choice... that some characters like Claudette are naturally more stealthy because of color scheme is just an unfortunate circumstance. Killers are meant to have a special power which gives them a key advantage over survivors and compared to other killers. Imagine BHVR released a killer with no special power at all: who would play them except diehards with something to prove? It would be considered the weakest killer in the game and most survivors with any skill would trounce them.
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Agree with everything except having the totem only light up after all 4 survivors have been hit. A single survivor being hit is enough, means it won't be destroyed before the killer finds anyone, but still gives a chance to defeat it before it becomes too powerful.
However, ALSO added to blindness should be an effect of 'make hex totems look like dull totems,' so any individual person (or the whole team if it's been fully stacked) has more difficulty finding it after they've been hit.
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Wait... there's not a single game that Nurse's Calling, BBQ and Chili, Surveillance, and RUIN aren't used at Maximum Efficiency?
Not a single game where Ruin is taken out in the first 60 seconds of the match? Not a single game where survivors hide in lockers or close enough to the hook that their auras can't be seen? Not a single game where survivors catch on that Nurse's Calling is probably in play and so make sure they're out of the terror radius when they heal?
You must be like the biggest statistical outlier in history.
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@CornChip said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/617219#Comment_617219
Noone says "oh its a legion, I love versing legions".
Noone.
Yeah Legion's actual powerset is fairly weak. Mechanically speaking, a Billy or Nurse is much more deadly, but I have fun playing against them, even if they're really skilled. But Legion's real power comes from the fact that I literally do not want to win when I play against him, I just want to get out of the game as quickly as possible without screwing over my teammates by suiciding and into a game with a killer that's actually interesting. I have literally, once two survivors are dead, chased Legion down and done something like a generator in front of him just so he could grab and hook me and the last survivor could have a shot at the hatch. I would literally do the same if the gates were open and I was on my last hook and dying got me out of the game faster than running for a gate. That black hole sucking all the enthusiasm out of the game and making it an exercise in just going through the motions, now that is OP.
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If you remove Frank's Mix Tape you gotta replace it with something.
I suggest making it reduce the penalty for a missed hit in FF - not so much because that's too punishing to play, but just because one of the few fun things about playing Legion was just stabbing wildly at the air in a threatening way during a chase. Like an "I'm gonna getchu!"
It doesn't have to go away completely, but maybe just so it takes a chunk off your power gauge instead of completely depleting it.
Though I do agree that a total rework's necessary before Legion's fun to play as or against, it's not likely to happen so might as well work on small fixes. Though honestly, I'm not sure about these, just because one of the more boring things about the power, survivor side, is being forced to mend while Legion runs off and this looks like it'd make it more common. I'm not sure how you'd fix that issue as any tweaks to make Legion more viable probably would all have similar outcomes.
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@PigNRun said:
About Stake Out, ######### no. If Im using this perk for skillchecks, I dont want to waste tokens on actions that are beyond my control. Stake Out is fine as it is.
If it were fine as it is, I'd see it more than once in like fifty games.
As for the effect, I do see your point... though only comes up in cases where you have 4 tokens though, so it's not like you could be completely drained of tokens, worst case, you lose one, and in exchange you don't scream at (for example) a clown bottle or Freddy trap, and possibly get chased/hooked. Seems like a fair trade to me. I actually did consider it just make it a persistent buff when you have four tokens, which would give you a choice, do I use my saved tokens to complete objectives or to protect myself, although in the end, I thought that would make it way better than a perk like Distortion, which only protects you (albeit from auras, not stationary alerts) three times the whole match, whereas this would protect as long as you didn't do skill checks, so I thought the 'dropping your fourth token' was a fair compromise.
@Panduh said:
The Vigil idea is weird. Mori's are offerings and typically perks don't really affect offerings (even if Ebony is gg).
Vigil's problem is it doesn't interact with some of the strongest status effects in the game like the timed Broken and Exposed statused (MYC, H:HG, IM). It also has no interaction whatsoever with perks like Sloppy Butcher, and Hex: Third Seal, because they're infinite. (I'm aware TS isn't that strong, it's just an example. Changing TS by taking it away from Hex perks and making it a timed status on hit would make it both more consistently usable and also more interact-able IMO.)
Another major issue is it hardly is worth the perk slot for the things it does tangibly affect such as exhaustion(8 measly seconds for a whole slot) or status effect add-ons for killers. No, I will not suggest recovery while running lol. I will suggest Vigil's strength to be upped- and for Huntress, and Clown's EXH add-ons to be nerfed/changed because they're from a different time period in the game.
Mori's are occasionally offerings, but are also provided by perks like Rancor and Devour Hope (well, technically they are usually just referred to in the perk description as 'kill the survivor by your own hand', and probably for consistency's sake the perk should use similar language, but in common parlance we refer to any killer's non-sacrifice-kill as 'Mori'), so, IMHO, fair game for perks to counter. And perks affect offerings all the time, in various ways, from perks that affect points affecting BP perks, to perks like Franklin's interfering with the effect of White Wards (in that if an item's knocked out of your hands, your ward doesn't protect it). Really, it doesn't affect the offering at all - the killer still can Mori, even Ebony Mori... they just have to make sure they drive off and/or down the Vigil user first if they're nearby.
It certainly isn't intended to fix the perk on its own, I tended to be conservative, adding small buffs that wouldn't risk overpowering, and in many cases that means a perk that started as a trash perk's still going to be relatively underpowered. Buffing the numbers of old Vigil's perks might also be an option, but I tried to focus more on adding interesting or fun secondary effects because often with numbers I don't have a gut feel for what would be needed/too much. You do have a good point about timed Exposed/Broken status effects and now that I think about it, I'd probably want to include that as a change as well (although the part of my brain that likes perk names to be 'fitting' with the effects would rather it not just be a 'touch and go' effect that persists for 15 seconds after passing within range, but that you have to actually stay close to the survivor and... stand vigil to make, at least these effects, go down... that's probably not the best move from a buff standpoint though).
I disagree on Third Seal and do agree that Clown/Huntress's Exhaustion add-ons need to be slightly reworked, but all that's beyond the scope of this. ;)
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@se05239 said:
Let the Trapper RESET traps without having to pick them up first.
This one change would save Trapper players so much time and sanity.
Yeah. And really, it should be a relatively easy mechanic to implement, control-wise: Tap the button to pick up a trap, or hold it for the length of the trap to reset it in place (let it go beforehand, and you pick up the trap, if you have space, or leave it unset if you don't).
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I think it could be done with an ultra-rare add-on, and it would be cool, but there'd need to be some serious drawbacks.
There already are certain drawbacks - the doctor illusions might APPEAR right in front of the survivor, but they stay in one place regardless of the survivor's movements. As such, a clever survivor (who knows this add-on is in play) could use it to trick the doctor into teleporting and having no idea where they are.
My own idea centered around it completely replacing the shock-attack... that is, the Doctor would have to build people up into madness entirely through passive effect, never directly shocking them. The 'teleport' button would be there instead of the shock button, and it, in addition to requiring a Doctor hallucination to be visible (which means only Madness 3 unless a separate add-on is dedicated to that), have a limited range, a charge time, and cooldown. Bring back the ability (which I don't know if it's been deliberately removed or if it's just been buggy lately and not working consistently) where the illusion disappears if the survivor makes physical contact (perhaps causing a stun effect if the Doctor was mid-teleport when the illusion disappeared), it could be balanced enough to work and be a lot of fun, or it might need some more work, but conceptually, it could be a great idea.
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@limierr said:
The main issue i have with that is that autodidact nearly allow you an insta heal quick. Give more skill check mean that you can replace even faster we will make it.
Also based on your definition it would mean "The chance of triggering skill control increases by 10/20/30%
added pls? thanks" : all skill check will be affected.
It might be workable if the skill check improvement goes away once 5 stacks are reached.
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So what you're saying is, your friend, out of too much altruism, made a bad play that didn't work out and you think the game should be changed because of it.
Maybe you do bones next time?
(Btw, if gates are opened and there's only one survivor unhooked left in the match and the killer doesn't know where they are, what do you expect? That they wander away from the hook in a random direction and go sit in a corner of a map so your friend can pull off the save and you can teabag at the gate?)
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@yeah_whatever said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/573275#Comment_573275
*sigh*...
Okay, like you said, I passed them all. But Nurse, Hillbilly and Cannibal (Leatherface) Power is unlimited and the waiting time is quite short, okay.
Why does the gang have 20 seconds of power standby time and 4 seconds of cooling time?
Legion Add-ons even the newly given features are really ridiculous indeed! Blindness, Mangled and broken 60 seconds effective? This effect will end until you catch him.
And what do we have to hit twice? Why other killers activate these effects instantly in one shot?
Go to the gang's dlc shop and read the reviews. Even because of the add-on, there were so many people requesting a refund. My goal is not to argue, political and fight. but the new plugins are pointless..
There is no balance, I want to say this.
I wish you good forums...
Your complaint seems to be that Legion is too weak, not that the others are too strong.
I agree that Legion, particularly their add-ons, are in a bad place right now (frankly, I think the killer needs an entire rework, top to bottom, because it's currently the most boring killer to play and play against), though keep in mind, devs have said that the mangled/blindness/etc add-ons are planned to be changed so that it happens on the first hit, not needing to hit them twice. So they already agree that it's ridiculous to have to hit people twice for such a limited effect, it's just going to take them a while to put it in the game because they have other priorities first.
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My own idea:
The Phantasmagoria Protocol:
An experimental treatment developed within the fog. A constant low-level stimuli leaves the patients unable to properly distinguish reality and fantasy. The Doctor deliberately blurs the lines between the two to keep the patient off balance.
- Shock Therapy Attack disabled.
- Static Field provides the equivalent of one shock therapy attack at each tier up (for stacking with Iridiscent King, and provides a little bump of extra progress)
- In Treatment mode, the Doctor can teleport to an active Doctor hallucination in his terror radius, replacing the hallucination. Add-ons that affect shock-range now increase teleportation range. A successful teleport kicks him out of Treatment mode.
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Maybe you do bones next time?
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Also, you give all this information in the HUD? Guess what, SWF teams now don't have to take any time to communicate it with each other, which means they can instead use their voices for more useful stuff, like specifically where the killer is going, what gens to focus on, etc.
I'm fine with narrowing the gap... but IMHO it should be done by giving penalties to SWF, or benefits that solo players only get. Not overall changes to how the game works for everyone.