no_way55
no_way55
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- no_way55
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@SoylentPixie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1689254#Comment_1689254
Actually no. Nowhere on my post implies you arent wanted on the forums because you believe in options.
All i have done is use your own arguments to prove that your particular solution to this problem is flawed. If you want to make a difference, take your idea back to the drawing board and try again, and no im not being sarcastic. I'm all for change in the game, and calling you naive because you seem to be willfilly ignoring that group play is a large part of the game and the game itself would be negatively affected by a player base split, is not insulting you or telling you to get off the forums. It's asking you to recognize that you might have to rethink your position.
If you want to pretend the mildest of perceived flaws in your theory and character as so offensive as to chase you away that's fine. Personally, while i don't agree with you, i have seen you hold your own throughout this whole thread and don't believe for a second you are quite that thin skinned.
My correction your argument is sound. Throughout this tread i have been called ignorant and naive and slightly insulted because i refuse to believe this game will fold if the swf change happened. The ebb and flow of new players with new content only lasts for so long. Calling me thin skinned is insulting because i see your points but refuse to be swayed from the idea that the game would die off Or killers would rein supreme if the option was implemented. Granted some perk changes could help. If not the swf option then what suggestion would help balance the toxic levels in the game?
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@SoylentPixie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1689168#Comment_1689168
If SWF was an option that killers would totally take over solo games, then you wouldn't need to separate SWF in the first place. Your whole argument is that killers should be given the choice to play against SWF or not, implying that SWF is harder or not an enjoyable game mode. Otherwise why would such a 'choice' be needed.
To quote your initial post : (and no i don't agree with you falsely generalizing an entire section of the game )
"Majority of SWF is toxic"
"The game loses new players all the time because of the abuse feed to new players by swfs"
If this were to be true, and you separated SWF ques, VERY FEW killers would opt into it.
Your other argument seems to be it will bring new players to the game. Perhaps it would, but how many of them join the game because they think it will be a cool game to play with their friends?
I don't deny there is toxicity due to SWF, i don't deny that some SWF groups might be unfun or frustrating to play against. The same can be said about a lot of this game because everybody has their own beef somewhere along the line. Separating SWF ques might increase the player base, but only very briefly once players realize that if they want to play this game socially they have to sit in a que that will be excruciatingly long. Because as you stated "Majority of SWF is toxic" and whether this is true or simply a perpetuated myth based on the actions of the few rather than the many, the statement gets thrown around enough that nobody would touch such a mode.
Social gameplay is a big thing in this day and age, you cannot deny that. Most of us have a group we play with, or perhaps family at home or some other form of gaming social circle. And while yes, DBD does have a decent solo player base, any game that can be considered multiplayer will also have a huge 'group' player base. It's why even single player games hammer in terrible multiplayer modes because word of mouth and 'group gaming' culture continues to grow and make them money.
I don't have a horse in the race one way or another, but your idealist notion that splitting the player base will improve player count and the game overall, is either willful ignorance or not thoroughly thought through beyond the result you hope for.
Naive, willfully ignorant, not wanted on forums. Because i believe this game should options. This is my last post on this tread. Insulting someone for have a different view then your own is the behaviour i am trying to tone down in this game. Wishing you all a good week.
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@ALostPuppy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1689168#Comment_1689168
Pretty sure there were stats somewhere that showed at least half the people who play this game play with their friends.
"Why would killers opt out of SWF?" Idk because playing against 4 solo survivors with no Comms is almost always going to be an easier match than a SWF team with comms? So why wouldn't they choose, and I'll say it again, the path of least resistance especially if that path has literally no downsides for them?
I never said killers would be overpowering. And you haven't given good reasons for the option to exist either. How would effectively saying "hey you can't play this multiplayer game with your friends because your queue times will be an hour long" bring MORE people into the game?!
Look I'm really sorry but I just don't see where you're coming from with this.
Fair. You see swfs as an option. I don't agree. 👍I have given reasons you refuse to acknowledge. But the killers face may change even perk addons. But if the game play doesn't evolve then the game grows stagnant. Map changes are nice and all but its not growth.
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@Hoodied said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1689170#Comment_1689170
Actually it would do the opposite, as all killers would disable SWF to prevent facing SWF teams and only face solo teams, resulting in EXTREMELY HIGH queue times for people who want to play a game with friends, resulting in them leaving the game or attempting to queue together in solos
This would chop the player count down massively and possibly result in the death of the game, hence why game companies never want to restrict you from playing with friends
Again forcing the swf option.
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@Hoodied said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/198707/why-is-the-swf-option-a-forced-thing
Okay buddy
For starters not all of SWF gameplay is toxic, infact most SWF teams I see that are playing to win (Pretty sure thats what you mean by toxic, most people think of it that way) I usually never encounter in almost my 3 whole years of owning this game.
Along with this, not everyone is an SWF team, I have seen some coordinated solo queue teams recently, and when I do SWF in dbd when I play it I usually Duo or Trio and use stupid perk builds
TL;DR Majority is dead wrong, not that many people are 4 man SWAT team never lose DS,UB, AD, DH gamers
Not a buddy. But we disagree. 👍I think it would open the game up.
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@ALostPuppy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688898#Comment_1688898
Based on the killer mains I've seen on here....hahahahaha there's no way any of them would ever queue for SWF if they had the option to. Some things just don't need an option, and a SWF queue option would absolutely kill the game. I'm sorry if you think otherwise but there's absolutely no way there'll be enough killers to play against swf groups, and the game would lose about half of its players. The rest will be queueing forever in killer queues because nobody likes playing solo survivor.
I disagree whole heartedly that the game would lose HALF its players. Why would killers prefer to opt out of swf? What possibly could chase killers to solo queues? The reasons to keep swfs as a forced option are bad examples. Omg killers would overpower us. Nooo the game would fold and die off. Only swfs can save us. They bring money but the new players who don't have to be forced to play against swfs bring money in too. I hope they make it an option to play with or against swfs. I truly thibk it would bring a bigger audience.
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@no_way55 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1689069#Comment_1689069
If the survivor was bigger is a possibility. Everytime dbd drops new known killers. But they(new players) only stay so long. Devs need to figure that why new players bounce. But i think you and i know why. Too much toxicity optioning out swfs would bring those numbers down drastically. Not getting rid of swfs but giving the masses options.
*Survivor pool was bigger. * it would be a possibility.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1689044#Comment_1689044
Solo lobbies would also be longer. You can't remove a portion of the survivor pool and then expect lobbies to fill faster.
And then that SWF lobby wait would be an eternity.
If the player base was much much bigger, then a SWF option could work. Unfortunately DBD doesn't have that.
If the survivor was bigger is a possibility. Everytime dbd drops new known killers. But they(new players) only stay so long. Devs need to figure that why new players bounce. But i think you and i know why. Too much toxicity optioning out swfs would bring those numbers down drastically. Not getting rid of swfs but giving the masses options.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
To help the new players they should implement a practice mode with bots. The tutorials don't really help that much.
Having an option to turn off swf would hurt the game much more than it would help.
I do agree that a new tutorial needs to be updated. But a swf opt out would Hurt the game. How? Faster solo lobbies. New player retention is almost a given. Swfs might have a bit of a wait. I still believe it would benefit the overall game more then hinder.
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@xenotimebong said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688980#Comment_1688980
I play almost entirely solo survivor and low tier killers these days and I have no problem with SWF existing, it’s just the abusable stuff (like Object) I have an issue with.
It doesn’t really matter either way, the devs will never add a SWF opt out option in a million years so this entire discussion is sort of pointless.
You never know unless you try. Plus if they ever want to attract and retain new players some changes to the swf mode will have to change in some way to compete and gain a bigger following. Not remove just more options.
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@HEX_MalusGrey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688976#Comment_1688976
Agreed.
Mori's and many addons are desperate for changes. So is the MM system and SWF mechanic. But as long as devs don't start working on thing's but continue to sell costumes instead we will see another 100 threads with thousands of arguments about this stuff.
I fully agree.
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@xenotimebong said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688942#Comment_1688942
Everyone has to endure toxic and sweaty matches in this game. Do you think anyone enjoys playing against moris, or Insidious campers, or Stridor Spirits? Should there be an opt out for all of those as well? Let’s just show everyone their opponent’s load outs pre-game too, that way I can dodge iri head Huntresses and rusty shackle Hags and Objects and DS/UB gamers and Freddys with slowdown builds.
Game mode vs game perks or offerings are not the same thing. Your a swf keeper got it. I am not. My vote is for options in game mode. I personally think dbd would gain more new players if this was an option. No killers would not rein supreme. I do think toxicity would go down a lot. Killers and solo players would see more balance. I truly think the game would garner a bigger player base.
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@xenotimebong said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688898#Comment_1688898
“Why are so many freaked out about this option?”
Because a lot of people play in some form of SWF that is just a regular, casual group and not some anti-killer SWAT team. They enjoy jumping into a match with a couple of friends and dicking around, probably dying more often than they escape, because getting to play with people they like and chatting ######### is fun.
Your suggestion would kill that option. It would either make queue times for SWF insanely long, or they would have to deal with moris, iridescent add ons, and Spirit/Nurse/Freddy every round. There are a lot of killer players that HATE SWF and would just avoid the option entirely or use it as some kind of “extra sweat” mode. If you don’t think this would drive a LOT of survivors away from the game you’re being naive.
For what it’s worth I play solo majority of the time now but I’ve played in 4 man SWFs in the past. One group I played with, I had a terrible survival rate because most of us were boosted and would scream when chased, give each other bad information, and just play like idiots. How can the killer know whether a group is like that, or the 4 man with Object and a Coldwind offering? They can’t so they’ll assume the worst.
Call me naive i am more then alright with that. But it should be an option. You may play casual matchs but because you want casual mean others have to endure or be forced to deal with toxic swfs? Or solo survivors have to survive against a killer and fellow teammates? That's not really balanced then is it?
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@sulaiman said:
Because swf have a huge advantage over the killer, and the game isnt balanced for that. And since only good killers would want to go at a match with a disadvantage, queue times would go up for swf, and they would actually have matches vs killers that could handle the disadvantage, cutting them off of their easy victorys. SWF´s dont want that, they want the easy game in the first place, and to bully the killer.
and since survivors outnumber killers, you dont get a vote if oyu play with a handicap or not.
Exactly the killer really has no choice. I play both and i see the same thing time and time again. Killer is in the lobby red timer ticks down and bam flashlights and sabo toolboxs. Ds and exhaustion perks and unbreakable with bt of course. Survivor solos have to deal with being being bagged and tagged by the swf team they do get lobbied with. Bagged and tagged(slow unhooks if any at all, killer drop offs or mess up skill checks on heals on purpose or the fun alert killer to your location by pallet drops or vaulting windows. These are reasons why going against swfs should be an option.
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688277#Comment_1688277
Well, so you want the killers to leave first, so noone is left to spend money? because imbalanced games tend to do that, they die out sooner or later.
I think it would be a good thing. Some killers would play against swfs for the option to go against 3-4 players with an advantage to keep skills sharp knowing full well toxic is a high possibility. As well as solo queue survivors who have to elevate their games if they feel like the killers would decimate them if this option was made available. I think it would only elevate the game.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1687682#Comment_1687682
What exactly do you think would happen when half the games population has to wait for over an hour to get a trial? Would they continue playing, paying money for DLC and cosmetics? Or would they leave and take that huge chunk of revenue with them?
That is a one sided thought. The other us dbd needs new players not only to play but to buy dlcs a well. But need players leave for various reasons. But having to deal with the toxic element in this game is a huge reason. They can't retain new players. The swf mode is too negative and slows the game from getting bigger. It should be an option that gives the players a choice and new players a fighting chance to enjoy the game without the most toxic component of the game. Again not get rid of it. Just options.😉
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@ALostPuppy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1687682#Comment_1687682
That's the thing though. You give players the option, they're obviously going to take the path of least resistance. Literally nobody here would queue into SWF matches if they had the option. I still probably would because queue times would be shorter with the option on, but survivor would be dead to almost everyone. I wouldn't find a game as survivor if I were to queue with my friends, and that's the only way survivor is the least bit fun: when you actually have friends to mess around with.
Absolutely it would be the path of least resistance but also some would elevate their own skills instead of relying on the swf option. Not all killers are op same can be said for survivors. The option should be available! why are so many freaked about this option. Again i am not saying get rid of swfs. Just give all players killer and survivor the choice.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
I just don't get how you can call it forced. It is random matchmaking, sometimes you get swf, sometimes you don't. You can't separate them because this isn't fortnite where there are millions of players at any given time. I don't like any idea that would cause longer queues and this definitely would.
Do the players or killers have an option or choice to play against or with swfs? No so then it's forced. Why do you think we have an influx of new players come and then leave. There is not huge learning curve. There is no balance\choice. Both sides feel the swf negativity.
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It may happen or not. But most see the problem with swfs. The devs are just delaying it. Why? Because the mode is just too toxic. Again not saying get rid of it. Just allow players to choose to engage with swfs.
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@HEX_MalusGrey said:
SWF could be a seperate challange mode for killers where they get extra BP. ATM and in the past 5 years this mechanic just ruins the matchmaking and causes so much trouble. If killers would face SoloQ only in ranked and not randomly have voice comm squads throwen against them, they wouldn't be so loud when it comes to nerfes or survivor sided buffs.
The MM feels random and unfun with this. Same goes for the rank resets. Why is this neccesarry? Letting survivors fight against killers that are far beyond their soloQ limits and vise versa?
Frankly i feel ashamed to play this game and buy stuff in the shop. It leaves a bad feeling to support a dev team that cares so much about their moonprized costumes but leaves their playersbase with nothing but hardcore grind and broken core mechanics.
I can see some of those change ideas helping. I see newbies come in and i make friends with them. Help them out and try support the game, but so many left after the stranger thing dlc dropped because of the high levels of toxicity. (I would rather get one player telling me i suck after a match, then four attacking me) and so much other screwed up msgs (how are you still alive? Racism, sexism) i don't blame them. One person you can shovel off 3 or 4 is too much to ask. Forced swfs is a lot to deal with. It's bad and i know not all are but a lot is still too many. Don't remove it just let the players decide how they want to play. Imo
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@Moundshroud said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688021#Comment_1688021
Because as you advance through the Ranks, more and more of them are SWF. :)
I use to think getting in to red ranks would be great. But not so much. I am more a survivor then killer main. But it's true the one thing i noticed on both ends is a lot of swfs suck and ruin the game for fellow players. No side is even. Perks and changes to add ons and moris won't change treating teammates or killers like trash. Giving players options should not cause so much drama. A player wants to opt out they should have the option. Anyone who whines about queue times can play solo or wait no biggie.
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@Babyyy_Boyy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1688002#Comment_1688002
I feel like you’re only looking at it from one side that is, the killers side. First off, If you strongly believe that you are constantly losing into supposed SWF lobbies, there’s a button on the bottom that says “leave”. Secondly, do you not understand how unfair solo que is? You could be rank 1 survivor and get paired with a rank 10, 16, 20, and have a rank 1 sweaty killer. Do you see the problem with that? Matchmaking alone makes matches for survivors unfair. Why do you think people want to play in SWF’s in the first place? Because of crap like that. I think it’s safe to say the devs balance matchmaking first before anything.
Your right about one thing i can leave. But i make an effort to not be a hole. A solo queue is balancing the field imo. You think different but a fair amount of this treads responses agree changes NEED to happen. New players leave because of the toxicity. New players are treated horribly and don't stay because the devs refuse to balance the game. Optioning swf would help a lot.
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@Moundshroud said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1687918#Comment_1687918
- They are doing that already, right now as we speak.
- Killers aren't a bunch of basement dwelling losers. They like a challenge.
- If the playing field is leveled (which putting SWF in their own Que allows) Killers will be happy to take them on.
Right now Killers scrutinize every Lobby. Some duck. Some just assume every Lobby is a SWF and use maximum force. They have to be safe than sorry. Nobody is talking about punishing people for playing with their friends. We are talking about having it done in a way that is fair to the Killer AND doesn't punish the Solos.
That is great. Thanks for the info.👍
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@Babyyy_Boyy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1687935#Comment_1687935
People like you, I just don’t get. Not all SWF’s are toxic. Literally, as a SWF player and I can confirm this, people play SWF just to have fun and talk to their friends. Now, I’m not saying every SWF is casual like that because yes, there are some SWF’s that can be “toxic” or “a holes” or whatever you want to call them but NO the option should not be put there. You’re basically saying killers should have easy mode all the time well sorry to burst your bubble that’s not how the game works and if the devs really found SWF to be an issue it would of been fixed by now. (:
Okay so you can play with your friends. Screw the rest of us killers and solo players that don't like being FORCED to play with or against swfs. Awesome. Bubble bursted you win. P.S a lot of people despise having to play against swfs. It's NOT fun for us. I love the blind arrogance in statements like killers would have it easy if there were no swfs. Not true in anyway but the excuse to keep the swf option is that just that an excuse. Gawd forbid the solo survivor queues would have to elevate their game. To brave the loss of the swf option.
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@Kamizake12 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1687935#Comment_1687935
Reasons why devs dont listen to this forum
??
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@Babyyy_Boyy said:
If this option was implemented into the game do you realize how many Killer mains will opt out of SWF lobbies so they can get easy games and easy kills? Geez, I sure wish there was an option for survivors to see what killer they’re facing before the match starts. Simply put, No. people on this game shouldn’t be punished for playing with friends. If you’re having trouble with SWF’s then bring in OP add-one or something idk.
Why would killers opt out of swf matches??? Because they are toxic af and everyone knows it. Can't survive without friends? Geez. Simply put. YES the option should be there. Forced toxicity should not be a brand.
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@sulaiman said:
SWF always have access to communication in a game based around a lack of that. Yes, they have an advantage. If you don´t realize that, you are either dumb or biased as hell. (its not a personal attack, i think you just brought it up for the sake of the argument. i hope you dont feel insulted by it, its not meant to).
Plz note that i play the majority of the time as solo survivor, but i had my fair share of swf, and its crazy how much it pushes your performance as a team. Yes, i played in really good solo matches, where the survivors steamrolled the killer just the same, but they had to take risks (at least perseived ones) to make it happen, while a swf group always have perfect information about the team status, and often about the killer.
I agree swfs have huge advantages. But giving options to players to avoid playing with or against swfs is more of a balance. If solo players queues are faster and swfs slower that tells the devs all the information they need but might not want to know. Toxic players will still play toxic but they have to do their own dirty work. Sounds fair to me.😉
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@sulaiman said:
Because swf have a huge advantage over the killer, and the game isnt balanced for that. And since only good killers would want to go at a match with a disadvantage, queue times would go up for swf, and they would actually have matches vs killers that could handle the disadvantage, cutting them off of their easy victorys. SWF´s dont want that, they want the easy game in the first place, and to bully the killer.
and since survivors outnumber killers, you dont get a vote if oyu play with a handicap or not.
Exactly. Swfs should not be a forced part of the game. Survivors and killers should be provided options when it comes to swfs.
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@Moundshroud said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/198707/why-is-the-swf-option-a-forced-thing
Because they haven't taken the next step of breaking Solo and Team play into two Ques. It is my opinion that this will be the eventual course of action as attempts to balance it the other way are simply too complicated and doomed to failure. It is the prevailing belief that if they TOLD Killers who was and wasn't a SWF that we wouldn't play them. I disagree, personally at least. I would play them. I just resent being kept in the dark at the same time as they tells us SWF isn't a competitive edge. If it isn't, why don't you let us know and make up our own minds?
I play SWF all the time and most Killers can recognize them pretty fast in the Lobby, and certainly from the coordination inside the match. I don't know about other Killers but I'm not constantly ducking Lobbies to avoid them. When I leave a Lobby it is generally because recognize someone I simply do not want to play with because of some previous Salt or hacks.
I feel the 3-Person SWF are the worst because they get a "Red Shirt," i.e. someone not part of their group and that poor soul rarely gets the same protection or help as the others. They see this person as a disposable asset, something they can earn points on and use to distract the Killer. I can't tell you how many times I've watched the Red Shirt die on the hook without a single attempt to save them while the SWF Gen-Rush. I wish this was an exaggeration.
I agree about with you about the solo player assessment. More then a few new players i've run into quit because of the toxic swf as survivor or killer. They just don't think it's worth it. If bhvr did a survey on new players that don't play anymore. I believe toxicity would be the #1 reason.
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Why would killers only play solo queues? Because they are tired of toxic swfs? It would kill the game. Really? I don't think it would. I think it would balance it. Because there would be choices for solo players currently and new incoming that won't have to endure the swf option unless they want too. The game has more then enough cocky and solid players without the forced swf option. I am not saying get rid of it. Just allow the players to have the option.
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@Onyx_Blue said:
Trying to find a match as SWF is actually so broken now.
The game refuses to load you into lobbies together. It bugs out and either kicks you to the menu or leaves you there trying to find one with every other player experiencing different things on their perspectives. "I'm ready" "you're not" "no one is even in my lobby" "we're all ready on my screen". Etc etc
Well done devs, well done. Making your game ever so unplayable and infruriating with every update.
Thank You devs one bug i will appreciate. 😊😄😍😍😍😍