abusterz
abusterz
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@esarraf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4113113#Comment_4113113
Just to clarify, killers don't need to make a 3 gen. Like, you can just camp three gens at the start of a match.
I think this may just be a difference in server experience. I mainly play on Asian servers, especially Hong Kong and Japan, and I personally run into these situations quite often there.
Some Killers care more about getting the 3K/4K than how long the match takes, so they'll happily drag a game out for another 20–30 minutes if that's what it takes.
I'm not saying they're playing wrong. I'm just hoping the devs can pay attention to this kind of extreme late-game stalemate, because winning doesn't necessarily mean the gameplay is still fun or engaging.
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Just to clarify
I just want to clear up one thing about my original post.
It's not trying to make these situations worse for Killer players, and I'm definitely not saying Survivors should just get extra advantages whenever they're losing.
What I'm really trying to do is improve the late-game experience for both sides.
If a Killer creates a strong 3-gen, wins their chases, manages their resources well, and eventually wins the match, that's completely fair. I have no problem with that.
What I'm questioning is whether it's really a good experience for the Killer either to spend another 20–30 minutes patrolling the same three generators over and over, or standing over a downed Survivor while waiting for the last Survivor to show up.The Killer might be winning during that time, but winning doesn't necessarily mean the gameplay is fun or engaging.
So I'm not really suggesting we should buff Survivors or nerf Killers.
I'm suggesting that there could be some kind of late-game system that kicks in when a match gets stuck in an extreme stalemate, and helps both sides get back to actually playing the game.
Game should be something we enjoy playing, not something we feel like we're being forced to endure.
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@MashedBroccoli said:
the only people stalling in a 3 gen scenario are the survivors. Don’t want to wait it out do the gen, killer interrupts you? Don’t leave the 3 gen keep them busy within it they won’t leave the 3 gen.
Worst case scenario you die but atleast its not a 30 minute match.
In most cases a 3 gen is entirely the fault of survivors. There are some exceptions though with maps like fallen refuge.
I think "the worst case is that you die" is actually a good example of my concern.
Leaving the 3-gen doesn't necessarily force the Killer to chase you. They can simply stay on the three generators, and late-game Survivors also have fewer pallets and resources available for long chases.
And in Solo Queue, effective coordination is much harder unless you're playing with three or four people.So if the solution to a prolonged stalemate is simply "sacrifice yourself so the match ends faster", I don't think that really solves the gameplay problem.
I'm not saying Survivors should always have a way to win. Players should ideally have meaningful choices even when they are losing. -
@pidgeon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4113030#Comment_4113030
You don't even need to be in a swf to stop 3 gens, most of my solo queue games I can point at a gen for my teammate and they'll do it whilst I pressure the other gen.
I agree that Solo Queue players can sometimes coordinate without voice communication. The problem is that it depends on whether your teammates understand what you're trying to do, and even good coordination doesn't necessarily solve every extreme 3-gen situation.
I've also encountered many Killers on Asian servers who simply refuse to take unnecessary chases and focus on holding the three generators. You can leave the area, but they don't have to follow you.
So I'm not saying 3-gens are impossible to counter. I'm saying that being counterable in many situations doesn't mean extreme, prolonged stalemates don't exist.
That's the specific point I'm trying to address. -
@SpyUA said:
So what does the killer side get from this?, countering 3 gen might be hard in solo q but it's incredibly easy in swf as 2 survivors can be on one gen and other 2 occupy other gen that further away and when killer comes to one gen do the other gen, there's a gen kick limit and the killer would either waste time going to one gen and the other while survivors are getting progress or the killer would be chasing and wasting time for survivors to get progress, this should take 5 minutes max to complete the gen.
Doing a 3 gen is quite essential for killers like hag and trapper, and they are the best at doing it.
The 2 survivors thing is an issue because of the hatch which should be changed.
I think my 30+ minute match is a good example of what I mean.I have a match on Dead Dawg Saloon. I was actually trying to repair the middle generators specifically to prevent a 3-gen, but my teammates finished the generators around the Water Tower side, leaving the Gallows generator and the two generators behind it in a very compact area. The Killer was The Deathslinger, so breaking that 3-gen became extremely difficult.
I agree that Survivors can sometimes prevent or break a 3-gen through coordination, even in Solo Queue. But that's exactly why I'm talking about extreme cases, not saying that every 3-gen is unfair or impossible to counter.
The same applies to the two-Survivor situation. I agree that the Hatch mechanic is part of the reason Killers may choose to keep a Survivor down while looking for the other one.
My throught is that in both situations, the Killer can still make meaningful progress toward winning while the Survivors may spend a very long time with very few meaningful options.
I'm thinking whether the game should have some way to recognize an extreme stalemate and make the situation evolve instead of allowing the same low-interaction loop to continue indefinitely.