Skaraok
Skaraok
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@Mandy said:
Made For This is something we are going to be monitoring, for right now we don't feel that it needs much change - it will continue to be monitored over the coming weeks.
"We added a built-in cheat. We think it's fine despite its rampant popularity and the myriads of complaints. Give us your money."
Community Manager - 2023
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Couldn't agree with everything you said more. I started playing this game at the beginning of 2018. I've seen the highs and lows, and I've seen the trends. DBD has been in a downward spiral ever since Legion released. With dedicated servers and the new engine, the game has been in an increasingly buggy and unplayable state. Not sure if it's because of the engine limitations, or because of sheer ineptitude, but it's getting old real fast.
I grinded out every challenge and by the time I completed the Rift, I bought the last couple of tiers just to be able to stop playing the game. I don't think I'll ever be able to 100% abandon the game because I'm a steam achievement hunter but I seriously don't see this game surviving another 4 years like Mcote says.
Godspeed friend, I hope you find a much more enjoyable multiplayer experience.
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@Monlyth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863318#Comment_863318
To me, the core concept of the Spirit is being able to turn invisible and move really fast, in any direction she chooses, and able to change directions as much as she wants. The whole "psychological manipulation" aspect of it really doesn't work in practice.
Spirit is not a stealth killer. Spirit is a killer who ######### with everything that survivors consider "normal" about a killer. This is exemplified by her lack of a power animation, her confusing TR, her omnidirectional whoosh, her lack of a vault anim, etc etc. That doesn't mean that she's unbeatable by any means. The strongest counter to Spirit is the thing that counters every single other killer in the game: doing your objective. If you dick around against a semi-decent Spirit and try to loop her like you're playing against Trapper, you will inevitably die.
Sorry you don't have fun against her. I love her power, I think she's an amazing killer who's fun to play against and requires more brain cells than an average survivor game can muster up. Have to agree with DelsKibara, I want all killers in this game to be strong in their own right - I don't want to play a game where I just fight against M1 killers every game and ROFLstomp every single one of them.
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I completely agree with everything except for the charge animation. Psychological manipulation is part of the core concept of Spirit and I think it'd be nice to keep at least one element of that. Survivors need to be aware of the limitations of her power and get punished for not paying attention while fighting against her. I also think that if these changes went through, I'd like to keep the current lack of a vault animation for the little extra mindgame potential.
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@Almo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/849040#Comment_849040
The top mend time with Legion's two addons was ridiculous. So we considered, "What happens if we reduce mend time across the board?" Borrowed Time gets a buff, Legion gets a bit of a nerf, and some other things showed up on the list. We decided it was worthwhile to hit it across the board.
As always, we'll monitor the effect that has on the game, and act accordingly in the future.
So lemme get this straight.
You took a hard look at Legion and Borrowed Time, you KNOW Legion is a weak killer, and you KNOW Borrowed Time is a hard meta perk, and yet you and others on the developer team thought that nerfing Legion again was a GOOD IDEA?
Can you guys just openly admit that you despise killer players already?
(By the way, Legion's mend time with double Blades was 20 seconds. 20. #########. Seconds. And this was considered a "ridiculous" amount of time. Get the ######### out of here. You know how fast generators get finished.)
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818180#Comment_818180
Well I hardly wield the influence to effect changes.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818226#Comment_818226
I got your point. And yes, fun by itself can't be the sole reason. But that's not the root of the issue with Spirit. The root is counter play is very limited. There's a handful of tricks you can try. And most good Spirit players won't fall for them. I don't think most survivors mind dying. They mind feeling like there's nothing they can do. While that's not exactly true with Spirit. It's not that far off either.
She has counterplay. The thing that survivors don't like about her is the fact that you can't sit at a pallet and press spacebar to win like you can with every other killer.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818226#Comment_818226
Coincidentally, she also happens to average three kills per game if not higher (with the target being two kills two escape). Fun is definitely a factor, but not the only thing that's considered. A game is meant to be fun though, advocating for not making the game fun is a hard sell.
Appreciate the reply. I have fun playing as Spirit. I have fun playing against Spirit. She's my favorite killer in the game.
I just hope that you and the dev team consider all angles before doing the same thing to Spirit that you did to Legion.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818121#Comment_818121
Dude it's a balancing act. You understand they are trying to balance around all skill levels. To ensure the most players possible enjoy the game as much as possible.
You missed the point of my post entirely.
"Fun" should not be the sole reason for nerfing a killer, because "fun" is entirely subjective. If certain survivor players got their way, I guarantee there would be very few killer players having "fun."
If a killer is getting 4k's too consistently, or there's something specifically broken about their power (*Legion*), that's one thing. That's not why survivors want Spirit changed.
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The sad part is, you will get more points from a Bloody Party Streamer then you'll get from burning a Pustula, and that's assuming you can actually do the hook/gen in the match.
Utterly shameful.
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@HamdaN said:
the moment u said pig and freddy this whole post lost its validity. freddy is now A tier and pig is completely fine... her helmet during egc would be beyond busted. you sound beyond entitled
Do you actually play any of the killers I mentioned or are you just here to flame?
And by play I don't mean "I play one match of this killer a month for a daily." Do you have any investment in killer whatsoever?
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@Peanits said:
To say that nobody asked for changes is objectively untrue. It doesn't take much searching to find a whole trove of videos, threads, and comments about The Spirit. I think you're missing the point of the argument, it's very rarely about how powerful she is, it's about not being fun to play against. You cannot tell someone that they're having fun when they're not, that's not up to you to decide.
If you want to argue that a video game shouldn't be fun to play, I'm not sure what to say at that point.
I'm not having fun against Trapper. Can we make it so that he only has one bear trap and it's a guaranteed escape?
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@TheKingOfAll said:
There was literally no way to fix old Freddy’s power, it needed a complete overhaul.
They did go a bit overboard with nurse, but it’s not that bad.
Old legion was absolutely awful to play against with no counterplay.
The problem with pig’s endgame collapse was if there was a minute on the collapse timer, and you got a hat on you, you were guaranteed dead. I think they could have done something better, and I dislike it, but it would have been broken.
In my opinion, I think spirit needs to be changed slightly, but not destroyed. Just remove collision, maybe add a vaulting animation, and remove prayer beads, and she’s fine.
Doctor really isn’t that bad if you know how to play him right. It’s difficult, but you can still win. I do think they need to buff him slightly, maybe make the yellow range addon base kit. But he’s not that bad.
I understand your anger, but try to think about everything from both perspectives.
I do consider both sides. The problem is that the developers only consider if a killer is fun for survivors when they rework them. Nurse and Legion are not fun to play in their current state.
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As a Spirit main myself, I think she's in a fine place balance wise, but here are some changes that I would make:
- Give her a little less charge speed or slightly more duration at base.
- Revert Prayer Beads to what they did on PTB (Moderately decreases the range of the sound emission radius while using Yamaoka's Haunting.)
- Remove survivor collision with the Spirit during phasing, but not the husk.
- Change the Phasing sound effect that it will now play regardless of whether or not the survivor is in her terror radius.
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And here, I'll post some games that I played over the past week just to prove that I'm not bullshitting to anyone here.
20190929210631_1.jpg ClownQuad.jpg ClownOP.jpg WraithQuad2.jpg PostReworkFreddyQuad.jpgAgain, this isn't PROOF that these killers are viable at red ranks. It just means that the survivors in these games play exceptionally poorly.
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EDIT: Had to repost because the spam filter hates me. Come on now.
You make a lot of assumptions for someone who claims to play at Red ranks.
I can't speak for anyone but myself, but I know many people here and in other Discords pretty much universally agree that killers like Trapper, Wraith, Plague, and Leatherface are underperforming and need buffs.
I've been pipping/double pipping at red ranks with Wraith and Legion and do you know what I see? I see terrible survivors who don't know how to loop properly, make dumb altruism saves, and constantly make stupid mistakes that cost them the game. Or they do something incredibly cocky like they all rush for a basement save against a killer with Save the Best for Last or NOED and 3 people get downed.
You said you play solo survivor? That will make a huge difference in your success rate. I have a SWF group that I play with occasionally. Myself with 1.5k hours, one with 3-4k, and others with over 1k hours. We can pull off a 4-man escape at least 90% of the time, regardless of killer or perks. The only games where we don't is when one of us makes a bad play, or the killer snowballs too hard, or we piss around and don't do gens. When I play solo, I usually get creamed by the killer because people can't loop, or don't do gens, or I [BAD WORD] up and it costs us the game because my teammates can't pick up the slack. M1 killers are not viable at red ranks.
The main problem is SWF, but a lot of it comes down to S-tier perks being stacked and godawful map design, too. (Seriously, please, BHVR, can we get a new map designer? Pretty please?) A 4-man solo with experience and coordination can be just as scary as a 4-man SWF with comms and full loadouts. The fact that you never see these players just tells me that you don't play killer at red ranks.
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Imagine believing that not being able to infinitely run a killer around an unsafe pallet or LT wall is having an "unfair advantage", Lmfao.
I'm sorry but, if you seriously think that the Entity blocker is an unfair mechanic then you're terrible at survivor. Looping is so ######### braindead easy once you figure out how to do it consistently that you'd have to have barely any playtime in this game to make such an absurd claim.
Actually, I'm being disingenuous. You don't even have to loop these days. Just camp the pallet while your team does gens and you win. GG EZ.
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@Mochan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/699378#Comment_699378
This is a ridiculous statement that only a newb killer who has never played Survivor can possibly say.
Sorry, but you are so out of touch with the game that nothing you say is convincing.
Ruin is a huge deal at every rank except at the absolute highest where everyone hits great skill checks with ease (these players are not common). Sometimes it gets blow up early, sometimes it wins you the game all by itself. There's a degree of luck involved, but saying it doesn't slow the game down is a stupid statement at best, a downright ignoramus' sentiment at worst.
Even if Ruin blows up within the first minute of the game it still probably stopped that clump of survivors who spawned next to a gen from rushing the first gen.
I can't count the number of times I wanted rush the first gen with the guy beside me who had Prove Thyself but couldn't because one or both of us was messing up the skill checks every few seconds.
There's a reason why like 80% (or more I don't know) of killers run Ruin, because it is effective and it really does slow the game down. And this is true even in the purple and red ranks.
I'm out of touch with the game? I guess my multiple 100%s and dozens of escapes against top tier killers don't count for jack, then. You're probably right tho, I'm just some newb who's never played survivor.
I already explained why Ruin is trash in my previous comments. It has absolutely no effect on survivors who actually know what they're doing, aren't stubborn, and are willing to play the game. The reason that it's "so effective" at every rank other than the top tier (you know, where the good players are?) is because BAD SURVIVORS ARE BAD. And you have the top streamers like Tru3 and Morf reciting the same BS narrative that everyone should just run Ruin because "it's the best perk in the game" while they get constant 4ks on braindead survivors who can't loop for #########. So glue-sniffing killers at low ranks eat it up, run Ruin and Spirit Fury on Hillbilly every game, facecamp, and jerk off Hex: Ruin as the divine god of killer perks. Play against people who actually know how to do generators sometime.
If you're messing up skill checks literally every few seconds as survivor, then sorry, I'm not sure what to tell you. Maybe you just need to practice some more? There's a helpful tool online that you can look up to help you get better at hitting skill checks. I'm not perfect myself, I can only hit greats around 60%-70% of the time (and I need to warm up first), but I'm definitely not gullible enough to continue working on a generator with teammates who can't even hit skill checks correctly.
You are right about one thing, though. Nothing I say will convince you, and you're never going to convince me. Now go back to being camped at Rank 8.
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@PickCollins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/699378#Comment_699378
That's the most ignorant statement ever. Ruin is an amazing perk even if it gets smashed by ur first down. The only time ruin isn't useful is when it gets smashed at the start of the game, but adapting to the shift makes it possible to still come out on top.
Mate, if I'm getting Ruin consistently broken in the first 30 seconds of the match, why on Earth would I continue to run Ruin? I could do much better work with Pop or Discordance. Ruin is only effective against bad survivors because they stamp their feet and refuse to just power through the Hex checks, or they all gang up on one generator and constantly hit good skill checks. News flash: You should NOT GANG UP ON ONE GENERATOR unless it's the very last one, or you have PT. The survivors in OP's video were smart, they spread out. Would Ruin have saved him a little time? Sure, maybe a few seconds. Probably not enough to save the match. I have never had a problem doing Ruin gens after the 300-hour mark of playing this game.
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@Mochan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/699378#Comment_699378
This is a ridiculous statement that only a newb killer who has never played Survivor can possibly say.
Sorry, but you are so out of touch with the game that nothing you say is convincing.
Ruin is a huge deal at every rank except at the absolute highest where everyone hits great skill checks with ease (these players are not common). Sometimes it gets blow up early, sometimes it wins you the game all by itself. There's a degree of luck involved, but saying it doesn't slow the game down is a stupid statement at best, a downright ignoramus' sentiment at worst.
Even if Ruin blows up within the first minute of the game it still probably stopped that clump of survivors who spawned next to a gen from rushing the first gen.
I can't count the number of times I wanted rush the first gen with the guy beside me who had Prove Thyself but couldn't because one or both of us was messing up the skill checks every few seconds.
There's a reason why like 80% (or more I don't know) of killers run Ruin, because it is effective and it really does slow the game down. And this is true even in the purple and red ranks.
I'm out of touch? I guess my multiple 100%s on this game and hundreds of perfect Laurie games don't count for jack. You're right tho, I'm just a newb who's never played survivor.
Ruin is RNG. Plain and simple. I explained why it's trash in my previous comments. Against survivors who actually know what they're doing, it's a waste of a perk slot.
If you're missing great skill checks literally every few seconds then I'm sorry, I don't really know what to tell you. Maybe you need to get better at survivor? There's a helpful tool online that you can search with Google to help you practice skill checks. I'm definitely not perfect, I only hit greats around 60% of the time, but I'm sure as hell not stupid enough to keep bashing my head against a generator with 3 people and Ruin up when I'm too ######### at the game to even hit greats.
You're right about one thing, though. I'm not going to convince you, and you're not going to convince me. Now go back to getting camped at Rank 8.
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@PickCollins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/699274#Comment_699274
The devs aren't touching gen speeds bc they like where they are at.
As I've said and you've kinda failed to dispute there's a wide range of anti gen perks you can run. CI prevents Surviviors from being able to pop the gen they spawn at on the off chance you search the wrong gen in the beginning and it forces them to approach you if they want to start the game off on a high note. Surge combined with Surveillance allows you to spot nearby Surviviors and hinder their repair speed. Tremors is an amazing tracking and stalling perk especially with Surge combod with it.
Ur only real argument you can give me here is ur one against Ruin and it's all this virtue signalling "I'm not gonna be a metaslave and you can't make me" BS. Blah blah blah. You don't wanna run Ruin we get it. Something about not wanting to metaslave or something like that.
And I used the killer rulebook analogy bc it's pretty hilarious how many times killers go out of their way to get pissed with Surviviors for doing stuff and act like camping or Tunnelling is supposed to be a form of penance for breaking their made up rules. I mean imagine thinking Decisive strike isn't balanced. Oh wait...
"DS, cuz that's a fair and balanced perk too".
I'm told Noed is balanced bc it has counterplay. DS has counterplay too, so by that logic it's balanced. So....shut up.
Ruin does nothing to slow the game down. The fact that you think it does is laughable.
The ONLY reason that Ruin works as absurdly well as it does, is because low rank morons spend ######### ages Urban Evasioning around the map searching for a totem instead of doing the generators. Either that, or they're just so ridiculously bad at the game that they can't do gens and/or they're extremely unlucky and get Hex skill checks every 5 seconds. That's literally the only reason why Ruin works.
In every other scenario, Ruin pops instantly and you're forced to play with 3 perks, OR the survivors literally just don't give a ######### about Ruin and powered through it. And don't give BS that none of these scenarios happen because I've been the survivor/killer player in every single one of them. Even today, I've done gens up to 50% or 75% without getting a single Hex skill check. Ruin is a ######### joke and everyone knows it.
As for the other stall perks that you brought up, most of them are either too situational to be used effectively (Thrilling, Surge) or wouldn't have worked against those survivors. Overcharge isn't really a great alternative for stalling unless you get potatoes. Surveillance and Pop might have been helpful, but they would have done absolutely nothing to help at the start of the game.
Now, I will concede that CI and Discordance can get work done, however. You presumably watched the video, you saw how those survivors were hyper focused on generators. Discordance wouldn't have helped because all of them spread out, and as Caretaker said CI would have just forced them onto other generators and he maaaaaaaaybe would have gotten 1-2 hooks before the first three gens were completed. But even that is a stretch.
The truth is, Legion is ultimately a low tier killer and any survivor with two clumps of braincells to knock together would have kicked his ass in that match. If he had run NOED and CI? Yeah sure, he would have gotten at least 1-2 kills, maybe even a 4k if they screwed up badly enough. But ANY killer can be genrushed to hell if you know how to play correctly. I've seen it happen so many goddamn times and done it myself so many goddamn times over the past 2 years, and it's frankly unbelievable to me that it's STILL this bad.
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@Caretaker said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/696335#Comment_696335
100% agreed. You're definitely at your weakest early game having to spend time to find a survivor. I usually have good luck and know the spawns fairly well. Even then between finding and the subsequent chase you're going to lose gens if they're smart.
I'd really like it if we had gears or something needed to fix the gens before you can repair them. If regressing it worked like Overcharge and you had to hit skillchecks before being able to repair it again. Anything really.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/696336#Comment_696336
Ah, very true. A disciple of Morf's I see. :^)
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/696337#Comment_696337
See, and I could just go Nurse. I know in the end I said Ebony Omega Nurse time, but I don't really play the hard meta killers much. I don't run addons, I don't run Ruin or Sloppy(I think they're both trash if I'm being honest). I try my best to double hook everyone, I don't tunnel etc. Sadly I think it's come to the point where I can't play my fave which is Legion. Hell, I played M1 addonless Legion before his masssive nerf and still had fun/did well. If games keep up like this then yup, I'll have to play Nurse. At least her new skin looks fantastic.
I feel your pain Caretaker, I was having a ton of fun memeing around with low rank survivors this past weekend. Then ST chapter hits, and on launch day I'm getting P3 tryhard survivors Rank 1-2 every match and forced to play like a bully just to get one kill. Thankfully the game has calmed down a bit for me since Demo's release.
I really hate playing like a toxic killer, I don't like tunneling cause you lose points for it and you let survivors work on gens uninterrupted, and I despise facecamping because it's boring as hell. But then you get squads like this one, and it makes you want to Ebony mori people with Nurse/Spirit. What a shameful display.
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3 terrible killers in a row, countless nerfs to slugging, and a Freddy rework that removes his stall and will probably leave him in a worse place than when he started.
Pretty good 6 months so far.
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Seems like a lot of players have abandoned Plague entirely, gone back to their mains or playing survivor.
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Killers already get punished for hard camping. They nerfed Chaser twice for that very reason. If you want to punish a camping killer, just wait out the hook timer.
A killer who plays fair and doesn't tunnel shouldn't be penalized if a survivor decides they don't want to play the game.
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Doesn't really make sense from a lore perspective. Killers are individuals whom the Entity chose to feed its appetite. Why would a force like Death serve the Entity even if it had a physical form?
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I get that, but the grind in this game is already insane and gets worse with every update. It takes millions of bloodpoints just to completely max out one character, tens of millions if you decide to prestige at any point. And with every chapter we have to grind out 9 more levels on EVERY character.
I think removing the tiers would be a good change because A, it makes good perks much more accessible for new players. B, it decreases the grind which is good for everyone. And C, it incentives people to play more of killer and survivor because most people tend to completely max out one side and don't bother with the other.
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What was the inspiration for Adiris, and why did you specifically choose to go with the sickness idea for her power?