Normiree
Normiree
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@Derp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/655244#Comment_655244
I'm not sure how I came off as offensive in my post but if you were offended by it then that wasn't my intentions at all so relax.
You agreed with me but you followed it up by saying, "What I meant was that the perk discourages the killer from tunneling the unhooked survivor rather than going for the rescuer", which is contradicting. Keep in mind, I said Borrowed Time does that, not Babysitter, since the killer can still tunnel the unhooked survivor when he isn't leaving scratch marks or blood pools.
The Bond versus Better Together debate does matter because it isn't a matter of opinion. Just because you prefer other perks over it doesn't mean it's garbage, its just not suited for your play style. If someone said Balanced Landing or Adrenaline is terrible, you wouldn't say anything? I mean why else would those perks be meta while others aren't being used at all. If it all boiled down to opinions, then I can say Wake Up is really good and you'd have to respect that.
If you think there are perks that are better than Fixated then I would like to know what they are since I don't see any.
Inner Strength synergizes well with Quick and Quiet and Head On because it allows the perk to be used in a chase as well. You use Quick and Quiet to lose the killer mid-chase, wait for the killer to come towards your locker, and hit them with Head On. It will most likely take the killer over 8 seconds to figure out where you are so Inner Strength should've activated by then. After the killer gets stunned, they now have to chase a healthy survivor. As for Thrill of the Hunt and Iron Maiden, they're still trash perks unless used in a gimmicky build and both counters to Inner Strength aren't that good.
Trust me that you did not come off as offensive. I was just distracted and frustrated by other threads and people. I had fun discussing the new perks, although I think it felt more like a contest and I felt discouraged toward the end. It feels unsatisfactory to post when most discussions only give the illusion of a conversation. I think that I am going to take a break from visiting the forums after this message.
I was using the clarification of tunneling as provided by Peanits in this comment. The critical part of this definition is that tunneling only applies to survivors that are within a short time of being unhooked. As you said, Borrowed Time discourages killers from tunneling, but Babysitter is different. It helps the unhooked survivor escape at any distance, but its effects are reduced if the killer is close. That is why I made a distinction between the perk discouraging against tunneling and it discouraging the killer from going for the unhooked survivor. More importantly, this debate was unrelated to the original topic. It felt annoying to address because it was so insignificant, and we probably agree about Babysitter's usage. I don't think that there was any reason to nitpick this much about it.
In short, the Bond versus Better Together does not matter. It is just another nitpick that stifled our discussion. I am not accessing how often the community will use it or how others feel about the perk. I am merely giving my opinion about Better Together's current benefits and how good I think it will be from my experience. It is well designed and a nice perk to have, but I do not agree that the perk is good. I like existing alternatives more. I heard your reasons for why Better Together was better than Bond. That's fine, but it feels like you cannot respect that I have a different opinion.
Like Better Together, I was only commenting on how I felt about the current state of Fixated. It just feels genuinely weak to me, and I do not think that it justifies a perk slot. Quick and Quiet and Dance with Me seem like better stealth perks, although I would have to test out Fixated to confirm that. I would rather ditch fixated for a more reliable or fun perk, like Lithe.
Inner Strength is by far her most potent perk. As a result, I do not honestly know how it will affect the meta. I still disagree about its usage in a chase, but I can understand your argument. Based on later comments, I'm guessing that you would agree that it is much less efficient out of a chase. It's healing speed is fast, but it is still not by much, and the perk does have a practical limit of uses. I think that the main difference between our opinions is Inner Strength's performance in a chase. I wish that difference was the focus of this part of the discussion, but instead, it just felt repetitive.
I wrote a lot because I am most likely not going to view or respond to future posts. I did not want to end my involvement with this discussion on an unfinished note. However, I learned some interesting stuff, like @Marcus mentioned that Hex: Thrill of the Hunt does not provide a notification on dull totems. Despite this being one of the better discussions, it is just not satisfying or worth it anymore to post stuff to the community.
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@TerminatorGuy said:
Probably can't happen anymore, but Sidney Prescott from Scream.
This
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@Derp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/652694#Comment_652694
Babysitter doesn't discourage tunneling, BT does that. Babysitter just helps the unhooked survivor hide from the killer or lose track of them which is pointless because BT literally prevents you from going down and if a killer is closing in or camping them then there's no point in leaving no scratch marks or blood pools as they already know where the survivor is heading. I can see it being kind of useful against stealthy killers that makes BT difficult to trigger but not by much. Better Together allows every survivor to see the aura of the gen you are working on within 32 meters while Bond is only 4 meters more and only shows the aura of survivors to the person that's using it so comparing the two perks together just doesn't work. Fixated can be useful to lose the killer in certain loops and walking 20% faster can also come in handy in many situations. To put it simply, Fixated is kind of like Windows of Opportunity but with scratch marks and Urban Evasion but for walking combined as this perk can come in handy mid-chase or when you're trying to hide. As for Inner Strength, you can do some pretty sick plays with it by hiding in a locker mid chase and then have this activate but it's pretty difficult to do which is the downside but I'd say it's worth the risk.
@Derp said:
"You're right that Babysitter does not discourage tunneling. What I meant to say is that the perk discourages the killer from targeting the unhooked survivor instead of their rescuer." In other words, you meant it discourages tunneling.
I agree that Bond and Better Together can be compared to some extent since they both provide information to yourself and the other survivors. Better Together is better in that you can start a gen in the middle or on a gen that'll prevent the 3 gen strat and have others work on it with you. It also lets the survivor know that they shouldn't go towards a gen aura when being chased by the killer. Every time I'm about to finish a gen, which is usually at around 80-95% progression, a survivor brings the killer to me and goes down right next to it. They get hooked and then the killer kicks the gen with Pop Goes the Weasel. Now the progression goes down to like 50% and I have to do all that work again. Even then, the killer now knows the gen is almost done so they defend it to prevent me or any survivor from completing it. Also, being able to see every survivor after you complete a gen is pretty helpful in that it can let you know if you should do another gen or go for the hook save. Bond's range is only 4 meters more than Inner Strength so saying Bond is better in that aspect doesn't really matter since it's so minimal.
As for Fixated, I compared it to Windows of Opportunity because they both provide information on how to survive against the killer during a chase. Fixated can be used by itself or paired with Lightweight to help you manipulate the scratch marks, which could make the killer lose you during a chase. As for Windows of Opportunity, it's self explanatory. Walking 20% faster is good for the same reason as Urban Evasion. It helps you hide better by making you move around faster, which in turn, helps you change hiding spots when the killer is looking for you, and can enable you to lose the killer's line of sight around corners when your not producing scratch marks. I've also had moments where I run around the map but I know the killer is coming near my location so i start hiding. I continue to hide, thinking the scratch marks will go away by the time the killer comes close but I end up miscalculating it and get caught. In this situation, the perk will let me know if I should hide or just run away.
Inner Strength can be paired with Quick and Quit, Head On, or both to make it more efficient. Now saying the perk probably isn't going to be that good because it might be nerfed in the future is just speculation. Iron Maiden is just a garbage perk and I don't think it's a good counter to Inner Strength because the exposed effect is only 15 seconds long, which survivors can easily last before getting hit. Thrill of the Hunt is also a pretty bad counter since you're just wasting a perk slot to defend dull totems unless you're running another hex totem like Ruin or something but even then, it can easily be cleansed since most killers don't have that much map pressure.
Derp, what are you talking about? You stated in your first reply that Babysitter does not discourage tunneling. The reason why I agreed with you is because I consider tunneling when the killer goes after the unhooked survivor right after they get unhooked. Babysitter doesn't help with that but instead helps the unhooked survivor escape and highlights the rescuer, discouraging the killer from targeting them. Why are you trying to correct me after I agreed with your first criticism?
The Bond versus Better Together debate does not matter. I just stated in my original post that I do not think that Better Together is a strong perk because I prefer ones that already exist. Why are you so fixated on proving me wrong on a point that does not really matter?
On the topic regarding Fixated, I still do not see how a small increase to walking speed and the ability to see your scratch marks will significantly help in a chase. It improves the survivor's chances, but there are so many better perks for a survivor to take instead of Fixated. On a good note, I can understand your comparison to Windows of Opportunity more.
I get what you are saying about Inner Strength. I do not think that it synergizes well with Quick and Quiet or Head On because they both work best in a chase. You are right about the speculation, but the likeness of it happening is the reason why I pointed it out. I also mentioned Iron Maiden and Hex: Thrill of the Hunt because they help the killer know where the survivor is if they try and use Inner Strength.
I'm sorry if this post sounds defensive or somehow aggressive, but I am just really fed up with the Dbd forums and the community. It's annoying to try and help others through steam discussions or the Dbd forums and end up receiving aggressive responses. The conversation goes from a discussion to a contest of who can prove the other person wrong. It's not specifically this thread, but a combination of different examples, like having random people commenting on my steam profile about how I am wrong about a topic. How do other people deal with the toxicity of this community?
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At the very least, I think that survivors should play the theme of their corresponding killer
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Only if this gets released first
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@Derp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/652694#Comment_652694
Babysitter doesn't discourage tunneling, BT does that. Babysitter just helps the unhooked survivor hide from the killer or lose track of them which is pointless because BT literally prevents you from going down and if a killer is closing in or camping them then there's no point in leaving no scratch marks or blood pools as they already know where the survivor is heading. I can see it being kind of useful against stealthy killers that makes BT difficult to trigger but not by much. Better Together allows every survivor to see the aura of the gen you are working on within 32 meters while Bond is only 4 meters more and only shows the aura of survivors to the person that's using it so comparing the two perks together just doesn't work. Fixated can be useful to lose the killer in certain loops and walking 20% faster can also come in handy in many situations. To put it simply, Fixated is kind of like Windows of Opportunity but with scratch marks and Urban Evasion but for walking combined as this perk can come in handy mid-chase or when you're trying to hide. As for Inner Strength, you can do some pretty sick plays with it by hiding in a locker mid chase and then have this activate but it's pretty difficult to do which is the downside but I'd say it's worth the risk.
You're right that Babysitter does not discourage tunneling. What I meant to say is that the perk discourages the killer from targeting the unhooked survivor instead of their rescuer. But I disagree with Bond and Better Together being non-comparable. They both are aura perks that function to unite survivors, or at the very least provide information about their location. Even though Bond presents this information to the user, and Better Together supplies it to others, they serve the same purpose in different ways. More importantly, the point I was trying to make was that I like the idea of Better Together, but it is not better than perks that are already available. As a result, I do not consider it a good perk, but you can think otherwise, and that's fine.
I still do not believe that fixated is going to be that helpful, although I think that is a unique perk. Seeing your scratch marks and walking faster are both nice gimmicks, but that does not make them powerful. Despite being a small detail, Could you explain the perk's connection to Windows of Opportunity? The two perks seem like training wheels for newer survivors, but I might be overlooking something that would relate them better.
I wouldn't doubt that it is possible to do some sick plays with Inner Strength. I don't think that it is practical in most chases because of the eight-second timer, but I agree that it can be useful when trying to hide. Using self-care to heal takes 32 seconds. Inner Strength should only take 22 seconds because cleansing a totem requires 14 seconds, and the actual healing process takes 8 seconds. But this is assuming that you can find a totem and a locker instantly. If the killer runs Hex: Thrill of the Hunt, it will take 20 seconds to cleanse the first totem and the total healing time would be 28 seconds. Even then, it still saves time for the survivor, and the perk will probably prevail because of that. But, I believe that it will not be as strong as what you would expect. It has a high chance that the developers will nerf it soon after its release. If that does not happen, killers will create builds to counter its effects. Iron Maiden will be used more to at least guide the killer in the direction of the healed survivor. If the killer runs Hex: Thrill of the Hunt, they will be notified early in the game where survivors are if one of them tries to complete the totem prerequisite.
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You both are wrong
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@joker7997 said:
Seriously think about it. It would be like the cannibal being the skin face. Or the pig being the pig head. Or the bear trapper. Or the Japanese spirit. The invisible wraith. I digress. Shoulda stuck with one words "the" names
I think it would be more like the cannibal being called the Leather Face
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On another note, I would really like to see Sally Hardesty added as an expansion to the Leatherface DLC. If it had to be a standalone character, I want to play as Isaac Clarke.
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I thought that since the Vote Up text on my posts still has a hover animation, I could self up-vote. I just actually tried it, and as expected it did not work. Thanks for the replies and sorry for the naive question.
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I do not think that camping is a big enough problem to justify such a dramatic change. I like the idea of guiding the killer away from the hook or survivors to generators, but punishing camping is ridiculous.
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@CoffengMin said:
second wind can actually ######### you on endgame if you had adrenaline and were on hook before last gen got done, thats a no no from me, id like it to be more of a if the killer stays X seconds around your hook at X meters , when you get saved you are in the healthy state instead of injured, itd make sense since his perks are all about countering camping/tunneling off hook
I would rather buff Second Wind and have Camaraderie counter camping in a similar way to that.
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Trapper is not as weak as people expect, and there are a lot more killers that deserve a rework first. I like the idea of the Trapper being able to place traps in less predictable locations, but I think that there are much less radical changes that could make him more fun to play. For example, all traps can start armed and more likely to appear near loops and generators although I would like to see a rework in the far future to make the Trapper more polished and distinguished as a killer.
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@ShadowReaper11 said:
Have any of you guys seen the original Myers movies compered to modern ones your thoughts
Original Halloween > Halloween 2018 > Halloween II > The Rest of Halloween Movies > Halloween III >>> Rob Zombie Remakes
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The Demo Gorgon
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I think the main problem with Second Wind is not that it does not have the potential to save a lot of time. Instead, the problem is that the perk is incredibly situational and promotes tunneling. The prerequisite is already somewhat high. That's fine, but it does not justify having the broken status effect, the perk not working in the killer's terror radius or its deactivation when downed.
I agree that while Camaraderie needs a rework. However, Babysitter is in a solid spot. It is not meant to be powerful, but instead courteous as it discourages tunneling. I think the only thing that would make it better is if it granted a post-game Bloodpoint bonus if the rescuer takes a protection hit or something similar.
Nancy's perks are not better, though. Better Together is nice to have, but I still would prefer Bond, considering it has a broader range. Fixated seems useless, and I don't think that Inner Strength will be that much more helpful. Considering it does not get nerfed within a week of its release, killers will start using builds that counter the perk.