frozzenk
frozzenk
About
- Username
- frozzenk
- Joined
- Visits
- 219
- Last Active
Comments
-
@smurf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3853363#Comment_3853363
Shouldn't fun be the reason people play the game?
Were you obtuse on purpose? The question is why is everything ok and nothing matters when it comes to survivors doing their objective, but when it comes to killers doing theirs, suddenly a bunch of factors show up.
Hopefully you understood the point now, though I suspect you understood it the first time and just pretended not to.
-
I typed "leeeeeoooon" once in chat (resident evil 4 flashbacks) and that was censored.
I typed "ty" once in chat and that was censored.
This chat filter is crazy. And yes, adults should not be weaker than children. They should be able to take words. But even if you insult your playerbase by assuming they are adults made of glass, this filter is STILL too much.
-
Why is it ok for survivors to do their objective but when killers do theirs suddenly the "community" makes up a bunch of rules and fun suddenly becomes a factor? Suddenly playing the objective becomes "toxic".
What do you call this phenomenon? Other than massive hypocrisy, that is.
-
@apathyinc said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852434#Comment_3852434
You ignored the part about the killer match result ranking dropping. The devs clearly stated that all kills will raise the killer match result ranking, all the way to merciless killer. Bleeding out a survivor drops it, so bleed outs aren't kills according to the game. The killer is taking no action to actively kill a survivor, so the timer is what ends up causing the survivor to die, not the killer.
This is a basic concept of the game, taught in the tutorial, and even a little picture example on the loading screen for a killer's first few matches. A killer isn't going to win if they can't grasp the basic concepts and objectives of the game.
Match result? What? Are you trying to compete on some invisible leader board or something?
Your gymnastics to try to paint a killer killing as "not a kill" are amazing. Do words mean different things where you come from? Or is this an issue with English proficiency (or lack thereof)?
You're the killer. You kill. A killer is going to win if they kill survivors. It doesn't matter if entitled people decide that, even though the killer killed them all, the killer still lost because he killed by means that they dislike. Talk about entitlement lol.
Call me when they change the "killer" name to "hooker" (no pun intended) and then we can have this conversation again.
-
@apathyinc said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852314#Comment_3852314
How can you say that bleeding survivors out is a legit method of killing when doing so won't let you complete daily rituals or adept achievements, and your match result ranking drops a rank for each survivor you do it to?
Daily rituals? What? I'm amazed people who care about that exist. Adept achievements? You do that once, big deal. Are those really your arguments?
Here's mine: You're the killer. You kill. The end.
-
@cheapslurpiee said:
I think "strategic slugging" as many in this thread are calling it is simply bad game design. A couple scenarios mentioned like "someone sabos hook with person on shoulder... drop person and chase sabo person" and a couple more make sense... that person can be picked up by other teammates if the other can loop well enough.
Slugging for a 4k at end game though?! Oh, you've lost me.... it's literally anti-game. Anti-agency. Your best version of a gameplay loop forces a player to be option-less for upwards of 4 minutes? Which is roughly 26% of what I suspect is the average length of a match of 15 mins... crazy work. I
That's what the hatch does. It rewards the losing team with an almost 50/50. Survivors can get absolutely stomped but the last guy standing will have a rough coin toss chance of "winning". Participation medals come to mind. It's nonsensical of course, but sadly necessary because otherwise people would grief the match hostage for 40 minutes ++. As they used to.
The killer has the logical best path for his role (which is to kill, by the way, in case people forget) aka slug for the 4k to try to counter the nonsense. A lot of people don't mind. A lot of people do. A lot of the time I alt tab when the 3rd survivor is killed. But guess what? Even alt tabbed it takes a long time sometimes because the survivor NEEDS me to show up to see them enter the hatch and won't enter otherwise. And then they come here to complain when some killers slug. You have to laugh.
Anyway, necessary evil because people are trolls. 4 minutes on the ground as someone is playing their objective is nothing compared to 40+ minutes as no one is playing anything and are just trolling.
-
@CursedPerson said:
Lets list the Negatives for that chapter.
- buggy killer
- search function is garbage
- using killers power is clunky
- dog doesnt feel the best to use or go against
- invocations are basically killer perks
- shoulder the burden is a bandaid
- buff thrill to be oppressive for no reason
Positive:
- character designs are cool
That positive is very debatable, though I'm not sure if you're allowed to say you don't think she is cool without people attacking you and trying to cancel you.
-
I think some people, for some unknown reason, have a difficulty understanding the difference between slugging someone just to leave them there for no reason when you could hook them with no downsides (such as letting people bleed out when all 4 survivors are slugged and they could finish the game by hooking but they refuse) and slugging as a tactic.
You'd think it would be pretty easy to understand, but apparently not.
-
I mean I get that it's part of online environments and parents who failed miserably at educating their children due to either incompetency or just not loving them, so cheaters will always exist.
What is inexcusable is that BHVR is not strict on the punishment. One offense and it should be a hardware ban. Period. Instead BHVR just gives them a slap on the wrist and then they go and make another account. THIS is the part that is absolutely blamable on BHVR for not doing better.
-
Are you guys raiding the forum or something? I've never seen a post about the middle east situation and today there's like 6 or 7 of them near the top, and I'm not even exaggerating.
-
Wait there's a free weekend right now?
-
People who want them to systematically statt adding bots are absolutely delusional and would kill any online game they worked for. Reminds me of some clowns advocating for bhvr to remove the leaver penalty back when they added bots on dc. Obviously didnt happen but if you were here then youll remember those clown posts.
Its an online game. People dont want to be interacting with bots. The instant you turn your game into a bot game by design (as opposed to just a failsafe to do a lesser evil situation when someone quits) you are activelly ruining your online game.
-
Why is a complete rework so off the table?
Something like making her unable to 360 for instance would probably not really hurt the 4k hours nurse player, and just make her even worse for beginners. So end of the day the issue is still there, aka the skilled nurse players are still going to stomp the life out of everyone. Meanwhile the unskilled nurse player will suffer more. In short a change like this would basically affect the opposite of what you'd ideally want to target.
Ideally you'd want to target her ceiling being so high it allows people to hit a point where the game is all but over when it starts. I don't see how this can be targeted without just completely reworking a power that is just breaking the fundamentals of the game.
-
Okay so let me see if I understand the nurse defenders right: They acknowledge nurse is strong, likely THE strongest. But since you cannot tap into that realm unless you are skilled then it is okay and should stay as it is. And everyone who is unlucky enough to find themselves against a skilled nurse should just accept they got the short end of the stick and that's that. Bad luck on the matchmaking! I mean, lockers, breaking LoS, etc etc are all there but if the nurse is truly skilled it won't help you. The end.
Is that the argument? And if not, how did I misinterpret it?
-
@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3841563#Comment_3841563
You've made accusations against BHVR but yet you have made 0 constructed feedback on your own post as to how you would solve this "issue" you are experiencing. How am I suppose to take your seriously?
Yeah - let me go to youtube as a form of "Data" I am being realistic and because it doesn't align with what you believe to be true about Nurse I am being "Disingenous" I didn't deny she was strong or annoying to go against…But your claim is that she is Overpowered. I feel that is a false claim. She isn't going around the map one shotting everyone instantly hooking survivors. She still has to get 2 hits. If she was that OP as you claim BHVR would have made changes to her by now….
Oh wait. They did. They nerfed her blinks, they nerfed the lunges, the fatigue was barely noticeable, they nerfed the addons..What more do you want? Honestly.
You didn't deny she was strong but your whole passive aggressive narrative of "skill issue???" implying it's me when you are aware that everyone and their mothers rank Nurse at the top, but conveniently chose to forget so you could be passive aggressive.
That's what makes you disingenuous.
-
@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3841544#Comment_3841544
Only if you know how to use her. She takes a lot of skill to use, she's temperamental on multi floored maps, she use to have 6 blinks instead of 2. She's not impossible to go against and shes been nerfed more times than I can count.
Skill issue maybe? Everyone struggles to go against at least 1 killer.
You're just being disingenuous. Go watch any tier list or whatever on youtube that is using strength as a metric (as opposed to fun or whatever other metric). You know she is at the top 1 or 2 (mostly 1) for every single one of those. I don't know why you're arguing as if that's just me. Just disingenuous man. Why?
-
@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/432870/why-is-nurse-allowed-to-be-broken
She is far from OP. Is she sometimes hard to deal with? Yes…There's a difference though. Also Nurse has had many changes and nerfs. She use to have 6 blinks sooooo……
What do you mean far from OP? Do we play the same game? She is top 1 most powerful killer in pretty much everyone's list.
-
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
Not every survivor is going to play this way.
Why is it hard to understand that watching grass grow under your character for 4 minutes is not the kind of gameplay people want?
It's hard to understand the hypocrisy of asking people to not do something that is effective yet understandably unpleasant, so you can then wait for them and t-bag at the hatch. Can you explain that?
-
Sadako has no chase power. Unless she is running an iridescent addon which is obviously expensive, you can do tape runs that consist of like 5 steps. You can also just keep a tape on your person to protect against stacking. She has to walk up to you and hit you if you have a tape because she has no chase power. Hell, even if you are at FULL CONDEMN because you decided to AFK the whole match, she still has to walk up to you and hit you. TWICE. Did I mention she has no chase power? If she is doing that easily then I'm sorry but you're just not a good survivor. Please improve instead of just complaining.
-
It's funny how there are so many people who prefer to spend their time complaining instead of learning the counter. You'd be surprised how many times I do a teleport a little bit into the game and then have like 3 heartbeats happening together. Not a single person bothered to do the counter. And then you go in the forum and they are here going "omg she is so oppressive!".
-
@Venusa said:
All the Onryo's I went against since the patch just spam teleport to build condemned and easily mori you in a few minutes. So far no engaging gameplay.
It's like they looked at Onryo's playstyles and said how can we promote the most unfun, obnoxious playstyle that makes people want to quit the game.
There is one, you are just uncapable of doing it, judging by your "she just spam teleport to build condemned and easily mori you" report. Don't blame the game for your own shortcomings. Read my previous post if you are lost somehow.
-
I hate them honestly. Pyramid Head's is awful.
-
Literally all you have to do is pick up a tape. Lord almighty, why is this so hard? This gives you an aegis shield against her condemn unless she physically hits you. She has no chase power. Don't be awful at looping. Get into a locker if necessary. This counters her hitting tape.
-
@Zakon05 said:
Yeah someone corrected me on that already, my mistake. But the point is that there is no reason not to hook someone now.
The fact it's destroyed on a hit makes that even more true. If it were destroyed on a down, then an argument could be made that not hooking them is still a good idea because of Off The Record. But since it's on a hit... yeah I really can't think of any reason not to hook a survivor given the opportunity.
Of course there are reasons to still slug. Think of this: Hooking doesn't further condemn. Teleporting and hitting does. You just downed someone and other survivors are currently holding tapes. The time you're spending walking someone to a hook is time you could spend hitting someone else and making sure tapes aren't free and you're pressuring them properly. Assuming, again, that other people are holding tapes (the iridescent addon is pretty much mandatory here but that's another can of bad design entirely). The downed guy no longer has a tape on him because it was destroyed on hit. Ergo, you no longer care about him until the moment he picks up a tape again. Until that moment you are teleporting and pressuring tape holders to make sure they are being punished for holding.
-
@Zakon05 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491935#Comment_3491935
Getting to hook them basically for free is pretty nice. Remember you can't flashlight save on locker grabs anymore, aside from that trickery with slow exiting the locker. If they get in a locker, you don't build condemned (maybe... unless the PTB is up right now, you're really just guessing that grabbing people doesn't count as a hit for the purposes of building condemned - it's a good guess but it's still a guess), but you're definitely going to get the hook now.
Look, you're really just going to have to accept that BHVR doesn't want condemned to be Sadako's main method of killing survivors. There's no healthy way to make that a viable strategy.
In my mind, the outrage should be centered on the fact they didn't adequately compensate her chase game to make up for it. In fact they made it worse unless they un-nerfed Reiko's Watch and just didn't say anything.
That being said, when condemned is used for what is likely to be its intended purpose of being a passive slowdown, the new Sadako is stronger overall than the old Sadako.
So you're saying that grabbing *should* be worse than a hit that was already guaranteed anyway for Sadako because by grabbing you avoid a potential flashlight save? That's better than the other guy at least. He was refusing to read at all.
Do you honestly feel like Sadako of all killers needed to have something specific to weaken her kit (however slightly) just because locker grabbing can avoid a flashlight save? Avoiding a flashlight save by grabbing from locker is true for all killers, is it not? But Sadako specifically needed that?
-
@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491935#Comment_3491935
How on earth is it fanboying to not consider a hook a bad situation for the killer? Yeah, you don't get your two stacks of Condemned, but you do get a hook, and that's much more valuable. It directly progresses the survivor towards death more severely than the Condemned, and it can't be undone.
I literally don't care if a survivor hops in a locker in that scenario. I'm getting a hook, that's more valuable than a single proc of Condemned application. No argument is needed here because the killer isn't being pushed into a negative situation.
You were going to hook them regardlesss. They are already wounded and about to get hit. Knowing that a grab is worse for Sadako than a regular hit, and knowing that they are going down anyway, the survivor then enters a locker. "Oh but Sadako gets a hook!" is an irrelevant argument because they were already going to get hooked anyway. Now, inside the locker, Sadako has to grab them, instead of hitting. Grabbing is worse for her than hitting.
Once more! Grabbing is factually worse than hitting a wounded person down for Sadako. "But you get a hook" is not an argument as you get a hook in both cases. Both paths lead to a hook, but one is clearly worse than the other.
Do try to read this time, will you? It's not that difficult. You just go over the letters and form the words.
-
@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491927#Comment_3491927
...That is not a punishment. That is a hook. You need those to win in most cases. You are still coming out ahead, and just aren't getting maximum value from that situation.
Lord almighty, the effort to fanboy is strong. You were already going to hit them regardless. You were already going to wound them regardless. They enter a locker to avoid the hit and force Sadako to grab them, knowing that it's worse for her.
You don't like the punished word and will use that to avoid actually building an argument? Fine. I'm still waiting for an argument that defends grabbing being worse for Sadako. Can you defend that?
-
@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491915#Comment_3491915
I'm maybe not the best person to defend that choice as I'm kind of on the fence about it, but it is worth mentioning that they do at least have to walk to the nearest generator in most cases, which might not be that close. Still, to address the change itself, I'd assume they didn't want removing Condemned to be as difficult considering the intent was for it to build up quicker on average, which does somewhat make sense.
Like I said, though, I'm on the fence. I'll be playing Sadako on Live to better form an opinion on these changes, but I suspect that's one change that probably will need looking at.
Also, you are not punished for grabbing someone. You get a down when you grab someone, which in 99% of cases means you get a hook. That is not a punishment, a hook is better than a stack of Condemned.
You don't understand. If you're chasing a wounded survivor and they know they're going to get hit they can just enter a locker. Sadako is punished for grabbing instead of hitting them down. She will not build stacks. When she hooks him, it will not build stacks. And to top it off, the tape they are carrying is destroyed. Amazing!
-
It's comical how tapes can now just be picked up and delivered 5 steps later to the nearest TV and the way to fix this is to use an iridescent addon. This just baffles me. To people who are defending her rework (for some unknown reason, fanboyism maybe?) I'd honestly like to see your argument to defend this.
While you're at it, please do try to defend how she is punished for grabbing someone. As you don't build stacks on grab nor hooks, if someone just enters a locker they are bypassing your power.
-
Almost never saw Sadako. Now, once the initial rush of people trying to see her new rework passes, I'll probably NEVER see Sadako. They did her dirty. Apparently seeing one Sadako in a month was too much for BHVR. They wanted less.
-
BHVR has already said they aren't removing DC penalty. This is an online game. You are (hopefully) a person and you are playing against other people. The intent is for this to continue being an online game. Stop trying to turn this into a bot game, what's wrong with you? Bots are just the very last resort. The solution to anything will NEVER be to remove DC penalty.
-
@Jhei said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3486060#Comment_3486060
Studies pretty consistently show that the punishment thing isn't what fixes the problem. Recidivism rates are high in places that put more emphasis on punishment than on rehabilitation. If we're not doing something to incentivize doing the right thing and instead put all of our focus on punishing people for not doing the right thing, then yes, DC'ers gonna DC, and they'll keep doing it until they have less incentive to do so. This is a case where positive reinforcement can help, believe it or not. Hell, how about bonus BP if you finish a match with a bot in it that increases for every bot in the match. That way you're incentivized to stick around in case someone else DC's, and at the very worst, a killer will have 3 bots and at least 1 human since that person knows they're gonna get 3x the BP just for putting up with the BS.
I mentioned your strawman and specifically addressed it, and again you come at me with "put all of our focus on punishing people for not doing the right thing". That's crazy. Let me say this again then: Does that need to be the only measure ever taken? Of course not, and I suspect that was your strawman. But ultimately, if someone did something wrong, they should be punished for it regardless.
Hopefully you read it this time and you don't tell me something like "put all of our focus on punishing people". That would be crazy.
Also, studies you don't source can say anything, but can you point me to 5 countries in this world where there is no punishment whatsoever for crimes? I'm hard pressed to find one. Again we go back to my point. Obviously there are other measures to be taken other than *only* punishment. But punishment for people who do wrong things is not to be abolished. Why would you even want that? Let's not start patting people on the back for murdering their neighbors. Punishment needs to stay.
-
@BearMerchant said:
Everyone that comes at this from an angle of punishing people that they perceive as immature or being a baby or whatever is completely missing the point. There are multiple studies confirming that negative reinforcement is, at best, ineffective. If someone doesn't want to play out a match, they won't play it. Your opinion on their character or who they are is ultimately irrelevant.
What matters is how that consequence impacts the rest of their team. With a bot, that consequence is significantly reduced. Not completely mitigated by a long shot, but far less damaging than before.
This is what will happen: people will do what they've always done. They'll give up on hook, they'll die, and now it's a 3v1 anyway — because they don't want to deal with the DC penalty.
Again, anything you feel about them is not going to change that outcome. You can't change the behavior of complete strangers. They don't know you, you don't know them, and they quite frankly have zero obligation to listen to you berate them or chastise them for throwing. All you can do is offer a reduction in frustration by removing the incentive to give up on hook and deny your team the bot they'd otherwise have at their disposal.
So yeah, get rid of the DC penalty. I'd rather someone DC with no cost, regardless of their reasoning, than watch someone give up on hook and deny the rest of their team a chance at escaping.
I don't know if you live in an alternative universe but modern society and most counties' (if not all?) law systems use "negative reinforcement". People go to jail. Sometimes they get executed, even. People who do wrong things should always be punished in some way or another. Does that need to be the only measure ever taken? Of course not, and I suspect that was your strawman. But ultimately, if someone did something wrong, they should be punished for it regardless. If they don't like the punishment, then they should have been better. If you don't like the game, don't commit to it by clicking the play button.
Also, for future reference, this is not a negative reinforcement case. This is a punishment case. These are not quite the same and represent different things.
-
I don't really understand the mentality of "someone did a ######### thing to me because they are a ######### person, I will now become them". Whatever happened to just staying superior? When you do something scummy like DC'ing from a match on purpose you are on the same level of people who do all other scummy things like letting someone bleed out just to waste their time.
The whole logic of fighting ######### with ######### is just lost on me. Thank whoever raised me for doing a good job.
-
The progressing increase in penalty for multiple dc's should be considerably harsher. Massively harsher, even. Don't like it? Don't be a scummy person who clicks the play button and then quits just because you don't like something that happened. There is no excuse. Whenever you willingly quit a match it's not the game's fault and it's not the killer's fault. It's yours.
I don't understand anyone who wants clemency for scummy people doing scummy things. Maybe they are scummy themselves if they want to defend it.
-
I understand you're frustrated but I really wish people like this would actually stop to think on what they are saying. In your scenario, the killer has half of the team hooked in the same room. At least half of the remaining half is guaranteed to be coming there out of their own volition. So *at least* 3/4 of the survivor team is, in some way or another, bound to that room. And you want him to leave to go smell the flowers at the backyard.
Sometimes I wonder if people actually like the game they are clicking the "play" button for.