Susurrus
Susurrus
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@IronKnight55 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3775884#Comment_3775884
FNAF has been one of the most requested licenses for years, so there is a lot of hype surrounding it. Some people on this forum may not be happy about the collaboration, but the truth is they are a very small part of the community. FNAF will be a great addition to the game and attract many new players.
LGBTQ+ people being "a very small part of the community" is not an argument for dismissing relevant criticisms and complaints.
Acknowledging that a minority is a minority says nothing about the validity of any opinions.People are not happy with this particular collaboration for very valid reasons, relating to human rights and human lives.
Anyone - and everyone - who turns around and says that doesn't matter "because profit" or "because new players" isn't actually addressing the issue; it's evasive and dismissive; a refusal to engage with the ethics.BHVR chose to brandish LGBTQ+ aesthetics, and talk about the importance of representation, and the importance of inclusivity and respect of marginalised people.
They then chose to pursue this partnership despite that.
That merits discussion of the apparent conflict, and - I would say - justifies expressing relevant sentiments and seeking answers from BHVR's community representatives. -
@ArkInk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3775434#Comment_3775434
Man look, if you want my thoughts I have other posts that address the main controversy up front with words you'll like more. If this interaction is gonna turn nasty before I even get to say anything to you, I'm out.
When I say community stigma, I'm not just referring to this controversy. FNAF and DBD have been discussed in numerous ways over the years and many of these discussions involve the games content, tone, target audience, etc. and now of course the controversy. I didn't come to this site to talk politics, I came to talk games, sorry if my vocabulary reflects that, but don't make me out to be something I'm not just because you took my post somewhere it doesn't really delve into.
I love FNAF, I love DBD, I love the LGBT Community. That's that.
Supporting and funding Scott Cawthon is not the behaviour of someone who "love[s] the LGBT community".
It's really that simple. -
@Prometheus1092 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3775428#Comment_3775428
It's not hypocrisy at all, just because they made a business deal with someone doesn't mean they support the persons view or opinions. If I buy the dlc that doesn't mean I support anti LGBT views, same goes for BHVR. they clearly haven't done or said anything negative to the LGBT community. If you don't want to play the dlc or have moral standings against it fine but to say hypocrisy is just flat out incorrect.
(1) If you are willing to collaborate with someone despite them actively funding hatred and harm towards marginalised people, you clearly consider that hatred and harm to be acceptable.
(2) If you are willing to financially support someone despite them actively funding hatred and harm towards marginalised people, you clearly consider that hatred and harm to be acceptable.BHVR has previously - repeatedly - stated and acted as though they care for the wellbeing of Queer people whom they've worked with, whom they employ, and who exist within and outwith their community.
Point 1 and Point 2 above contradict that professed support.
Claiming to support marginalised people, and then turning around and supporting harm against the same, does in fact constitute hypocrisy.And you finding nothing whatsoever wrong with supporting and funding anti-LGBTQ hate does in fact mean you support such beliefs and behaviours.
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@ArkInk said:
Part of it was definitely that the 10 year anniversary was now, but I also think BHVR wanted to announce it in advance so the community stigma around FNAF some people have gets worked out before release. Given what's currently happening, that appears to have been the right idea.
The phrase "community stigma" sure is an interesting way to frame funding hateful anti-LGBTQ bigotry.
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@OrangeBear said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774910#Comment_3774910
Still dont think that makes him anti-LGBT. He did what he thought was best overall when it comes to these things, you cant have a president who is everything you want. He didn't seek to harm LGBT people.
He didn't donate to save face because he consistently donates on charity streams and he's done that for a long time before that incident happened. When that incident did happen he pretty much disappeared from the public internet.
I don't think he deserves the hate he gets at all. I think it's misdirected.If someone funds hateful bigotry to the tune of thousands of dollars, they at the very least consider such hateful bigotry to be acceptable.
Which the people targeted and harmed by such bigotry are well-within their rights to condemn, as is everyone who cares in the slightest about human rights and human lives.
Scott Cawthon chose to inflict material harm to LGBTQ people.
His response to being caught out doing so was a milquetoast non-apology and a vague handwave towards other donations he made.He's still doing the exact same thing to this day.
He still profits from the very same IP that BHVR has chosen - despite their own alleged support for LGBTQ people - to collaborate with.You don't get to be dismissive and disrespectful of the very real threats to human life that LGBTQ people face as a result of people like that.
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@deckyr said:
and then they announced a collab with fnaf, whose creator votes trump and donates to anti-lgbt causes as well as trump's campaign.
thanks for putting the L in LGBT.
Yep.
Absolutely grotesque hypocrisy for the sake of profit.Guess they think the 'B' stands for 'Betrayal' too.
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The most likely reason that they announced it so far in advance is to try and mitigate the inevitable backlash for supporting and collaborating with a man who actively funds anti-LGBTQ hate.
Financially supporting someone whose money goes towards hateful bigotry tends to come with PR issues.
BHVR are most likely hoping that they can get all that out of the way in advance, so that Gamers™ have forgotten the controversy and bigotry by the time the actual release comes around. -
@TieBreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774921#Comment_3774921
Let's be real, BHVR knew this collab came with a ton of political baggage. This is the one time that mentioning politics is unavoidable.
Yep.
Which is why them closing threads and insisting "no controversial topics" is ridiculous.
They chose to create a controversy by partnering with someone whose actions are deeply controversial due to hateful anti-LGBTQ bigotry.
(Which then casts BHVR's shows of support for Queer people in an extremely cynical and unpleasant light.) -
@DeBecker said:
Why would they announce something so far away? They dont even know whats happening next patch LOL
Presumably in an attempt to deal with the backlash far from the actual release.
Their marketing and PR departments presumably hope that it all blows over and everyone forgets that they chose to partner with someone who actively funded harmful anti-LGBTQ bigotry to the tune of thousands of dollars. -
@HexHuntressThighs said:
He is the creator and deserves the money for his creation being used, so he will rightfully get it. And Putting his content in the game is not an endorsement of his viewpoint obviously.
On the contrary, wilful association with hateful bigotry - acceptance of it and funding of it - is contemptible.
So yes, collaborating with Scott Cawthon and financially supporting him is in fact an endorsement of him.
Whereas if one felt strongly that LGBTQ people should not have their rights threatened, infringed upon, or destroyed, one would not do that.