Judgment feels extremely bad at close to medium range
I think that now that the dust has settled somewhat, it's time to talk about this...
This killer is powerful, yes, and theoretically has the potential to be the strongest killer in the game (like Vecna). However, due to human error and such, this will only be achieved by a very small % of players. I don't think it's okay to have a killer remain playable for only a couple hundred players while the rest of us are punished for it.
As a casual player, I really tried to like the Judgment. I love the beam, and with some aura perks, you're lethal at long range if survivors are caught off guard. However, when you're actively chasing someone and you're not Zealous, this might be the sluggiest, worst-feeling killer in the entire game.
The main problem, in my opinion, is the lack of Zealous. Zealous gives you the ability to curve your beam 0.3 seconds after casting it. This means you can make a small correction when casting the power, and it even allows for greater curve paths and some really interesting potential.
However, without Zealous, you cannot curve it at all, which means the survivor has all the advantages when it comes to dodging it. If you actually want to hit a survivor you're chasing, you have to pull off some weird advanced techs that just feel unnatural.
I think BHVR should standardize these two modes in some way. The power difference between Zealous and non-Zealous is insane, and the power actually works differently too. It's not like Vecna, where he has two states (one non-lethal, one lethal), because Vecna's power works the same in both modes. The only thing that changes is his ability to injure, so once you get good at it, you don't have to mess with your muscle memory.
I think the effort needed to play this killer vs. the effort needed to counter it as a survivor is WAY too huge of a gap. There are so many little things that should be ironed out on this killer, but because of MMR reset and content creators sensationalizing clips (which most of the time are literally just lucky hits), this killer will probably remain untouched. People are saying she's S tier and can break the game, so BHVR is going to look at the numbers and assume everything is fine.
Also, there is something going on where you can literally see the beam touching a survivor's leg or shoulder and it still doesn't hit. It seems like the devs reduced the hitbox radius of the beam without reducing the visual size of the beam, which makes the power feel even worse to use.
Comments
its a fair trade for never needing to catch up to survivors even as a 110 killer. if I want to hit people close I'll play any other killer in the game
I don't really agree with you, in medium range you can do flicks or use the brown add-on that makes your M2 stop a at wall so you can aim, works great and quiet fun to use
Yeah, there are drawbacks to every single killer in the game (yes, I'm talking to you Nurse and Blight) - fundamentally, every single killer in this game has counterplay to them.
Judgment is weak when in a 1v1 situation unless of course you're playing with someone with wild prediction-based trajectory and knowing how to curve around a rock as the survivor is going around it or clipping them through it.
The skill ceiling for judgement is certainly high. But I wouldn't say she's unplayable for most players.
She has a LOT of addons that affect how her beam works and makes it easier to hit. The best one for players struggling with her is the brown prayer mat addon. It means that while you're doing the initial charge/aim stage, the beam will stop moving entirely if it hits a high wall of obstacle, making it much easier to aim, very help for counter looping, guide it to a wall behind you, turn around and you have a pretty accurate shot. Over half her addons affect the beam in some way. The iri mirror lets you ping pong it around, really dangerous in indoor spaces, there are two addons that let you pull the beam back to yourself. There's a lot of options to tweak her power to fit favoured play styles.
I picked her up day 1 and have been playing her a fair bit, despite the fact I'm playing controller on console I've been doing pretty well with her.
I honestly don't think she's super weak close range there are things you can do to mitigate her "bad chase"
These tips helped me out a lot while I was still learning the killer, I would recommend trying some of them out.
I play on controller and close range flicks are the most fun part about playing this killer for me.
She's not great at close range but you can hit close range shots. I never feel more powerful than when I'm chasing a survivor go "wait for me for one second" fling a beam at a far gen get a down and then hit the close range shot.
Is it easy or consistent? No but considering the killer can do that at all it should be difficult cuz that's crazy.
I don't find her weak in close range. Just ignore close range survs, and you're fine. If someone comes within five to ten meters of you, ignore their existence and go back to sniping. Easy as. Eventually the 5m surv will slip up and put themselves in a position to feed you an M1, or they'll go away. If they just stand there, well, then they aren't doing gens now are they? Easy enough. Ignore anyone close and keep hitting the distance shots. Rinse, lather, repeat.
Slingshot if you think you're good, but frankly speaking the survs that come within 5m are normally there because they feel confident they can dodge your slings, so in my experience you're better off ignoring them entirely.
can't have a killer with very strong capabilities with no setbacks, that crosses from great potential into totally unfair. right now The Judgement is reasonably hard to play well and very hard to master, it should stay that way.
Depends on how easily they can break LOS and in those scenarios it just turns into a game of reads which a lot of killers have to do anyways
If you're ignoring a survivor close range, you cannot argue that she isn't weak in a 1v1 close range encounter.
She inevitably is a long range sniper, it is why I say that survivors should fundamentally break the habit of healing at hook or doubling on gens when versing her.
She in my eyes is just a more lethal Artist with the cooldown speed of Henry (I don't know the exact numbers because I am not sitting here doing DBD math when I load into a trial and go based on visual cues for the most part).
She is good if being piloted by someone who knows how to predict and curve their beam (Negoose) but in the average killer hands? They will struggle, just like average survivor mains will struggle against certain killers. It's why I don't really engage with nerf said killer or whatever because the person writing whatever it is is just upset that due to whatever happened in the trial occurred, scapegoat it elsewhere, and just demand nerfs.
In my eyes, I don't really see any issue with any killer as long as you know their limitations. I do strongly believe that it truly depends on the skill and hours played, I mean I didn't play the PTB at all. I never watch PTBs, I just go based off hands-on experience as I am a hands-on learner and would prefer to make my own opinions instead of parroting what a YouTuber says about something.
So, ultimately speaking she struggles in 1v1s unless you take the time to fundamentally master her along with similar people that phase through objects. - a lot of the killers in this game believe it or not are sorta similar to one another in some capacity, it's why I compare her to Artist and Henry.
I could honestly if I wanted to draw parallels with every single killer if I wanted to, but that'd be boring so yes.
I guess my point hinges on the fact that I just treat close range as not existing, much the way that say, Slinger doesn't engage at 40m. No one says slinger is 'weak' at that range, he just doesn't engage there at all. Not to argue the point mind you, as I think you're still correct. She's just a better artist. I also agree most killers are more similar than not.
I just struggle to say she's weak at something that, in my opinion and playstyle, she just shouldn't be doing at all.
For sure, I think for Deathslinger - a lot of people love to clip farm with ranged killers, lol. I still to this day get surprised when someone who is ranged wants to go for a clippy moment like Huntress with a hatchet when I'm literally in their face or Deathslinger when shooting point blank when they can hit the M1.
But yes, I would argue for the average killer community that Deathslinger is stronger than Judgment in a 1v1, but that's because Deathslinger is more simplistic. If you miss your beam, you will be penalized a little by the fact that you move slowly and will have to now track the survivor and try again with your beam.
Deathslinger on the other hand can immediately zone the survivor and shoot through obstacles, while triggering the mending bar, which acts as a pressure point for the survivor in question regarding the chase.
I will agree that not dealing with someone in your face, sure - but at some point, you have to do what Negoose does and close down the loop by either zoning the survivor completely, pelting them through the object, or curving around it.
Otherwise, you will be at a massive disadvantage if the survivor knows how to loop and you're in a close range 1v1 area.
I am happy to concur with you on the largest spectrum here. We don't often agree so I'm going to take this one with a shot of whiskey and celebrate! 😂
Haha, I sincerely think if killer mains came over and talked to me - we would have quite a lot of sensible conversations.
Thank you for the whiskey shot and enjoy your day, fellow traveler.