Myers severe nerf

IndigoA

Coming from a Myers main, I wanted to express my sadness at the Myers nerf, and explain why it is a nerf. Myers is currently F tier.

Firstly and least importantly, tombstone is now not a viable option and is an extremely weak build. Perma tombstone is virtually impossible to use now due to needing a huge amount of stalk, which survivors will NOT let you get.

Due to Myers being easy to spot from afar, the nerf to Myers close stalk is absolutely devastating to gameplay and makes the fragrant tuft of hair unviable due to the 400% stalk required.

The buff to afar stalk is useless, as Myers can be easily spotted from afar, unlike Ghostie.

Due to the close stalk nerf, Myers is completely useless on indoor maps, as well as the majority of other maps that have a lot of walls and blockages between gens.

Survivors know that Myers now needs stalk from afar, so they will just tightly loop and stay near walls so close stalk is forced.

These add ons were the only thing that made Myers remotely ‘strong’ and now his basekit has to be relied on, but overall, all things considered, this is most certainly a nerf.

I really hope the devs will pay attention to this and make changes to him, please, I beg you (or at least revert all of these changes).

Suggested solutions:

• Apply the T1 movement speed increase to scratched mirror (or at least slightly increase the 105% to 108% or something).
• Return close stalk to 1 (or at least increase it, 0.4 is an insult).
• Make the evil requirement increase to reach Judith’s tombstone and fragrant tuft of hair to 250-300%.
• Reduce afar stalk speed (or leave it at 1, as Myers is already a weak killer).

TheSableSimp

@zarr said:

Nonsense.

Moving at 110% in EWI and needing 40% less stalk to get out of it is a massive buff. This was Myers' main weakness against survivors that knew what they were doing, making his early game very punishing for the killer.

Stalking at an up to 90% increased rate on distance is a massive buff. Not only are most maps open and allow for plenty of stalking on distance, with not few maps having vantage points from which you can stalk people across much of playing field, but stalking on distance is actually where you are most likely to be able to catch survivors unaware and stalk them for prolonged periods, because you are just a few pixels somewhere in the distance, sometimes nigh impossible to make out altogether because you're peeking out, over or through something.

Doubling the available stalk points is a massive buff. We went from only being able to get at most 7 EWIII to 15, being able to get up to 4 EWIII from any one survivor as opposed to only 2 (and only 1 from the survivor you stalked to get out of EWI).

This massive buff also benefits the busted Tombstone and infinite EWIII add-ons, as you are now able to go from EWI to EWIII by stalking a singular survivor when using them. One survivor caught unaware? GG. Sure you need to stalk twice as much for these, but not only will you stalk much faster on a distance than you used to, but since you only need to stalk one survivor rather than search for and follow multiple, you will still regularly end up spending much less time to get to EWIII with these add-ons equipped.

There is another notable buff hidden in the less obvious mechanics of Myers: When EWIII ends, Myers loses "100%" of his stalk meter, which however is merely 5 stalk points. That means as the threshold to attain EWIII increases with these add-ons, the amount of EWII you fall back to after EWIII ends also does. Someone forces a locker against your Tombstone Piece? No worries, even if you can't find and kill anyone else and your EWIII runs out, you will already have your EWII 66% full, making it incredibly easy to get EWIII again. With Judith's Tombstone you go back to 75% already done, regardless of killing someone of course.

But wait, there's more: BHVR didn't even increase the amount EW is drained by when you do end up killing a survivor with the Piece. That means the EWII you fall back to on a kill is also doubled, from former 25% to now 50%. So you kill someone with the Piece, stalk someone else for less than 10 seconds and there you have it again. And you only need a handful of seconds of stalk to go back to EWIII on Judith's Tombstone.

Myers has been buffed notably, the problems with the Tombstone add-on(s) have if anything only worsened despite already having been a big problem (at best they create a very boring match where Myers doesn't interact with survivors apart from staring at them and they eventually force a locker and then can't get unhooked, at worst it dooms a match for the survivors as someone gets instakilled early on), not even the silly interaction with Play With Your Food (a problematic perk in its own right) where literally killing someone does not consume tokens has been addressed, and the stalk rate reduction "up close" is much less severe of a nerf than people seem to assume it is - instead of literally capping his stalk rate at 40% for some range, it scales with distance, starting at this 40% minimum but increasing with every bit of distance; at the normal distances you stalk survivors over you'll already usually be at 60+% stalk rate, and that's still only ~10 seconds to go from nothing to EWIII.

I'm not saying he's been overbuffed, but it is disappointing that after all this time, the Tombstone issue has not only not really been addressed but arguably made worse. And while these are notable buffs, it is also disappointing that they didn't do anything more ambitious with the guy than number changes, nor any touch-ups to his visuals or perks (PWYF needing a rework, STBFL deserving a slight buff, Dying Light a notable buff), or to Haddonfield or Laurie's perks for that matter, all of which are also much deserving of touches.

Here's a Myers main testing out the changes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLhhjJaToy8

The part about being about to go from EW1 to EW3 with Tombstone / Infinite T3 from a single survivor is not true.

The Iridescent add-ons require 20 stalk points to get from T2 to T3, plus 3 points to exit T1.

Survivors have 20 stalk points each.

Since we're discussing Infinite T3, this add-on was nerfed way too hard. On indoor maps, you won't reach T3 with that add-on until the game is almost over. Which is ridiculous.

Anyone who thinks Infinite T3 is even remotely close to Tombstone in terms of strength, doesn't know what they're talking about.

Therefore, making it take 100% more stalk than Tombstone Piece is absolutely absurd.

It should be reduced down to at least 300%

zarr

@TheSableSimp said:

https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3847254#Comment_3847254

The part about being about to go from EW1 to EW3 with Tombstone / Infinite T3 from a single survivor is not true.

The Iridescent add-ons require 20 stalk points to get from T2 to T3, plus 3 points to exit T1.

Survivors have 20 stalk points each.

Since we're discussing Infinite T3, this add-on was nerfed way too hard. On indoor maps, you won't reach T3 with that add-on until the game is almost over. Which is ridiculous.

Anyone who thinks Infinite T3 is even remotely close to Tombstone in terms of strength, doesn't know what they're talking about.

Therefore, making it take 100% more stalk than Tombstone Piece is absolutely absurd.

It should be reduced down to at least 300%

That's true, you do need to get 3 stalk points from someone else for infinite EWIII. Still less than the 5 you needed to get previously, where you had to stalk one survivor to 100% and another to 50%, now only needing a further "15%". The stalk rate increase on distance has made this easier on most maps (again, stalk rate used to drastically decrease scaling with distance, now minimum stalk rate is 4 times what it was and increases with distance), and although indoor maps can indeed make it more difficult, indoor maps also benefit Myers at base, being able to sneak up on people. It also depends on the specific indoor map, Midwich and Hawkins or RPD for instance have lots of corridors and long rooms that once survivors have noticed you still allow you to keep stalking them for prolonged periods as they scramble away.

While I don't think infinite EWIII is as busted as the Tombstone Piece, that isn't really a good bar for comparison because the Piece is simply too busted and has unfortunately not really been adequately addressed with the update (granted, I don't think increasing the stalk needed for it even more is the way to go, more so something like making it so you can only kill survivors that already have a hook stage). Although I would say Tuft is not that far behind. Certainly "remotely close". The Piece has means of counterplay (preemptively jumping into a locker, holding onto a gen), even if they aren't always feasible for uncoordinated survivors. Infinite T3 means survivors cannot unhook if Myers does not want them to (unless they coordinate to sacrifice two downs for it, and even then it's not guaranteed), and is generally very threatening. The fact that you never need to stalk again once you are done also makes the add-on incredibly good, that's a significant timesink gone - 20 stalk points was the equivalent of stalking for 3 EWIIIs (plus getting out of EWI), or 3 minutes of it before you would need to stalk again. Infinite will give you much more than those 3 minutes for the same amount of stalking. It's also notable that being able to get all stalk needed "at once" should usually take much less time than falling back to EWII and needing to find and follow someone again (that also still has enough stalk points on them), so the time spent on stalking gameplay decreases even beyond that.

I think the 20 points needed for Tuft are adequate, particularly because it makes it so that that's all the stalking you will need in an entire match. And I don't believe the stalk rate changes (which overall are a buff if you understand that his stalk rate always scaled with distance, from 100% to 10%, now scaling from 40 to 100%, meaning that even at medium distances you will now stalk at an increased rate from what you used to) being less beneficial/more of a hindrance on (some) indoor maps is significant because Myers excels on indoor maps to begin with.