More Maps Need Fixing
Many know that there are current issues in a lot of maps, especially for M1s. For instance, Haddonfield and The Game: Haddonfield has multiple houses with infinite loops, while The Game is stuffed with pallets.
However, a big problem here is that there are actually a lot that don't (or maybe just don't want to agree), causing even more to bring Realm Offerings, which are much more common than Sacrificial Wards (which then don't let you get as much BP). Someone just brought me to Gideon, and with me stating the unfairness of this, one of them disagreed and said it was entirely fair.
We need to remove Realm Offerings, otherwise people can keep forcing the other side to certain one-map realms that need fixing, causing them to always get a big debuff rather than at least only sometimes (whether they know that map isn't the best or if they just like it). Though yes, killers sometimes bring the Realm Offerings, survivors have many more maps on their side, IMO.
And please please PLEASE do not comment if you think every map is entirely balanced. The Devs are trying hard, but there are still many mistakes that come, as everyone does.
Comments
I don't necessarily think the offerings are the issue, if the maps were balanced there would not be much of a reason to complain about a specific map...
Map offerings are the mainissue. It does not matter if a map is killer- or survivorsided if one side choose the map with the best killer and build for it. It just feels so unfair when one side push the odds to win to their side this way. I really hope they will remove these unhealthy offerings.
However, some maps are still an issue. Haddonfield has too strong builds while the middle is so empty and weak for survivors. Mount Ormond is still too big and needs to be smaller. Hawkins is too confusing. Ect.
Honestly, these akward variants of mcmillen and - in the next Patch- yamaoka are so stupid. We don't need more maps - it makes the game more complicated and bigger than needed. I really hope the devs will slowdown and maps and will fix the current maps before they release new ones.
I agree with nearly everything you said there. There is literally nothing I want more than map-balancing.
Haddonfield was already reworked, I think swamp maps are in much more need of rework.
They would not be problematic if there were not some maps that are one sided...
If all maps are somewhat equally balanced, why would you care which map to play on? They all offer somewhat equal chances to win, with minor adjustments for specific killers.
However if someone sends you to haddonfield, or the game, Garden of Joy, Eyrie of Crows and what not you are at an inherent disadvantage because the map is rather survivor sided as it currently is. The problem only exists because maps tend to be one sided towards killer or survivor.
The before mentioned because of many safe pallets, easy connectibility of tiles, strong windows and collision issues that mess with a lot of killers.
I gave you some examples, you can have some killer sided maps as well... Rancid abatoir became rather dry, shelter woods before the skull merchant update was rather killer sided because of huge dead zones, but I think the others are either somewhat fine or depending on playstyle, or survivor sided... Think about dead dawg for example, if you hold the 3 Gen in the outskirts it is killer sided, if you try to take chases in the main building it survivor sided... Both sides have problematic maps, it just feels like more maps are rather survivor sided. Don't get me wrong I want maps for both sides to be balanced, and I would want all of them to be alright for both sides instead of being annoying to play on for one side at least.
The escape rates are targeted around 60%, not 50% because it is farily easy to get at least one kill, that being a given I have to assume you are rather new to the game and not really familiar with either the way it works or the dev notes that stated that for years now.
I don't think Borgo is killer sided since they raised the number of pallets again, it is either slightly survivor sided or somewhat balanced. I think Saloon can be alright against Nurse, the side with the houses offers quite a lot of high wall line of sight blockers you can work with.
Swamp basically offers not much besides the main buildings and its size, but then again the main building can be rather easily accessable from many parts of the map, same goes for the Pier.
Sure Stealth killers do better on indoor maps, but I would not count the game in, since it is still so loaded with safe tiles.
I like how you only throw statements out without ever explaining why you think that. Try catching a survivor in the houses in Haddonfield, the main building of Saloon or on the Game in general without them just dropping 20 safe pallets on you as a basic m1 killer and you will fairly easily see why those maps are survivor sided. I gave you plenty of reasons for my statement and all I get from you is some childish stuff like "you're just bad and finding excuses", I play both sides and I find it just as boring to play on the game as survivor than as killer, because in both cases it is just not about my skill in chase because there are safe pallets everywhere, it is the most boring experience ever. You could loop and m1 killer there for like 5-7 minutes without much of an issue just because of the huge amount of safe pallets, but it is dumb thing that it is possible so easily, same with old cowshed. I want maps designed in a way the more skilled side wins that uses their ressources better and not in a way where I am like ok either the gens are done when I kick those 15 pallets or I might even win, that is just terrible design, that's all that is, so how about you figure out a reason why a map like Gideon is still not completely stupid and should be reworked? Or is it just a skill issue if you cannot manage to outplay god pallets as an m1 killer?
Because Borgo got decreased in size, the ability to chain loops together got addressed to some degree, but then again the pallet count is still rather high, what's your reasoning for saying it is killer sided?
Sure the main buildings is not right in the middle but then again you also have the Pier, like I said the map is rather dry besides that, but that structures are rather strong, if you are not at the edges of the map when you get hit by the killer you should be able to make it there.
Yeah sure Haddonfield is problematic in both sides, but think those busted houses kind of even it out because of the high visibility in the dead zone you can basically make it to the safety of a house every time. The map is just not a pleasant experience because you are either forced to camp a Gen or loose because of the busted houses, overall I still find it rather survivor sided.
It is not about the map size but about how well dead Dawgs structures cover your line of sight, I guess with the same right and proof I can estimate that you don't know how to play against Nurse.
I made 3 arguments why the mentioned maps are survivor sided, if you ignore them then I cannot help you.
The Game has 22-27 pallets if I am not mistaken, you can totally throw 15 of them, like I said in my example and be totally fine, which is why I said the map is problematic. My point with 20 was that the map has more than 20 safe pallets for survivors to drop on you. You will have to chew threw at least some of those because Gideon has rather high visibility for an indoor map so pre running can work to some degree so they are not limited to only the closest pallets, I made the example for Gideon especially.
Latency is something you cannot solve, bad map design can be solved so I don't see how they are comparable? But sure would be great if both were fixed, so what was this useless point from you now?
I mean yes, obviously, I don't even know if it is possible to solve latency? Isn't that basically a given and one side has to suffer because of that stuff?
I would not say the game is designed around strong main buildings you basically need to ignore unless you want to throw the game, there are a few maps that don't even have a main building. All structures should basically allow the better player to get a hit and not be like "Oh dang, you reached structure X I would need to spend 2 minutes here no matter what to get a hit so I need to leave now", That's just bad design. Not saying Borgo is only dumb because of the before mentioned, the red colour that makes you think scratch marks are there and it is just burning wood and what not...
With enough line of sight blockers and an experienced enough survivor she would struggle to keep up on most maps with good line of sight blockers, like I said, I think the house side of the map is quite good for that, there are surely better ones too.
Obviously not, but the game should not basically throw you these two alternatives, either take a chase that won't end in a reasonable time or sit around and kick 3 gens over and over again, once again that is boring and bad design.
If the game had good matchmaking then this would be how it is, but because we don't have that we have problematic win streaks and what not. I'm not complaining about not winning, I'm just complaining about strcutures and maps that are problematic because of their design and the low level of gameplay variety they offer.
Latency can go both ways, so I don't really see how it evens anything out?
Between 14 and 20 max I guess? Everything above is just way too much and also I think there should not be maps that can basically entirely dry out if all the pallets are gone, windows should still ensure some form of looping potential.
I think the Hawkins window in the control room is a true infinite when you use the shift tech, at least Hens once mentioned that. Some of the windows on Haddonfield could be similar to that, I'm not entirely sure, but they still allow for a really long chase time with not much you can do about it, same as the main building in saloon.
Most maps have between 14-17 pallets, so why not? If you are a bit conservative with them this is perfectly fine, there are rarely maps with more pallets than that. I think this is in general an acceptable amount of pallets.
Well I can only say what Hens said, and that windows is indeed really strong, would need to test out though if you can use it as an infinite... You should keep in mind that Hawkins was gone for 2 years and they did not change anything when they re enabled it... So the odds are rather high for it to be true.
You re supposed to loop him by running tiles in a skill full way and being conservative on your resources and not by pre dropping every pallet on the first loop.
You're supposed to play in whatever way you want but you are not free of consequence from wasting all resources on the map.
If you don't enter chase and use the shift tech then might be able to avoid the entity block. Same for the other mentioned windows, not necessarily infinite in the sense of those from earlier days but in that sense maybe.
The game and Haddonfield are definitely maps I dread when playing killer. Those insane house loops on Haddonfield are exceptionally annoying and having pallet after pallet after pallet dropped on the game gets tiring. They are definitely the top 2 maps that need balance changes.
They need to get rid of some of those windows and break some walls near some windows and add more pallets on Haddonfield, and on the game they need to delete some pallets, and add more windows/tiles upstairs. Map offerings I don't mind, maps in general just need to be balanced and then map offerings wouldn't be much of an issue.