SWF shouldnt and never should be nerfed
punishing players for playing with their friends is straight up cruel and you gotta take into account that not all players have thousands of hours and not all SWFs are in comms what are your thoughts on this though personally i find the swf nerf debate to be confusing
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Survivors already hate playing against four slowdown perks, what do you think is going to happen when you let them stack more?
Killers already hate playing against SWF - but they would probably PREFER to play vs SWF if they got +4 perks. I think it would do exactly what you want: make all solo players more balanced with SWF.
"You propose that solos get 4 extra information perks of their choice, while the killer gets any 4 extra perks of their choosing. This is in absolutely no way a fair trade"
It's not a fair trade that when you play in a SWF you can have 12 or more perks worth of information at no cost. This makes everyone stronger who is not in a SWF group. It would be totally fair and balanced because survivors get information and the killer gets power.
The most fair thing to do would be to have some kind of "tournament mode" . You queue up five players and your SWF plays against their killer while your killer plays against their killer. The regular game mode would be solo queue only. Then nobody needs any extra perks. Another way you could make it fair is if you could get reduced points (no item or achievement gain) in KYF and the game had "open mics" the whole time. That way you can play with your friends and still get points.
"You can't punish people for playing with their friends"
Taking away the 15% escape advantage from SWF over solo queue is not punishing people for playing with their friends. Just stop with that rhetoric.
"As for the reason why killers were buffed this last patch, it has nothing to do with killer numbers and everything to do with kill rates"
You are not privy to that information and are speculating. There is no proof of this "fact".
"If you can't beat a swf, it's on you as a player."
This retort makes sense when you consider low and middle skill survivors. The second we are talking about people with multiple thousands of hours of experience playing in a SWF in unfair. Almost all the "big name" streamers call playing in a SWF unfair. I think it's pretty safe to say the devs don't think SWF is fair either as they have noticed that being in a SWF gives you a 15% higher chance to escape. I will remind you again that when freddy got nerfed to oblivion he had a 4% higher kill rate. The SWF escape rate advantage is almost 4 times higher.
If you watch some of the old charity streams you can see some of the very best DBD streamers play against each other. It became painfully obvious that when you put a team of survivors with 20k hours on the same team they kind of stomp the killer.
If you want to pretend that SWF doesn't give a big advantage that's fine. But literally the entire streaming community acknowledges that it does.
You know that the last big patch was about the fact kill rates were too low ? Just a remember uh.
The devs literally said kill rates were too low, and that was before the mid-chapter update actually dropped. It was the whole reason they were buffing killers. Did you just not read the June 2022 developer update?
Here's your proof.
Dead By Daylight is not balanced from the top down. It's balanced around what's average, and your average survivor is not clocking in at 8,000+ hours.
Of course killers would prefer playing against swf if you gave them four extra perks with zero limitations. Who wouldn't? Solos on the other hand, well they got the short end of the stick. They can have four extra perks but only if those four extra perks are information perks.
Like come off it mate. It'd only be a fair trade if killers were restricted to perks like Surveillance and Discordance for their four extra perks.
I played Plague with pre-nerf Thana and three slowdowns and it was against a SWF trio with one solo. It took them over 30 minutes to finish all the gens, and all I did was pressure gens. None of them played bad by any means, it was just that I had so much slowdown they couldn't get anything done.
With eight slowdowns, I could make it take twice that amount of time which obviously is not fun for anyone.
-"Of course killers would prefer playing against swf if you gave them four extra perks with zero limitations. Who wouldn't?"
Let's stop and think for a second. What part of the game right now gives you extra perks with zero limitations? The answer is SWF. You get the value of many free perks because you can talk. SWF needs to have a downside so that there is at least one advantage to playing in solo queue.
You are unwilling to limit SWF parties to no repeats of : characters/perks/items. That one simple change would make SWF a lot more balanced while having almost no impact on the strength of a SWF group.
"The devs literally said kill rates were too low"
I am not doubting that fact. You can't be sure that the buffs to killer had nothing to do with this :
Furthermore you have no information that proves that these numbers were a direct result of few people wanting to play killer. See all those months in red over the last year? For the huge majority of the last year Killer queues have been instant. Do you know why? Because almost nobody wanted to play killer. Meanwhile during a large portion of this time the survivor queue times were 5-10 minutes to play a game that could be won in under 5 minutes.
On the no repeats, I'm willing to compromise on: Toolboxes, flashlights, skins, and non-healing perks.
While I can't be sure the buffs to killer had nothing to do with too few killers, there's nothing to confirm that it had something to do with it either. Anything other than killers being buffed because kill rates were too low is speculation.