A Fix To Facecamping
I can't take the credit; it's @Firellius idea in the first place. I don't know how to do half-quotes (where you quote only a section of someone's post) but here's the gist:
'If a survivor progresses to the struggle phase from first hook, they are teleported to a random hook, away from the killer.'
So the Killer CAN camp, but only for 1 hook state. This gives them the chance to guard a kill if Survivors are nearby, and allows the to be looped around the hook punishment-free.
The only drawbacks I can see is 'What happens if a Survivor is near the hook when Struggle Phase hits?' and 'What happens if the Killer returns just before struggle phase?'
Either one can have results:
- The Survivor does not teleport if the Killer is not nearby. This way, Survivors don't sprint to a hook, only to watch the hooked Survivor teleport away.
- What If The Killer Returns? This is a good question I can't figure out an answer for. What if the Killer comes back JUST BEFORE 2nd phase, thereby forcing the teleport & making Survivors have to run away now? I mean, it may just have to be a drawback of the system, or even a new way to play around the hooks, because I can't figure out a fix.
Also, as a matter of course; all teleports are disabled in the endgame; the Killer's goal is literally to confirm his kills at this point, and there are no more generators to guard. Survivors don't deserve get out of jail free cards in the late game.
Comments
The half-quote is done with the 'Greater than' symbol, though it doesn't work on mobile, IIRC.
In regards to the raised points...
I don't think this system should consider killer's proximity to the hooked survivor. In the interest of consistency, I'd say it should always fire when a survivor progresses to struggle stage from first hook. There could be some kind of visual indicator, like a ring closing in on the hooked survivor at 4 m/s to help survivors gauge whether they can make it under normal circumstances and save them the pain of running up to someone getting ported off, but I think it's a drawback survivors can afford to suffer.
I also think it's healthier for the teleport to happen in disregard of the killer's proximity, because if the killer isn't trying to camp it out, it won't make any difference to them, and if they are trying to camp it out, they can't abuse it by standing just outside proc range. If it's an unconditional effect, it cannot be exploited and everyone knows what they're getting into by default.
Fair enough on both points.
And thank you for the format info, too! :)
I play a lot as Killer and the biggest reason for camping is the fast generator progression.
By raising the repair time of one generator by ~30 seconds, it would make camping unnecessary and bring the interesting part of the game back: chases.
Currently, it makes no sense to follow a good looper (and there are many out there!) for 4 minutes just so the Survivors get 3-4 gens done in that time.
Let's not forget a Killer needs to hook 12 times in order to win. This is just impossible at this moment against more or less good groups.
Another huge problem is SWF:
As they are usually communicating and coordinating via voice (which is not intended, that's why they had implented gestures for Survivors), they have a huge advantage ingame.
Even before the game, they coordinate all perks so they fit perfectly together. Borrowed Time, Prove Thyself etc.
An easy solution to this would be to make Survivors only use Character-specific Perks when playing as SWF. This way, highly unfair Perk combinations wouldn't be possible anymore and even out the huge advantage SWF brings with it.
This seems like a good idea on paper, but in practice it would be an absolute mess.
This takes away a fair bit of strategic agency from the killer. Some killers are naturally just better played defensively and suddenly having the one thing that actually forces a survivor's hand teleport randomly is pretty bad. The are also builds centered around things like putting people in the basement and keeping them there specifically because it is usually a more defensible and predictable location. Having someone just teleport out on second hook state isn't good gameplay.
From a survivor prospective, right now the game has a considerable amount of perks that are designed with the current setup in mind that would need to be reworked substantially. Personally, I want my hooked teammates who are getting camped to stay on one hook rather than potentially dragging the killer around the map. If you're getting facecamped, you're still providing a tangible value, but keeping the killer occupied passively. Which means I can do gens, but if you aren't getting saved just teleporting to another hook now that killer is gonna roam around looking for the hook. Which can at times be objectively worse.
Also, the idea that this will bring back chases is a logical fallacy. The situation with chases is quite simply that newer killers aren't actually good in chases and currently chases take too long and are too costly. The amount of time that survivors can make a killer waste after a while of playing is simply too high when you don't have enough speed or power utility to mitigate it. Though a lot of your time is spent fighting the game than dealing with survivors. People who facecamp constantly aren't going to suddenly start conducting chases they'll either find a way to camp or just move to another game, but camping has never been a good strategy. People try and commit to saves that aren't possible and just feed into rather than just letting the hooked person go and focus on pushing generators.
That's the only real quasi-punishment for camping is short, dismal, low scoring games. Remember, you only really need 3 people to do gens efficiently and dbd's not going to score you in any manner that would have you think you're playing a team game.
I really don't think hard-nerfing camping's only counter is going to fix camping. There's a lot of people on the forums which try to present camping as some sort of 'desperate last straw' for killers, but as has been pointed out in another topic, camping is just really effective, especially when built for, and there's also plenty of people who specifically do it to ruin the game for others.
This takes away a fair bit of strategic agency from the killer. Some killers are naturally just better played defensively and suddenly having the one thing that actually forces a survivor's hand teleport randomly is pretty bad. The are also builds centered around things like putting people in the basement and keeping them there specifically because it is usually a more defensible and predictable location. Having someone just teleport out on second hook state isn't good gameplay.
Having someone spend the entire match in a defensible location is worse gameplay, though.
And you retain leverage. Losing a hookstate is costly, and survivors are still incentivised to go for the rescue to give their comrade more time. You just don't reduce the game to 'you have 120 seconds to finish the game and get out'.
From a survivor prospective, right now the game has a considerable amount of perks that are designed with the current setup in mind that would need to be reworked substantially.
Could you name examples?
Personally, I want my hooked teammates who are getting camped to stay on one hook rather than potentially dragging the killer around the map. If you're getting facecamped, you're still providing a tangible value, but keeping the killer occupied passively. Which means I can do gens, but if you aren't getting saved just teleporting to another hook now that killer is gonna roam around looking for the hook. Which can at times be objectively worse.
Strategically it -might- be worse, but in terms of gameplay it's infinitely better. You're still getting the 'benefit' of a facecamping killer, but only for one hookstate, as opposed to two.
Also, the idea that this will bring back chases is a logical fallacy.
It is not intended to. It is intended to put the game in a state where chasing can be made more viable. As mentioned in my rebuttal to the post above yours, trying to bring back chases by increasing gen times just makes camping a more effective strategy. While it is theoretically possible that flat nerfing gen progression brings back chases, it's entirely dependent on player goodwill, and I don't know how long you've been around this community, but I, for one, am not going to bank on that.
I mean, take your own post here. Your argumentation clearly portrays camping as a good thing. A direct nerf to gen progression speeds would probably incentivise you to camp more, not less, since the strategy would become considerably stronger.