Balance for noed, camping and tunneling
This isn't click bait. This isnt a troll. This is positive. So please dont bring your bag of salt and bag juju in here.
I defend noed, I'll link the posts if I have to. I don't run it on killer and I cleanse totems as survivor and so i think the perk is balanced.
The only time I get hit with noed is when they camp and there is no physical time to go totem hunting because you need to gen rush while your mate takes one for the team and then they have noed, big oof.
NOED can carry. If you turn a 0k to a 4k you can keep popping. So why not make noed and fresh off hook hits with less points. You make this still "a strategy" but killers are less likely to pip which means it cant be reliable to climb.
Noed will still work in a finishing off way. But it means you have to do good/work the entire game and not get alot of points with a 4k in end game. With tunneling as well, you can get 4k but it's not gonna pop you if that is all you do.
There is no way to make everyone happy but I think this keeps the killer with no serious change and the survivors would ######### less.
You dont have to agree with me just dont be dicks.
Comments
Well conclusion, then this argument has no solution and the game is doomed.
Time to listen to the Killer/ both side players devs
very interesting idea. i dont dislike it, but there is a simple problem i have with it:without the current NOED, there would be no punishment for survivors not doing the secondary objective. with other words, survivors could always ignore dull totems without having to fear any consequences and therefore focus gens, leading to an easy genrush with no counters.by taking away that aspect of NOED, we'd need to get something new to give dull totems a meaning in the game.scratch that, i misread something.
xD
borrow time should be a in-game standart effect for campers. On ps4 it is so horrible they just hunt 1 survivor. you can run in front of the killer but he dont care and just look for that one survivor until he is dead.
Whens your balance for keys insta heals and toolboxes
i did not say take away noed. I love noed. I cleanse totems. I think all killers should run it. Doesn't phase me. Just make it so killers cant use noed to climb that is all this is about.
oh... im sorry, apparently i misunderstood something in your original post...
i thought you ment to change NOED in a way that i charges up hits over the game when the killer is attacking the rescuer after a unhook (or sthg similar to this), which would ofc take away the totem effect the perk currently has.
i read it again and i think you just ment to decrease the BP and/or Emblem gain you would get for using NOED / attacking the unhooked guy to make it harder for killers that use said strategy (NOED / tunneling) to rank up - or rather who rely on this.
welp, a little misunderstanding on my part, i apologize xD
i still like the idea though! :D
Toolboxes and keys? Not that strong. They run out. toolboxes, use them early and the killer does good gen pressure then its wasted potential. They are strong when player co-ordinate to all run BNP and purple tool boxes. Players spend points to have good things to take in, if they say gen rush at the start if the lobby and all do this, you are going to loose. Hard luck. This is no different to a killer running good addons but survivors can't take your rare and good addons don't run out half way through the game. Every time you run Read head finger, omega blink, prayer beads, insta chainsaw, insta down hatchets and all of that other stuff. You get good addons, survivors do too. If too boxes and stuff need a balance then so do killer addons. Accept that you have
Keys are also rare. My Nea is like level 400 at p3 and has about 10 keys. Finding the hatch becomes luck.
Accept that you have OP addons too.
You are a cutie!
Thank you :)
Survivors are not 80% of the game. There are two sides and they are one; they are 50% of the game. The one player who is killer, is the remaining 50%.
All your platitudes and talking-points are in bad-faith.
Survivors have several second chance perks, but killers cant? Why don't we get rid of all aura reading abilities while we are at it. Lets get rid of hexes period. That will TOTALLY balance the game.
As for camping and tunneling, the penalties are there, you could make them even more severe but that wouldn't stop baby killers who don't know any better, or trolls who just want to troll. Short of Killers being just AI driven you cant get all killers "to play the game properly."
@ArecBalrin you are confusing game and community. in a game there is 1 killer and 4 survivors so they are 80% of the game. If the killer is toxic it ruins 80% of the game.
You do not need to complain about toxic survivors. I am well versed in being teabagged and looped. I know it sucks.
They are half the game. Without them, there is no game. Matches can be played with one, two or three survivors gone, but not one-less killer.
The issue with going by individual players is the naked bias and double-standards it enables, which is well-evidenced here.
@ArecBalrin you are twisting the same thing. 5 people play the game over 2 roles. There are 5 people. You cannot play with 3 survivors, if 1 DC's mid game the game is unbalanced.
You cannot blob 4 people to being 50% of a game. They are 50% of the role but there are still 4 people there 80% of the match. I can change the lingo if it helps you
Game now = match, and community now = game.
Reread my about comment with this change and it is still true. Playing like a dick, tunneling etc ruins the match for 4 people.
Please do not comment about double standards if you cannot understand this point. Killers VS Survivors is a 1 vs 4, think of everyone in this.
I can comment about double-standards, becuase the post you just made is a double-standard. Why is 3 survivors remaining when 1 disconnects unbalanced? The match started with 4 and somebody made a crummy decision, but you don't provide any argument for why it's unbalanced. It's not an inarguable statement of fact; it has a counter-factual and that is the possibility that the killer having to face 4 survivors might be unbalanced. We don't know though, because we both probably have very different ideas about what 'balance' even means, just like everyone else.
There are two sides to the game. When survivors cite their majority when taken as individuals, they're typically arguing that four wolves and a sheep voting on dinner is fair. When killers point out there are but two sides and one person makes up an entire non-optional side of the game, it's just pointing out a fact. When taken together as equivalent(because this is de facto how the game works: there can be less survivors, but never one less killer), it takes four survivors choosing to stop playing to have the same impact on the game's health as one killer making the same decision. Passengers can boycott the small stagecoach and it will be fine, but not if the horse does.
The double-standard plaguing this game is those who put the cart before the horse.
@ArecBalrin So while you points are true and factual you have derailed the original point. Maybe it isnt fair for 4 survivors vs 1 killer and maybe there are balances there that need to be done. But this is not the premise I opened discussion for and this is not the point i am interpreting; if you would like to discuss killer balances.
Here is a post where I am trying to openly discuss loops and how I think they can be resolved:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/593014#Comment_593014
Here is a post where I am suggesting ways to balance the totems being wiped within 30 seconds:
I am well acquainted with the powerless nature of killers and I am not trying to defeat your point. Simply you are not listening to what I am saying and refuse to look at it from this prospective; this is a survivor related post talking about the negative impacts in a survivor game. This is not the place to factor how under powered killer is.
Premise: it is not fun to be camped, tunneled, mori'd off hook etc. How can we fix this, make the community less toxic.
If you would like to offer positive renforcement to any of the ideas suggested, a killers prospective to an idea someone might have missed, elaborate on any points then please stick around.
If you have simply come to rant about how underpowered killer is then this is not the place for you and I have many other posts you can find your way to with similar ideals to yours.
Well when you start a topic that is completely irrelevent to killers, which means a topic where killers would not be affected by proposed changes were they to happen, then this would stand up.
That is not what this is. Right from the start, this thread should concern killers because camping, tunnelling, mori etc are some of the only options killers have left to edge an advantage. Survivors chose to make their main playstyle a merry-go-round of looping and repeatedly stackable 2nd-chances and it involved heavily restricting killers choices or coercing them with catch-22s.
You get the standards of debate which you invite, by setting an example. What you can't have is an echo-chamber where you can precisely define whether disagreement itself is even allowed. You do not get to suggest that killers should get less points for whatever reason and that as the purpose is to make life better for survivors that killers have no skin in the disussion unless they're positively in favour of making life better for survivors. Surviors got into that position, where the killer disregards their enjoyment for a reason.
@miaasma You don't need to do poorly on the match to get all your gens done. Your statement is stupid and viased. Anyway, any not viable killer (everything appart from nurse, Billy, spirit and huntress) could easily be defeated by my swf or any other party with very experienced players. Simply as that.
Btw, noed is #########, if survivors have half brain it gets as much 1 person. If noed allows a killer to get more than 1 kill in a hook camping situation then the rest of the survs deserved to die.
Why punish someone who use "X" perk ?
Are survivors punished for using perks? i dont think so.