Thoughts on the Hooks vs Kills debate
Hello everyone. I just recently got done watching the Otz & Tru3 discuss DBD video (linked below) and wanted to discuss an idea that I had regarding the topic.
First and foremost I would like to say that I feel that this topic has probably been talked to the ground already and that I honestly don't think either person is wrong, In fact I think both of them are correct in their own rights and thats what makes things so frustrating. However I do think that they underlying issue that has caused this debate has probably not been talked about enough.
"What is a 'win' in Dead By Daylight"
What I mean by this is that DBD simply does not have a clear-cut, well-defined win condition for either side. This simple fact is why the Hooks vs Kills debate even took off in the first place.
As I have stated before, I feel like both Otz and Tru3 are correct in their stances/how they feel the game should be played and direction the game should go in hopes of healthier gameplay. So I would like to propose an idea I had that would help create a solidified win condition for the game AND hopefully satisfy both sides of the hooks vs kills debate.
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**The Concept:**
Dead By Daylight introduces a new point system to gauge player participation and decide a winner between the Killer and the Survivors. Both sides have a maximum set amount points that can be gained throughout a match. Let's say, 500 points for each, as an easy to work with example. (Note: This is just a quick mock up for the concept, doesn't mean it would work exactly like this)
For Killers, a bulk of their points are gained through hooking and killing survivors because it is self described within their title/role. Ultimately their goal is to kill all the Survivors in order to close out a game. Each hook is worth 25 points and a bonus 25 points is gained for killing a survivor. Getting 3 hooks = 100 points making all four survivors worth up to 400 points total. The last 100 points are gained through chasing and damaging generators/pallets/doors. 50 for chasing people and 50 for destruction. (Hex:Ruin is such a common perk for killers and passively damages gens which is why I think damaging gens should be less points overall)
For Survivors, a bulk of their points are gained through repairing generators and escaping because it's ultimately their goal for match. However since there are 4 survivors, the maximum number of points a survivor can get is 125. (125 x 4 = 500 which matches the total amount of points a Killer can achieve). 50 points for doing generators, 50 points for being chased/unhooking/healing other survivors, and 25 points for escaping. To max out their points, Survivors are going to have to work as a team to take turns doing the various objectives around the map in order to successfully escape with the most points possible.
The idea behind set point values for objectives is to encourage players to play the various parts of the game. Killers will ideally be denying Survivors a bulk of their points if they continue to put pressure on the map and chase them away from doing generators. Meanwhile Survivors will eventually need to be chased by the Killer or help their fellow Survivors to not only max out their own scores, but also give other members of their team time to max out their own scores. Ideally, this would help combat some of the gameplay that the greater community sees as unhealthy/toxic (i.e. Gen Rushing and Face Camping) and will help solidify what each player should be trying to achieve in order to win in the end. This would also make certain problematic offerings/items have more risk reward. A mori might end the game quickly, but if the Killer fails to do so, they risk potentially costing themselves points overall as they only scored points for a single hook and a kill (50 total points). Same idea goes with Keys.
At the end of the game, the scoreboard is revealed and whichever "team" has the most points is the winner of that game. Bloodpoints are still gained so that player can still level up through the bloodweb, but are only shown to the player. (I'm aware that bloodpoints do hint at who was actively participating during the match, but with how many variables there are to effect how many bloodpoints can be earned within a game (perks, add-ons, etc), they do little to show a concrete picture as to what players could do to both improve and help be successful. Ultimately this idea is mostly streamlining the already existing endscore bloodpoint system).
I know that to make some of this work, an in-game chat should be introduced for the Survivors so they can actively communicate and work together as a team better. Before anyone says anything, this is already being done when people play together using programs outside of the game (Discord, Xbox Live Parties, etc.) Don't act like its a rare occurrence. The simple fact of the matter is that games are more fun with friends.
(P.S. I am not sure if this idea has already been talked about, but I figured I could put it out there anyway. I am also approaching this problem as someone who has spent a great deal of time playing various games competitively. If the devs for DbD are intending to keep things the way they are because they don't want clear winners or losers within their game, more power to them.)
Comments
Kills are the ''win'' for the killer. You can hook every single survivor twice, but if all four of them escape, how is that considered a win?
Just like for survivors, you might complete four or even all the generators, but if none of you escape, did you win?
I don't see how hooks are considered the ''win''.
I can tell you didn't read anything I posted, but that is fine. I can at least try to enlighten you with why some people see hooks as a "win".
Seeing as how this game only has ranked games (there is no quickplay option), were you to compare this game to any other game with a ranking system, If you win you go up in elo. You "rank up" and if you lose, you lose elo or "rank down". You can compare this concept to pips in DbD. If you do well enough to gain a pip, you essentially won that match because you still ranked up. With how DbD works right now gaining points is how you get pips. Hooking people = points and points = pips. By this logic, hooks = a win.