The_Villain_JackTTV
The_Villain_JackTTV
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3457646#Comment_3457646
To your question. No I don't usually face-camp, its very rare. Tunneling? yeah, if I can get away with doing it. But I don't stay by the hook that is far too boring, but if they unhook next to me. Ill delete the unhooked zero problem. A Free kill for me.
Im not going to make it the aim to get 12hooks, I see that as being the Survivor's playdog. Nah Im ending it when I can. Sorry.
And, to you second point. You might want to rephrase it if you think Im this dyed hard face-camper every game.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3457650#Comment_3457650
Its biased thinking cause you are using a value system to say which playstyles are good/bad, you even told me that yourself.
Its isn't unfair either, its basic work smarter not harder. But you can make a choice and play either way here. whatever you want.
When did I say a value system saying good or bad? All playstyles are valid. I agree with that. However, if a player has enough skill to close 3 times as many chases as another player in the same time it's a clear sign of skill difference. That player should rank up more since they did more in the match.
Also how is it not unfair? The player who did more in the same time makes the same as a player who did 1/3rd of the work. That's belittling the player who actually played in a proactive manner during the match.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3457631#Comment_3457631
Yeah, you favouring active playstyles isn't objective either. You don't seem to understand you cant make a subjective reason objective by favouring it or judging by it. Its just normal bias.
How is it biased thinking that a player doing more should be rewarded more? It's also not biased since we're talking in hypotheticals. The player who receives equal reward as a player doing more than them is absurd since one player in this scenario is doing more.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3457603#Comment_3457603
So I would like to ask you the same question you presented. What makes you think the camp/tunnel/slug playstyle is more valid than the one that is in the proposed MMR rework? It's not about which playstyle is more valid. It's about what would be best for the game's health.
I don't make the distinction that any playstyle is more valid than others. I know what the rules of the game are and I know the outcomes and I know the types of play that can happen, but I don't make a judgement on which ones makes you a jerk or not.
What is best for the Game's Health is determined by the Rules of the Game, not the MMR system or arbitary whims of judgemental people who say who is good and who is bad.
The other thing I'd like to respond to is that if you wish to play in a camp/tunnel/slug playstyle you surely can. You just won't be as rewarded as the killer who played for 12 individual hooks. The player who played for more hooks ranked up more. Simple as that.
Aha, there is no objective reason given why your playstyle should be causing more ranking other than you say so, and that isn't a good reason to do it. This is probably why bHVR went simple and said, Killers must Kill & Survivors must Survive, and all that does matter is that it happens according to the game's rules-
Does this answer your questions?
To your response of "there is no objective reason given why your playstyle should be causing more ranking other than you say so, and that isn't a good reason to do it." The reason you earned more ranking isn't because "I said so" but because that player did more in general than a player who stood still by a hooked survivor all match. Pro-active playstyles reward more than inactive ones. If you think a player who stood in front of a hooked survivor with An instadown killer and forced people to death and closed a total of 4 chases for 4 kills should rank up more than a Killer who managed to close 12 chases and get 4 kills is a problem. The killer who closed 4 chases closed 66% less chases than the other player who closed 12 in the same amount of time. They receive the same amount of MMR even though one player was able to close only 1/3rd of the chases of the other player in the same amount of time. That is by definition a more skillful player and not arbitary whims of judgemental people who say who is good and who is bad as you put it.
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@Evan_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3456258#Comment_3456258
We are talking about matchmaking, and not grades. Grades actually already reward hooks real well. Getting to Iri 1 is a breeze if you are aiming for 12 hook games, and I'm pretty sure it's literally impossible if you bleed everyone out with 0 hooks.
A higher mmr rating is only a "reward" if you like to struggle. What you are proposing is punishing the many hooks by harder matches, and "rewarding" the 4 hook - 4 kill Bubba with easier groups of survivors.
You misunderstand me. Grades should not reward bloodpoints at all imo. The ranks used to have a connection to matchmaking. When they added the new MMR system they just kept the grades as a reward for playtime. 12 hook games should not reward for grades. It should reward MMR instead. Giving 1 million points just because you played around 70 games a month is like a participation trophy that is unnecessary. They should ditch the bp for grades and have them be connected to MMR instead.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3457214#Comment_3457214
You are dodging questions at a rate that makes you have prospects for a career in politics. But an effective evangelist for a new mmr system that does not make, its easy when you are not required to answer any concerns. Your replies are unclear if anything.
I asked you to address:
- What makes your system of what good skill is more valid than others?
- What about players that express skills in different ways than you? what choice do they have?
Im trying my best to make that clear to you now, and "Face-camping is bad" is not a response to any of those
Also trash talking Walmart employees in responses on a videogame forum??? even as a quip that is just weird.
So I would like to ask you the same question you presented. What makes you think the camp/tunnel/slug playstyle is more valid than the one that is in the proposed MMR rework? It's not about which playstyle is more valid. It's about what would be best for the game's health.
The other thing I'd like to respond to is that if you wish to play in a camp/tunnel/slug playstyle you surely can. You just won't be as rewarded as the killer who played for 12 individual hooks. The player who played for more hooks ranked up more. Simple as that.
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@Evan_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3456201#Comment_3456201
Nope, you misunderstood.
Since getting a 4k with 12 hooks is considerably harder than getting a 4k with 4 hooks, a player who aims for 12 will reach a lower mmr rating than if he'd simply win with 0-4 hooks. In other words, a fair and chill killer player gets easier trials in the current system.
Op's proposition would turn this the other way around. The best facecampers and sluggers would get a low mmr as they wouldn't get many hooks, therefore they'd face new players. A fair killer who sacrifices efficiency for 12 hook trials would get a high mmr, thus he'd face the most experienced and coordinated swfs. It doesn't make the slightest sense, and I can't imagine who'd enjoy that.
While it is harder to get a 12 hook 4K game than a 4 hook 4K game That's what MMR should be based around. If you play well then you should face better and better teams. That's what MMR is. Let's say you have a game with 9 hooks and a 1K. Lots of back and forth between all the players, and then 3 manage to barely escape. Do you think that killer should get rewarded the same amount grade-wise as a Bubba with Deadlock, Corrupt, No way out and Noed who got 4 hooks and 4 kills? The current grade system is a joke in my opinion since it's purely based on playtime and not skill. They have a rank system in the game that's only purpose is to give you some points at the end of each month. Why even have a grade system if it has no connection to skill? The OP is saying that MMR should be based off of hooks and not kills, which I agree with. Is it a perfect system? No, but there will never be one until MMR is visible. People will constantly complain about how they're high MMR and get only sweaty matches when they're not High MMR to begin with. I feel like if people could see their MMR it would solve a LOT of problems and complaints in the community. That's my take at least which OP also said
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@Evan_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3456135#Comment_3456135
I'm also aiming for 12 hook games. That results in a considerably lower mmr than if I tried to get 4k with 0-4 hooks. Currently my casual approach is rewarded by facing similarly casual teams who present a challenge even with my nice and fair playstyle.
In your system trying to get 12 hooks would be punished by going against the most efficient and coordinated teams out there. This makes me glad that bhvr is in charge of matchmaking and not you.
So you think if you do good you deserve to go against Weaker players every game? That's legit the opposite of MMR, and a really bad Idea. That would mean that every 8000 hour Nurse who wins would eventually get legit brand new players with 2 hours in the game. Your logic is flawed
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This was a refreshing post to read. It would be nice to see killers rewarded for getting hooks and closing chases rather than camping people through hooks states. If you get 10 individual hooks and a 2 or 3K instead of camping people through hook states (Especially with instant down killers). The one who could actually closes more chases should be rewarded more. I do think MMR should be showed so player understand that tunneling doesn't make them a high MMR killer. It just makes your MMR slightly higher than it should be.