Jubswest
Jubswest
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- Jubswest
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381847#Comment_3381847
yes? simply put would their be this much backlash? would said streamer and otz say this is a dumb decision? from what i can see no body has made a post saying this is a welcome change? nor videos or discussions. you are the only one for this change?
Well its funny isnt it, bHVR is the only ones who have the numbers that show that addon overperforming. So what does it mean when Otz or any streamer comes down to say its wrong, How do they know anything? They don't. So what makes their feedback more useful than others, than mine? It does not, its not even an argument, its a fallacy, argument from popularity.
I am willing to take bHVR's side, if the addons are overperforming then they should be nerfed even if I rather want the Killer Reworked. I have no reason to believe bHVR to be working maliciously here. Sorry if you find that strange.
finally if we talking about evidense here what besides your personal opinion is billy unfun to play against? or badily designed? give me that evidense
I like when I ask for evidence, you don't provide me some, you ask my for evidence of my opinion. That is Rich. Idk if it was not clear its my opinion. Like I don't claim every user thinks Hillbilly should be reworked. But some definitely claim like 90% of players have no issue with Hillbilly, only pleasant experiences.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381837#Comment_3381837
I love your enthusiasm, but I have no idea who Twoknee is or how his youtube community is a representative sample of the dbd Community
Also that poll said, playing AS or against.
Statistics are not THAT easy.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3382026#Comment_3382026
You made a big response here and ill show you the time, which you show me. Now you don't use quotes here on the website so I'm unsure what each section is in response to.
The difficulty with billy directly comes from the movement speed. It's mechanical and mental difficulty from having to time everything right ON TOP of correctly guessing their actions.
This change doesn't make billy harder, just weaker. The interactive part of the power in chase is the high movement speed, high sensitivity window. Any slower directly hamstrings both the difficulty and strength. He won't have the ability to curve to the same capacity, and just have to use his saw for backrevving/zoning.
Sounds like more bad design to me, a set of addons should not be essential to his power on higher mmr. but to me, these points only show major issues with Hillbilly, which a rework could rectify. It does not really convince me to think that bHVR should let you keep an overperforming addon anyway. I talked to one of their former designers today, the guy who did those addons today, He says he knew they would come for those addons eventually.
Now if I understand that correctly and you believe those addons have that purpose, then perhaps those addons should be reworked into the Killer's basekit=? Then you have your own rework idea. But I am unsure how you can convince people of this because to anyone looking in, it just looks like everyone who plays billy at high mmr uses those addons cause they are best. You would have a good argument if this will cause a significant drop in Billy's Kill rate. But I would think bHVR could call that bluff because I know they can see the Killrate with/without those addons. I do get you I think, but its hard to confirm.
About the whole Hard part honestly you kind of just replied to a quip rather than my point on overperforming addons. Not really sure we will get anywhere discussing what is hard and what is not, pretty useless to talk about something so subjective. Weak or mechanical difficult makes it hard in like every dictionary. I do get you want a mechanically difficult Killer here.
I am also glad you agree Billy could use some changes, at least we agree on something now.
And the evidence for the last point you mentioned will never be enough, you're clearly discrediting that purely off of what you see as ego. You're not looking to have a conversation. And that's fine if you don't like me because you think my word may have some inherent bias, but let's refocus on the main point, alright? The mention of me streaming has zero relevance to any point in your eyes, but that's no reason to make snide comments. It shows nothing but bad faith.
No literally, if we could make bHVR put in a part in the next Survey that asks what is your favorite Killer to go again and if Hillbilly shows up as significantly well liked Killer to vs then I literally have to eat my words. Its rather rude you think me that dishonest.
I have no problem with you, only the arguments you have chosen to bring into this thread. That is why I quipped it.
Now weather you think Im bad faith or not means not much to me, but I do think im atleast responding directly to your replies and that isnt exactly how bad faith works mate. Maybe its an elaborate smokescreen or maybe Im here because the subject is just interesting to me.
Why does otz opinion matter more than most? He is a fogwhisperer. He actually job for behavior is keeping the game healthy, half of his recommendations have gone into the game already? That's why he is not just some streamer. If anything your just some guy on a forum.
Also in any case as I wont be answering for other users but when you shown with evidence you simply dismiss it, when people give valid reasons for why billy does not deserve this nerf you either default to the addons are overperforming without even consulting why that is the case( not seeing the big picture)or simply ignore it in your response. You cherry pick what you want to argue against and your ego simply ignores the rest. I'll leave you with one saying friend
Never argue with a ignorant person, they will pull you down to their level and beat u with experience
And while the actual saying is with the term stupid, I dont belive u are stupid.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381750#Comment_3381750
Thats why theres such an uproar about this change: instead of going in that direction, theyre removing the possibilty for players to bridge that gap with skillful application of these addons themselves.
If an addon is overperforming, I don't see what you expect them to do. Besides I heard alot of Hillbillys in this chat saying they love "hard gameplay" so that would be exactly what you want.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381752#Comment_3381752
but according to most, you are the minority. most people consider hilly billy a very fun killer to play against. you are literally one of the only people in this forum for the billy nerf
Yeah, this is something we hear a lot here. But do you have some studies to support that claim? besides your personal experience or if you are that streamer dude who only gets people coming in to throw roses as him-
yes? simply put would their be this much backlash? would said streamer and otz say this is a dumb decision? from what i can see no body has made a post saying this is a welcome change? nor videos or discussions. you are the only one for this change?
your asking me to show why the earth is round. the evidence is in front of you? look at anyone's videos/ discussions/ whatever and not a single one is approving of this change?
finally if we talking about evidense here what besides your personal opinion is billy unfun to play against? or badily designed? give me that evidense
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381750#Comment_3381750
Thats why theres such an uproar about this change: instead of going in that direction, theyre removing the possibilty for players to bridge that gap with skillful application of these addons themselves.
If an addon is overperforming, I don't see what you expect them to do. Besides I heard alot of Hillbillys in this chat saying they love "hard gameplay" so that would be exactly what you want.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381752#Comment_3381752
but according to most, you are the minority. most people consider hilly billy a very fun killer to play against. you are literally one of the only people in this forum for the billy nerf
Yeah, this is something we hear a lot here. But do you have some studies to support that claim? besides your personal experience or if you are that streamer dude who only gets people coming in to throw roses as him-
yes? if people were for this change would they be this much backlash? would people like said streamer or Otz saying this is a dumb decision? you are the only person in this chat against it?
your asking me to prove why the earth is round. the evidence is in front of you? this post has over 100 discussions( one of the most popular posts) with almost everyone agreeing this is a dumb decision, look at anyone discussions/videos/whatever on it and the vast majority of people agree its a dumb decision.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381180#Comment_3381180
lmao. Dark souls is the worst example you could use cause I know that game like my own hands.
First. hard is not a synonym for bad, but it certainly depends on how hard. Hillbilly certainly is outside any standard at this point.
Seconds. Dark souls have incredibly easy mechanics, there are no slide around a bush to get increased damage.
third. We certainly have to rework a Killer at some point. Besides like so many have told me in this thread, you can just play a different killer when that happens, yourself.
Should we keep Twins like they are forever cause it makes a few people happy? No this is a game, for many people and if the power is just too bad or too old. Just can it and move on. Its so simple. I used to Main old Freddy, I didnt bat a eye over that.
First: you say its bad design, i say its intended design
second:also billy does have easy mechanics?! chainsaw goe Brrrrrrr! just that they have more nuance to them, same as rolling in Darksouls you cant spam rolls in DS and win !? you have to time them in accordance to a enemy attacks, same with billy if you just rev your chainsaw and expect to land a hit no wonder u suck with billy, timing and when to use your chainsaw is key.
third: but according to most, you are the minority. most people consider hilly billy a very fun killer to play against. you are literally one of the only people in this forum for the billy nerf, your are contradicting yourself
your are one the few people to keep happy?
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379221#Comment_3379221
Listening to the professional Hillbilly players is what caused Hillbilly to be insufferable to play as for any casual player. He is just too hard to play and only hardcore experts play him. Listen instead to the rest of the community who does not play him, ask them why they don't play him. Hillbilly is like Nurse in that regard, completely insufferable to play as except you get mediocre results for your sweat. bHVR could have given him quality of life, change the power. but that would not fly.
Leather face is a much more viable and open to other players kind of Killer, but you have to pay for him.
Like have you seen the gameplay vs a Good Hillbilly? they walking back and forth revving the chainsaw around the same loop for a min and then BOOM insta-down. Its super boring and Im glad I never see a Hillbilly nor have any want to play as them. Hillbilly needs a full rework of his Power and a reduction of addons that show too high a kill rate is a good solution while we wait. Make Hillbilly fun and easier to play instead of gatekeeping him hard.
so you find him boring because you cant counter him? you know you can just leave the loop right? or going in a different direction, seems way more fun to me than doing what bubba does
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i have around 800h with dbd my highest prestige is billy at p25. all my other killers( i have them all except artist and the skull lady) are at p3 with some exceptions( trapper at 10, legion at 9 and deathslinger and huntress both at 5) in truth i find most other killers pretty stale to play as their interactions hardily change at loops either you can dominate a certain loop ( such as trickster with anything waist high) or you can do jack ######### at it( just being trapper) and while mind gaming is certainly an option and all the fun that goes with it. hill billy was the only killer( and blight) where all the old loops changed for me, they became fresh as i tried to learn to curve with them, with only newer possibiltys as i started to explore his add ons( besides the completely worthless ones looking at you belt buckle) if this nerf would go through i fear i may not lose interest in dbd as a whole, the supposed buff to his heat generation is complete useless as the current time is still plenty, as why you would then nerf his abilty to cross the map is ludicrous to me as that was one of his few strengths and in the event of this why are there no nerfs to blight? when he can do this far better? please explain to me these changes and to the small community of billy players.